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Zekk

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Coffee at work. Slow day for now, then at 3 it'll probably turn into an Overtime day 🤑
 

banesong

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I agree . Rodenbach Grand Cru is the best of the three mentioned. I know I have some Monk's in the fridge but may have either a Duchesse or Rodenbach down the basement. May have to put one in the fridge.



Hrm... Prefer Duchesse over the Rodenbach.


I'm up for a DuffMan food tour, but I need to convince SWMBO that a trip to Philly is something we should do. Maybe I can work the 'the kids should see it, it's really educational' angle on her.
:D. I will get there for a tour at some point!
 

BeerMeDuffMan

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Hrm... Prefer Duchesse over the Rodenbach.




:D. I will get there for a tour at some point!
I should atleast write out some of the details on the tour...incase somebody is in town when I'm not here. Its not going to be remotely as entertaining, but you could still have a good time
 

joshesmusica

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It does it badly. Decoctions are added back to the mash at boiling. How long they are boiled depends on what you want.

But BeerSmith will dramatically underestimate what you need. When I do a decoction I grab double what it told me to, add back slowly while stirring, and in the event I hit temp without adding it all back, then I add it back slowly as it cools back down. But that's seldom a problem.
Decoctions are always assumed to be at boiling temps.

BS is a pure numbers tool and does not seem to account for the large amount of lost heat to the actual process of pulling the decoction. I'm guessing it's modeled on an idealized calorimeter but is harder thing to mathematically model in reality.

Offset the lost thermal energy on two fronts.
1. Main mash can be heated directly to maintain the rest temp from which the decoction is pulled. (I use a very low flame on my MT with the reflectix). No fires yet.

2. As Q mentioned, up the volume of the pulled decoction over what BS suggests. That's something that boils down to experience but typically I'm at about suggested volume +25%. Better to have too much than not enough

It's really not too hard to do. I get enjoyment out of doing these silly mashes

Two things I think I think are worth mentioning
1. The effects of specialty malts added for color seem to be magnified so tailor your recipe acordingly
2. Mash pH seems to clock in a bit lower probably as a result of same. (Very small data set so I may be way off base there)

There is a thread in my sig covering some of what I've learned about step mashes. I might be of use. I am far from experienced at the whole thing but have done my best not to disseminate any misinformation therein. Here is the thread if your on mobile.
Preparing my myself mentally for the big decoction brewday on friday. Trying to get this all processed so I don't feck anything up. I mash in a plastic bucket, usually wrapped in all kinds of ****. It's a 30L bucket, and my first infusion will be 23L at 147F. This will be an est. total volume of 27.3L. So a little bit of headspace there that I could potentially lose a bit of heat to. Also being plastic, and because of the fact that I usually stir my mash every 20 minutes, I usually do lose some heat over the 60 mins. Considering this, should I go more Q's route and go with double the amount that BS recommends for the decoction?

I'll be doing your dunkel Gavin, but with 2 decoctions. One up to beta rest (156F), one up to mashout (168F). Besides that I tried to get as close as possible to all the specifications from your majestic recipe, with the recommendation to bring the carafa down to 2% taken into consideration. I swear, though, that I must have some setting screwed up or something with mine, because your color is always calculated as differently than mine.
 

blizzard

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Preparing my myself mentally for the big decoction brewday on friday. Trying to get this all processed so I don't feck anything up. I mash in a plastic bucket, usually wrapped in all kinds of ****. It's a 30L bucket, and my first infusion will be 23L at 147F. This will be an est. total volume of 27.3L. So a little bit of headspace there that I could potentially lose a bit of heat to. Also being plastic, and because of the fact that I usually stir my mash every 20 minutes, I usually do lose some heat over the 60 mins. Considering this, should I go more Q's route and go with double the amount that BS recommends for the decoction?



I'll be doing your dunkel Gavin, but with 2 decoctions. One up to beta rest (156F), one up to mashout (168F). Besides that I tried to get as close as possible to all the specifications from your majestic recipe, with the recommendation to bring the carafa down to 2% taken into consideration. I swear, though, that I must have some setting screwed up or something with mine, because your color is always calculated as differently than mine.

Have you thought about mashing in your kettle, collecting the runoff in your bucket and then transferring to the kettle to boil?

Heat + plastic makes me worried, especially if you're talking about adding a boiling liquid.
 

drainbamage

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QOTD: Gavin Untaggable - Man of Science, or an ageless wizard moving backward through time?

I'm on the fence.
Why not both?

Another QOTD: what was the first (if any) style where you started drinking commercial examples and finding that you liked your HB efforts better?
 

hunter_le five

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Why not both?

Oooh. Good answer. I hadn't considered that possibility.

Another QOTD: what was the first (if any) style where you started drinking commercial examples and finding that you liked your HB efforts better?
English-style Pale Ales / ESBs. There's a lot of mediocre ones out there (especially American made attempts), and some that I've made turned out amazeballs.
 

m00ps

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Why not both?

Another QOTD: what was the first (if any) style where you started drinking commercial examples and finding that you liked your HB efforts better?
Wasn't until I learned how to treat Belgian yeast properly but I get let down more and more by commercial saisons. By now, as long as they don't have a gross sweet finish I'll drink it. But I've had more $12 drainpours than I'd like to admit

Also commercial double ipas. Same issue, except so many also lack hop character. I only buy stuff that's less than 3 months from packaging. No idea how the hops are so little by then
 

blizzard

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Wasn't until I learned how to treat Belgian yeast properly but I get let down more and more by commercial saisons. By now, as long as they don't have a gross sweet finish I'll drink it. But I've had more $12 drainpours than I'd like to admit



Also commercial double ipas. Same issue, except so many also lack hop character. I only buy stuff that's less than 3 months from packaging. No idea how the hops are so little by then

Most IIPAs are either too sweet or too bitter for me. I love hop flavor/aroma, but can do without all the bitterness and I prefer them to be dry. I was never a huge fan of IPAs until east coast style IPAs became a thing.
 

joshesmusica

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Have you thought about mashing in your kettle, collecting the runoff in your bucket and then transferring to the kettle to boil?

Heat + plastic makes me worried, especially if you're talking about adding a boiling liquid.
I have thought about it. I do BIAB in the bucket, with a batch sparge. If I do that, I won't have the ability to heat up the sparge water. Even with adding the boiling liquid, it shouldn't be raising the temperature of the entire mash anymore than planned. The bucket is rated to be able to hold 80C temps over a long period of time.

My only concern was how much to actually decoct off. Guess this first run will just have to be trial and error. I'll probably go with double the amount like Q suggested.
 

joshesmusica

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Most IIPAs are either too sweet or too bitter for me. I love hop flavor/aroma, but can do without all the bitterness and I prefer them to be dry. I was never a huge fan of IPAs until east coast style IPAs became a thing.
I'm with you. Most commercial IPAs are way too bitter, or way too sweet. I don't do IIPAs at all. I've never really had an east coast style, but I believe the most recent one I had was very similar to that one, and a lot like I make my own IPAs. Because I reduce the bitterness to fairly low compared to OG (yet still technically in the style), then I've just been calling them Imperial Pale Ales. But mine are definitely not super cloudy like those commercial east coast IPAs.

So I would have to go with IPAs. Or possibly ESBs too. I haven't found a commercial ESB that I've liked, but they've either been the most available commercial examples, or crappy norwegian brewery examples. I like the malt to be fairly complex with a balancing bitterness and fairly strong floral aroma from the English hops. Haven't found one example like that yet.

I think I will be able to make a Black IPA better than commercial ones. I almost hit it on my last one, but I got way better efficiency than planned, and ended up at 9.6%. But then the FG was also too high, so it was too sweet. After some tweaks I think I'll have that one down.
 

PianoMan

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Most IIPAs are either too sweet or too bitter for me. I love hop flavor/aroma, but can do without all the bitterness and I prefer them to be dry. I was never a huge fan of IPAs until east coast style IPAs became a thing.
DIPAs are primarily what got me into brewing, but as I've gotten older, not diggen the straight up bitter bombs anymore. Having a harder time distinguishing flavors from the bitter. Had a Dales PA last night..twas perfect!
 

joshesmusica

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Wasn't until I learned how to treat Belgian yeast properly but I get let down more and more by commercial saisons. By now, as long as they don't have a gross sweet finish I'll drink it. But I've had more $12 drainpours than I'd like to admit

Also commercial double ipas. Same issue, except so many also lack hop character. I only buy stuff that's less than 3 months from packaging. No idea how the hops are so little by then
so what are your tricks to the belgian yeast?
 

BrewinBromanite

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Why not both?

Another QOTD: what was the first (if any) style where you started drinking commercial examples and finding that you liked your HB efforts better?

IPA's and hoppy pale ale's, hands down. Never truly understood what a "fresh" ipa was until drinking HB IPA's 2 weeks after bottling. Case in point - was being lazy a couple weeks ago and picked up a Sierra Nevada 12 pack IPA sampler. Sh1t was bottled in January (realized after the fact). Enough said. Thin, bitter beers with next to no fresh hoppy goodness.
 

BrewinBromanite

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IPA's and hoppy pale ale's, hands down. Never truly understood what a "fresh" ipa was until drinking HB IPA's 2 weeks after bottling. Case in point - was being lazy a couple weeks ago and picked up a Sierra Nevada 12 pack IPA sampler. Sh1t was bottled in January (realized after the fact). Enough said. Thin, bitter beers with next to no fresh hoppy goodness.

Edit:

Last beer for the night. A SN Ruthless Rye. View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1460521388.988217.jpg.

Generally very unimpressed with any SN hoppy beer that's not < 2 months old. This pack had torpedo, which I do enjoy when fresh, experimental 5 hop, and hop hunter. None in this pack at ~ 3.5 months old are anything to brag about. The last of the bunch - the ruthless rye, is the sole exception. Still tastes solid. Which made me remember why I bought this pack to begin with, since it's the only place I've seen it this year, and haven't seen it as a stand-alone pack. Rant over. Old SN beer bad, Ruthless RyePA still decent. Goodnight...
 

iijakii

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I can't recall ever being impressed by a single SN beer. Maybe I'll try one if I see a fresh date to check if that was the issue.
 

BrewinBromanite

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I liked SN pale and torpedo a lot in my "very" early days of getting into hoppy beers. Then, my first good HB IPA attempt made me think I was a brew-God, in comparison to that stuff. If you get it really fresh, it's very ordinary/decent...by a few months old, all tastes like the same crap to me. In addition to their sampler ipa pack, I bought some of their tropical ipa, also not real fresh - all tastes the same to me. For whatever reason, I still like their Ruthless Rye, even after several months old. Not as one dimensional as a lot of theirs.
 

Helly

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Morning friends. Coffee at work. My son and wife were feeling well enough to be left at home so that's good. I hope they're back to full strength later this week. No beers last night. Beers are in the forecast for tonight.
 
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