Anyone got a Surly's Todd the Axe man clone

[theQ]

From what I've seen in 2 tries so far it gets close but is not it.

I didn't raise the temp. I wanted to balance the boil additions, however I think the secret to less harsh bitter finish is reducing the boil addition or even remove them entirely and the water profile, doing this with more CaCl than gypsum inlike regular IPA where is the other way around (if you have RO).

I dry hopped 4 oz per 5 gal (3:1 citra:mosaic), I could do that twice. It gets expensive in a hurry!

When I try this again

• Mash in 152F
• 1/2-1oz Warrior at 90min ( maybe added later 60min)
• Few addition at flameout and then most of them whirlpool at 160F for 20-30mins

I would still use 2 Row Rahr, I don't see much difference between that an Golden Promise and is less expensive.

 

[theQ]

@Hwk-I-St8
"For water, I'd do RO and add gypsum and calcium chloride to get to 150 ppm chloride and 75 ppm sulfate (my standard NEIPA water profile). You'll probably need a couple ounces of acidulated malt to get the pH down. I try to mash at about 5.3."

If my calculations are correct, that is 6gr CaCl and 3gr of gypsum ? Isn't that low ?

 

[eric19312]

Good luck on this project. I've had Axeman maybe 20 times indifferent bars and the brewery and cans. It is an incredibly inconsistent beer. The cans were perhaps a couple months old and terrible--full of hop debris yet no little hop aroma and ugly oxidized brownish color. $16.99 for the 4 pack I was not at all happy. Drinking it in bars I find the bittering is inconsistent as is the aroma. When this beer is good it is fantastic but probably last half a dozen times I've tried it I was less impressed. Most reliable location is the brewery and they don't sell any to go.

 

[theQ]

You need to move to Midwest(Frozen North).

Any hoppy beer needs to be consumed in a timely fashion manner... I never noticed any inconsistency. Before buying check the cans, there should be label on them.

 

[eric19312]

You need to move to Midwest(Frozen North).

Any hoppy beer needs to be consumed in a timely fashion manner... I never noticed any inconsistency. Before buying check the cans, there should be label on them.

I’m only getting Todd in and around Minneapolis. It’s great at Surly but inconsistent elsewhere in the area and I only tried the cans the one time. Was not happy with them and didn’t do it again.

 

[Jayjay1976]

Subbed!

 

[Amadeo38]

Ah yeah, I forgot to mention that I made some of the obvious tweaks needed for an IPA not included in the original recipe, such as 8oz sugar to dry it out, some lactic to drop mash pH, and my typical “hoppy” blend of gypsum and cacl for the mash and sparge water

Update - this batch disappeared really quickly. I think that might be one of he primary indices of whether a homebrew is good or not. The recipe on the first page should definitely mention dropping the grain bill to account for the added sugar needed to dry it out like it needs. Mine even turned out well with a huge pitch of Nottingham yeast cake that didn’t attenuate as much as you’d hope in a IIPA.

 

[Hwk-I-St8]

@Hwk-I-St8
"For water, I'd do RO and add gypsum and calcium chloride to get to 150 ppm chloride and 75 ppm sulfate (my standard NEIPA water profile). You'll probably need a couple ounces of acidulated malt to get the pH down. I try to mash at about 5.3."

If my calculations are correct, that is 6gr CaCl and 3gr of gypsum ? Isn't that low ?

Sorry, I missed this somehow. The 150ppm chloride and 75ppm sulfate are my typical targets for NEIPAs. I've seen people go as high as 200/100, but, from what I've read, it can get minerally if you push it too high.

Shrug...I built those numbers based on stuff I've read combined with some experimentation. I really like the results of that, so other than working up to them, I've never really strayed.

Out of curiousity, what makes you think that's low? What would be more typical from your perspective?

 

[Stpaul81]

I'm going to try my hand at this the weekend.
Not shooting for a prefect clone, just something very similar.
15# Golden Promise
Mash at 152
1.5oz Warrior @ 60
1oz Citra @ 10
.5oz Mosaic @ 10
1oz Citra @ Flameout
.5oz Mosaic @ Flameout

Dry hop 1 oz Citra / .5 oz Mosaic, 2 additions probably in the fermenter 5 days each 3-5 days apart

This will likely yield me something a bit hoppier than Axeman, but thats ok! I might adjust my hop schedule to tone it down, but I'll decide when I get home tonight.

When you dry hop, you have your first go around with the citra and mosaic hops, when you ad the next round of citra and mosaic did you leave the other hops in the beer as well or did you remove the old hops?