7 Gallon Conical - Looking for help on dumping trub

[NeoBrew]

I now have 4 brews through my 7 Gl SS Brewtech Unitank. It's been a great addition to my process. It does seem to be more work for fermenting and cleaning than glass carboys, but provides me lots of options for oxygenation, dumping trub, anti-oxygen control, testing gravity easily, and it looks really cool! I'm using a makeshift glycol setup using a chest freezer for now. It works well enough to let me control fermentation temp and crash into the low 40's.

I've been struggling a little bit with getting a full 5 gallon batch into a keg. Each one of my beers has come up short, one by almost half! I certainly can start brewing slightly larger batches to balance out and get a full batch, but I feel like I am probably doing something wrong. I currently shoot for 6 gallons into the fermenter. One of my short batches was 5.5 due to a brewing efficiency issue.

I believe my waste is coming from dumping trub and clearing the beer. I'm looking for some tips on when and how I should be doing this.

The SS Brewtech quick start guide suggests dumping trub 48 hours after fermentation starts. I have not done that yet because I'm worried about dumping out my active yeast. Thoughts?

I don't have much guidance on dumping trub later in fermentation. (I have not been attempting to recover yeast yet, one thing at time!) What I have been doing is waiting for the beer to finish fermentation and get to final gravity. At about one week (I've been doing ales) I have been spunding to only about 2psi just to keep oxygen out. I let it sit about 2 more weeks to clean up and settle the yeast. I then dry hopped before letting it sit 3-5 days and then cold crashed for another 5 days.

At this point I have been dumping the trub. I am not quite sure what I'm looking for here. The first time I did it I dumped way too much as the gunk just kept on coming. This was my 2 1/2 gallon yield. In my last batch I only dumped about a quart. This was the thick trub and I stopped as soon as any liquidy beer started running even though the liquid was very cloudy. I hoped this was enough to get the trub below the racking port.

When I went to rack to the keg I had to turn the racking port slighly up to get clear beer to run. I pressure transferred at 2-4 psi. I stopped when the racking port started gurgling. I ended up with about 4 1/2 gallons this time. After the conical was empty there was still a full load of trub up to the racking port. It was also quite thick and compacted, which I'm sure is why it is not flowing out the dump valve when I need it to.

So, what am I doing wrong? Any help is greatly appreciated.

 

[Blazinlow86]

I found doing multiple dumps wasted alot of beer also. I only do one dump after I've cold crashed immediately before carbing with the carb stone. I don't bother harvesting yeast so it works great as the dump is pure trub/yeast at that point. Comes out cream color. Cheers

 

[Bent-Brewer]

I'm only 3 batches in with it, but haven't needed to dump trub at all. I pulled the coils after I was no longer getting beer out, and I still had a good inch or so of liquid before hitting the trub.

 

[Blazinlow86]

I'm only 3 batches in with it, but haven't needed to dump trub at all. I pulled the coils after I was no longer getting beer out, and I still had a good inch or so of liquid before hitting the trub.

Are you carbing in your fermentor? I've always assumed that without a dump it would probably stir up all the sediment. I've never tried it that way however. Cheers

 

[Bent-Brewer]

Unfortunately I haven't tied the carb stone yet - my existing CO2 lines are too narrow and I haven't bothered getting some to fit the barb. I've naturally carbonated after a few days into fermentation, but that's it. The beer came out clear enough considering I can't cold crash as well as I'd like (jugs of ice in a cooler will get me down to about 48). Still, no issues with the trub.

 

[mongoose33]

Why are you dumping the trub? Is it to bring the level of trub below the racking arm so you don't suck trub out along with the beer?

Before I bought my conical (March 2018), I brewed about...oh, 50 or so batches in plastic Bigmouth Bubbler fermenters. Every single batch sat on the trub until I racked it off.

Now, with the conical, I have only dumped trub intentionally once, and that was to ensure the racking arm was above the trub layer.

There are people who argue that beer sitting on a trub layer is a good thing. I haven't seen any downside to it (exception: long secondary fermentation), and I think it actually is helpful for the yeast and the flavor. There's a sort of expectation that if you let the beer sit on the trub for a month or more you may pick up some grassy flavors from the hops, but I'm guessing you wouldn't have that beer in the fermenter for more than maybe 2 weeks.

I also have not tried to harvest yeast; I will at some point just to learn about it, but it seems easier to just buy a package of yeast, make a starter, and go.

 

[Blazinlow86]

Why are you dumping the trub? Is it to bring the level of trub below the racking arm so you don't suck trub out along with the beer?

Before I bought my conical (March 2018), I brewed about...oh, 50 or so batches in plastic Bigmouth Bubbler fermenters. Every single batch sat on the trub until I racked it off.

Now, with the conical, I have only dumped trub intentionally once, and that was to ensure the racking arm was above the trub layer.

There are people who argue that beer sitting on a trub layer is a good thing. I haven't seen any downside to it (exception: long secondary fermentation), and I think it actually is helpful for the yeast and the flavor. There's a sort of expectation that if you let the beer sit on the trub for a month or more you may pick up some grassy flavors from the hops, but I'm guessing you wouldn't have that beer in the fermenter for more than maybe 2 weeks.

I also have not tried to harvest yeast; I will at some point just to learn about it, but it seems easier to just buy a package of yeast, make a starter, and go.

Interesting you don't dump your trub mongoose. That and the ability to carb in the fermentor are the main reasons I bought mine. Not in a smartass way but may I ask what reason you upgraded? Cheers

 

[mongoose33]

Interesting you don't dump your trub mongoose. That and the ability to carb in the fermentor are the main reasons I bought mine. Not in a smartass way but may I ask what reason you upgraded? Cheers

Carbing in the fermenter and controlling oxygen ingress were two big reasons. I can pressure-transfer to a purged keg, and it's as close to perfect in terms of limiting oxygen from fermenter to keg as I can imagine. The lines are purged, I'm pressure transferring w/ about 13 psi in the fermenter, and a lower-pressure spunding valve on the keg.

I also liked the temperature control options, though as it turns out, it's not that great. I'm in the process of finding ways to insulate the fermenter to better isolate it from ambient.

The problem I have with dumping trub--and unless you leave the beer on it for a long time, I don't think it's harmful--is that I end up with beer in the conical part of the fermenter below the racking arm. And I can't get at it!

I thought that at some point I might be harvesting yeast, but I haven't tried it, I've had all these electric brewing upgrades I've been doing distract me.

************

I have a theory on making excellent beer, and I've been trying to follow it as much as possible. It's that small improvements in making the beer--improvements that are largely imperceptible--will, together, add up to something that *is* perceptible. And good.

It's something I wondered about as I read Brulosophy experiments. Most of the time, it seems, they show no difference between the two beers. I think that has a lot to do with the ways they constitute their tasting panels, but I also considered that perhaps there was a difference but it was too subtle for most to pick up on.

Imagine the perceptibility limit is 1.0. You do an experiment, and improve the beer .8. That's not enough for people to notice. But you do several process changes, which have .8, .7, .3, and .9 improvements. Add that up and you get 2.7, which *is* enough to notice, taken together.

I can't show you any evidence for this at all, but the belief in the idea has led me to implement every best practice I reasonably can--and make other improvements as make sense to me.

I figured my conical fermenter would allow some of that to happen. I can control temp better, I can eliminate oxygen ingress when crashing, I can partially carb before racking, I can rack with, as far as I can tell, virtually NO oxygen entering the equation. If I changed just one of those things, I might not be able to tell a difference. But doing them all, I think it's an improvement.

Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

[Blazinlow86]

Carbing in the fermenter and controlling oxygen ingress were two big reasons. I can pressure-transfer to a purged keg, and it's as close to perfect in terms of limiting oxygen from fermenter to keg as I can imagine. The lines are purged, I'm pressure transferring w/ about 13 psi in the fermenter, and a lower-pressure spunding valve on the keg.

I also liked the temperature control options, though as it turns out, it's not that great. I'm in the process of finding ways to insulate the fermenter to better isolate it from ambient.

The problem I have with dumping trub--and unless you leave the beer on it for a long time, I don't think it's harmful--is that I end up with beer in the conical part of the fermenter below the racking arm. And I can't get at it!

I thought that at some point I might be harvesting yeast, but I haven't tried it, I've had all these electric brewing upgrades I've been doing distract me.

************

I have a theory on making excellent beer, and I've been trying to follow it as much as possible. It's that small improvements in making the beer--improvements that are largely imperceptible--will, together, add up to something that *is* perceptible. And good.

It's something I wondered about as I read Brulosophy experiments. Most of the time, it seems, they show no difference between the two beers. I think that has a lot to do with the ways they constitute their tasting panels, but I also considered that perhaps there was a difference but it was too subtle for most to pick up on.

Imagine the perceptibility limit is 1.0. You do an experiment, and improve the beer .8. That's not enough for people to notice. But you do several process changes, which have .8, .7, .3, and .9 improvements. Add that up and you get 2.7, which *is* enough to notice, taken together.

I can't show you any evidence for this at all, but the belief in the idea has led me to implement every best practice I reasonably can--and make other improvements as make sense to me.

I figured my conical fermenter would allow some of that to happen. I can control temp better, I can eliminate oxygen ingress when crashing, I can partially carb before racking, I can rack with, as far as I can tell, virtually NO oxygen entering the equation. If I changed just one of those things, I might not be able to tell a difference. But doing them all, I think it's an improvement.

Anyway, that's my story and I'm sticking to it.

Well said. Id like to see Brulosophy do a brew comparison of all the exbeeriments that showed insignificant or whatever results in a single brew. I feel that would show a bigger difference.cheers

 

[NeoBrew]

Why are you dumping the trub? Is it to bring the level of trub below the racking arm so you don't suck trub out along with the beer?

Getting the trub below the racking arm and getting clear beer is the reason so far. I do plan to harvest yeast eventually, but have not gotten to that yet. I tend to agree that leaving the yeast cake in there is not very detrimental to the beer. I used carboys up to now and stopped doing secondaries after the first year.

 

[Blazinlow86]

I definitely agree leaving the beer on the yeast cake isn't a issue. I've just always dumped it a few days prior to racking to get the clearest product into the keg. Before following this process I always ended up with sediment in the kegs and would have to let them settle again after moving or I'd get cloudy pours. Since switching to the conical I can take a keg that's been sitting on tap a month shake it all up and still have as clear a first pour as the last before shaking. Might not matter to most as they just don't move the keg but I like to take kegs to friends etc and have clear drinkable product immediately after taping.cheers