Munich Helles 2011 1st Place HBT- Light lager- Augustiner Lagerbier Hell

[BeerBrent]

i like to leave the primary for 4 weeks. then rack to kegs, force carb. and lager for 4 more weeks. when i make lagers i make a ten gallon batch and keg it into one 5 gallon keg and two 2.5gallon kegs. this is really nice b/c once i crack into that last 2.5gallon keg its been lagering for 2 plus months at that point and is usually the best of the batch.

 

[barhoc11]

I brewed 8 gallons of this on Christmas Eve day, no decoction but used melonoiden malt. After primary, I put 3 gallons directly into a keg which sat for less than a week to lager before putting it on tap. I am a tad over 5 weeks after brewing this and its very clear and the taste is getting better each day. I can only imagine how the 5 gallons that are still lagering will taste! I think the minimum time from grain to glass is 5 weeks so if you want to make a relatively quick lager, try this recipe out. I love that its an easy drinking lager that has actual taste to it, perfect for those people who do not like anything too dark. I plan to bottle up a growler of this to take to a super bowl party.

I highly recommend!

 

[austintxeric]

Here I am 15 days after brewing this up. After 7 days at 51 degrees, my air lock activity had nearly stopped and checking my gravity showed me a reading of 1.028 so I raised the temperature to 62 for a diacetyl rest for 4 days and then I began lowering the temperature over the past 4 days to cold crash. I made a mistake by not taking a gravity reading after the 4 day diacetyl rest I guess. Today I pulled the carboys out to prepare to transfer for lagering for a month. I took a gravity reading today and it was at 1.021. The expected FG should be 1.012. Should I let the carboys warm up to the mid 60s and see if I can get the gravity to drop? It tasted good, although a tad sweet. I couldn't detect any buttery or off flavors. It actually tasted quite clean. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!

 

[dlester]

Here I am 15 days after brewing this up. After 7 days at 51 degrees, my air lock activity had nearly stopped and checking my gravity showed me a reading of 1.028 so I raised the temperature to 62 for a diacetyl rest for 4 days and then I began lowering the temperature over the past 4 days to cold crash. I made a mistake by not taking a gravity reading after the 4 day diacetyl rest I guess. Today I pulled the carboys out to prepare to transfer for lagering for a month. I took a gravity reading today and it was at 1.021. The expected FG should be 1.012. Should I let the carboys warm up to the mid 60s and see if I can get the gravity to drop? It tasted good, although a tad sweet. I couldn't detect any buttery or off flavors. It actually tasted quite clean. Any suggestions are greatly appreciated!

Lagers are slow, and 7-days are not enough time, especially if you didn't have enough yeast. Don't confuse lager yeast with ale yeast. The airlock will slow, but give it time. Sometimes Some yeast is highly flocculant and may have fallen out and is dormant. My Lager did the same once, but I left it at 50F longer and rousted the yeast every day. It took a while, but it came down to 1.012. Check out my yeast rouster below. If you don't have a conical, get to the bottom with a sterilized object to stir up the yeast every day.

Roust your yeast:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f51/rousing-up-sleepy-yeast-portable-co2-charger-348505/

 

[austintxeric]

I pitched a decanted 1 gallon starter split into to carboys so hopefully I had enough yeast. Do you think gently stirring after I get it back up into the low 60s will kick start the yeast again, even after I had cold crashed them for the last 4-5 days?

 

[austintxeric]

I just took another reading after nearly 7 days at 63 degrees and my gravity has dropped to 1.019. Do you think I should give it more time at this higher temperature or do you think it is probably as low as it will go?

 

[borden]

I brewed a slight variant on this 4 weeks ago. I used Wyeast 2565 (Kolsch) at a controlled 61F, letting it rise for the second week to 68F before crashing to 36F for two weeks.

Bottled today and the sample was amazing. I look forward to trying this after it's carbed to get a better idea of its final profile... but very excited based on the crisp, clean, and malty sample I had today.

 

[Barleyman]

I brewed this beer on 2-17-13. On sunday i am gonna put temp up to 69 degrees but my ? is how long at that temp. How long should i put it back at 51 Degrees b4 I cold crash? This is my 1st lager so any advise would b helpful. thanks.

 

[Joe Dragon]

Barleyman,

You don't necessarily have to do a diacetyl rest. Open the fermenter(s), check the gravity and see if you can smell, taste or sense diacetyl in the sample. No butter= no problem and you continue on with the lager fermentation.

I always perform a D-rest but many don't. For me it's approximately one week at the primary temeperature (49-52 for a lager) and then one week at basement temps.

After that you can return the beer to a lager temperature or rack to secondary and age it for as long as you like.

 

[TacoBrew]

So, in retrospect, this beer turned out very clean flavor and clarity-wise, but accidentally using the whole pound of melanoiden has made this thing a malt bomb.

 

[chemman14]

I was looking for a beer to brew with the white labs platinum strain WLP860 Munich Helles Yeast. Any thoughts on this? Also I plan on brewing 5 gallons of this, should I just cut all of the ingredients in half?

 

[balauru_327]

a noob question:
after lagering with gelatin, i must add yeast for secondary fermentation?

 

[Joe Dragon]

a noob question:
after lagering with gelatin, i must add yeast for secondary fermentation?

No need to add more yeast. You'll have plenty in suspension despite your best efforts to clear the beer. Add your sugar water to your bottling bucket, rack on top and then bottle.

 

[chemman14]

I was looking for a beer to brew with the white labs platinum strain WLP860 Munich Helles Yeast. Any thoughts on this? Also I plan on brewing 5 gallons of this, should I just cut all of the ingredients in half?

Any answer to this question for people who have brewed 5 gal?

 

[borden]

Any answer to this question for people who have brewed 5 gal?

I just halved everything, yeah. Tastes great!

 

[chemman14]

I just halved everything, yeah. Tastes great!

Awesome! Thanks man

 

[chemman14]

I am going to get the ingredients for this today. I plan on using the WLP860 Munich Helles Yeast. I cant wait to try it!

 

[JayDubWill]

I was looking for a beer to brew with the white labs platinum strain WLP860 Munich Helles Yeast. Any thoughts on this? Also I plan on brewing 5 gallons of this, should I just cut all of the ingredients in half?

I would cut everything in half except maybe the melanoiden out of convenience since we are talking about 2oz vs 4oz...not a huge difference. I've used melanoiden up to 5% of total grain bill before and it was fine. I've also used WLP860 when it was first released and it's a fantastic yeast. Mild sulfur smell while fermenting in primary, but that is expected. Flocculates well and left a clear, clean beer.

 

[JayDubWill]

Joe...looking at the grain bill a little closer i'm surprised you were using pale malt instead of German Pilsen malt which would be closer to style. Also, why the 90 minute boil? Is DMS a possiblilty with pale malt, or is it that all malt has DMS precursers but pilsen/pilsner malt just has a higher percentage? Anyways, just trying to exapand my knowledge and looking forward to brewing your recipe. I was stationed in Bad Aibling, about 90 minutes south of Munich for six years; Augustiner is my absolute favorite Helles. That is right after Hacker-Pschorr, Andechser, Weihenstephaner, Spaten, Paulaneer, Ayinger, oh never mind...I like them all.

 

[Joe Dragon]

Joe...looking at the grain bill a little closer i'm surprised you were using pale malt instead of German Pilsen malt which would be closer to style. Also, why the 90 minute boil? Is DMS a possiblilty with pale malt, or is it that all malt has DMS precursers but pilsen/pilsner malt just has a higher percentage? Anyways, just trying to exapand my knowledge and looking forward to brewing your recipe. I was stationed in Bad Aibling, about 90 minutes south of Munich for six years; Augustiner is my absolute favorite Helles. That is right after Hacker-Pschorr, Andechser, Weihenstephaner, Spaten, Paulaneer, Ayinger, oh never mind...I like them all.

Hey Jay-DW,

I used to brew a lot of beers with mostly Pilsner malt but I never did care for the intense graininess I experienced. One day I was brewing a Standard American Lager but only had 4 pounds of Pilsner. I used that grain and finished the bill with 2-row.

That SAL won Best of Show out of 94 beers. I haven't looked back and have not brewed a lager with mostly Pilsner since. Several pounds of Pils gives you a bit of the classic Pils flavor and aroma without the graininess.

No reason for the 90 minute boil other than that's just how I roll. 90 minute mash and 90 minute boil. One reason may be that I like to add my hops after the hot break has been established. That means at least a 75 minute boil so I just go 90. No real need.

Love your "favorite" beer selection.

I'm not being cliche or silly when I say- than you for serving our country. My dad served in the Korean War from '50 to '54. I appreciate your efforts.

 

[JayDubWill]

Joe, thanks for the feed back and insight on the pale malt vs pilsner. I'm definitely giving that a shot for my next lagar. It would be asweome if I can cut down the 3 months lagering time to maybe just 2. changing subject, Thank you, it's been an honor to serve. Germany was tough...I lived 30 minutes from Aying, where Ayinger is brewed. Ok it wasn't tough...just blurry . I do remember Ayinger brewery having the biggest pork schnitzels you could find. I'm talking a plate covering size portion on top of a mound of frys. And the beer was pretty awesome too.

 

[chemman14]

Joe, thanks for the feed back and insight on the pale malt vs pilsner. I'm definitely giving that a shot for my next lagar. It would be asweome if I can cut down the 3 months lagering time to maybe just 2. changing subject, Thank you, it's been an honor to serve. Germany was tough...I lived 30 minutes from Aying, where Ayinger is brewed. Ok it wasn't tough...just blurry . I do remember Ayinger brewery having the biggest pork schnitzels you could find. I'm talking a plate covering size portion on top of a mound of frys. And the beer was pretty awesome too.

That is the best!!! MMMM I can taste it now. I hate when you order a schnitzel and it is smaller than my damn hand!

 

[Brewitt]

Sorry for the many times this has been asked in various iterations but I'm a lager newbie and want to make sure I got this right. Here is how I understand the fermentation, lagering and conditioning process:

Cold crash the starter and chill the wort to about 48F, decant spent wort from starter and pitch the slurry with much aeration and agitation. Raise temperature to 51F. (This part I have completed)

Ferment until about 75% complete, about 30 SG points in this case (about 9-14 days), then warm to 65ish. Leave in diacetyl rest for between two days and a week (haven't quite figured that out).

Then step down the temperature about 5 degrees F per day to 39F (about 5 days). Leave at lagering temperature for 2-3 weeks and maybe drop to 34F for the last part of that.

Bottle with the typical addition of sugar but no additional yeast. I'm not sure what temperature to leave this at but I am assuming 51F (Is that correct?). Bottle condition for at least three weeks.

Am I understanding this process or not? Any comments welcome.

 

[JayDubWill]

Brewitt, you described pretty much exactly how I lager my beers. The only thing I do different is I don't cold crash and decant the yeast starter. I generally just swirl the whole 2 liters up and dump it into the wort with both at room temperature. I then stick it in my fermentation chamber (chest freezer with temp controller) already pre-set to 50F and just let it go. I also found I've reached with 10 points of FG in about 4 days. Which generally corresponds to when the kreusen falls, but that's NOT a good indicator. It's at this point that I raise the temp from 50F to 60F at about 2~4 degreees/day for the D-rest. As far as the actual lagering, the colder the better, but it also takes longer. I've got a German Helles that tastes good after 3 months of lagering at 42F, but I'll let it sit another month to mellow out even more. I once read somewhere that for each percentage point of alcohol expect to lager for a month. That seems to be a good rule of thumb in my experience, but I let my taste buds guide me for the most part.

 

[Joe Dragon]

Sorry for the many times this has been asked in various iterations but I'm a lager newbie and want to make sure I got this right. Here is how I understand the fermentation, lagering and conditioning process:

Cold crash the starter and chill the wort to about 48F, decant spent wort from starter and pitch the slurry with much aeration and agitation. Raise temperature to 51F. (This part I have completed)

Ferment until about 75% complete, about 30 SG points in this case (about 9-14 days), then warm to 65ish. Leave in diacetyl rest for between two days and a week (haven't quite figured that out).

Then step down the temperature about 5 degrees F per day to 39F (about 5 days). Leave at lagering temperature for 2-3 weeks and maybe drop to 34F for the last part of that.

Bottle with the typical addition of sugar but no additional yeast. I'm not sure what temperature to leave this at but I am assuming 51F (Is that correct?). Bottle condition for at least three weeks.

Am I understanding this process or not? Any comments welcome.

Brewitt,

Never hesitate to ask questions. I don't think anybody in this thread will have a problem with multiple questions. Lagers are a difficult beer to brew.

Let's see. I follow your procedure pretty closely. If I start my starter several days before brewing I will put it in my normal fridge the night before. Decant it right before pitching. Always pitch colder yeast into warmer wort and then let is warm a few degrees more.

Yeast- 35 degrees, wort- 45 (or so) degrees, pitch and let it rise to 48-51. Let the warming beer activate your yeast and the whole thing takes off nicely. This really keeps the esters at bay and allows the lager yeast to work.

As far as fermentation- We are pretty close but I still use a secondary (and I think you should for a lager). Ferment about a week at 50 degrees, as the fermentation slows, move the beer to a warmer place for your diacetyl rest for 3 to 7 days. If the beer is not clear enough for you feel free to slowly lower the temperature over several days to just above freezing. Don't shock it by quickly dropping the temperature. Rack it to secondary and lager at 38 degrees for as long as you'd like. At least 3 weeks.

Keg or bottle from there and enjoy. You are going to shock your friends with this beer if it's brewed correctly.

Please keep us updated and post pictures when possible. I have 10 gallons recently kegged and I promise to post pictures when we dive in!

 

[Brewitt]

Thank you all for the suggestions. I will likely follow our OPs suggestions for starters, seems he did well with that approach. I'm hopping to shock myself and then my friends. I'm always surprised at just how well my homebrew turns out. Well, there's a mediocre one now and then but mostly I surprise myself. I'm hoping this one is no different. Can't say I have anything to compare it to since I've never tried the beer I'm hoping to clone.

 

[Joe Dragon]

Thank you all for the suggestions. I will likely follow our OPs suggestions for starters, seems he did well with that approach. I'm hopping to shock myself and then my friends. I'm always surprised at just how well my homebrew turns out. Well, there's a mediocre one now and then but mostly I surprise myself. I'm hoping this one is no different. Can't say I have anything to compare it to since I've never tried the beer I'm hoping to clone.

"I will likely follow our OPs suggestions for starters, seems he did well with that approach."

Ha, that's funny...... that OP guy can really brew. :rockin:

 

[Brewitt]

No scoffing at success on my part.

 

[Brewitt]

Final question (yeah, sure): What temperature should I carb at in bottles? 50F, 65F? Thanks for any input. I'm trying to get all my temps and dates figured out since I'm going to be traveling a lot from now til mid July.

By the way, its 5 days and I've dropped from 1.058 (hit that a little high) to 1.023 (about 80% of the way to FG of about 1.014) so I'm starting to push the temp up to 60-65F over a few days. Seems pretty fast but fits with what JayDubWill says.

Gonna be interesting, nice color. Letting the hydrometer sample cool and settle for a taste.

 

[borden]

Final question (yeah, sure): What temperature should I carb at in bottles? 50F, 65F? Thanks for any input. I'm trying to get all my temps and dates figured out since I'm going to be traveling a lot from now til mid July.

From my experience and others' comments, carb temp doesn't really matter as long as it's within the normal "room temperature" range. Regardless of style, I carb at 72F or so--my apartment ambient--and have never had unexpected or unpredictable results, this beer included.

P.S. Encinitas is awesome! My aunt and uncle live and own a small business there. Always have a great time visiting (and stopping by Pizza Port down in Solana Beach).