20% country wine experiment

[carlos]

ok i know im out of my depth here , (as a newb to the whole home brew thing ) but i keep reading about these high alcohol producing yeasts and i just wanna experient and see what they can do
the plan is to make a batch of carrot apple and ginger cider (regular strength ) and with the excess juice raise the og high and use a starter of Gervin High Alcohol Yeast found here
http://www.shop4homebrew.co.uk/?gclid=CLjZlez665ECFQVRMAod_WpMqg
wondering what kind of og i should be starting at ? have read an earlier thread that was about high g beers was talking bout og of around 1.2 should i be looking at this high a level?

 

[chthonik]

carrot apple and ginger cider

Haven't used any of the high alcohol yeasts (yet) but wow!

I love carrot/apple/ginger juice together, and I've made a ginger cyser, but it never occurred to me to use carrots.

Love to hear how this comes out!

 

[carlos]

yeh heard that alot of the commercial ciders use mostly swede or turnip in there brew so figured id try carrot as there cheaper and some bitter apples like granny smith , as you say they juice well together so cant be to bad .
the high alcohol yeasts are used in half strength vodka brews made by a few companies now , but the wine yeast is loads cheaper than buying the kits
im just not sure how much sugar to add as the kits use 8lb but the use water as a base where im using the juice.
will let ya know how it goes
cheers

 

[david_42]

There's no way your juice will have a high enough sugar content to make this work. Most fruits run 5-7% sugar. Your best bet is to make the batch (get an OG), ferment it, then add more cane sugar (1 lb in 5 gallons is about 9 points) and let the fermentation continue. A stepped ferment will also reduce the risk of the yeast cooking itself.

 

[carlos]

cheer for that david , i would have just kept adding sugar till the og got up around 1.18-1.2 never thought of letting the yeast get a hold in there
cheers again

 

[CBBaron]

I believe you can push most yeast further by starting them in a moderate gravity wort and keep adding sugar as it ferments. An article in BYO described how the author made a 22% beer using this method. I don't see why you couldn't do the same with a "wine". I would expect you would need to cellar the wine for a few decades before it is drinkable

I wouldn't start out much above 1.100. Then add a quart of 1 part water 1 part sugar every couple days before the fermentation starts slowing down. You are probably going to want to aerate the additions to help the yeast along also.

Craig

 

[carlos]

mmmmm cheers for the heads up baron
the more i read about the high alcohol yeasts on here the more the words "tastes like crap" keep cropping up , think ill try a batch of the much heralded appfelwein instead
cheers for all your info on this people , i may try this experiment one day but for now think ill stick to drinkable projects
carl

 

[CBBaron]

I think the problem with high alcohol wines is that when you stress the yeasts and increase the concentration of alcohol to that level the fusel(sp) alcohols and other substances produced exceed the taste threshold and contribute to a poor flavor. Most if not all of these flavors will mellow with time but due to the levels of them in a 20% beverage it takes more time. I was exaggerating with decades but it will probably take 2-3 years to get the best results from a 20%+ wine.

I think if you can spare a carboy it might make for an interesting experiment. I would probably just use champagne yeast for the experiment which has a reported tolerance of 18%. The second choice would be the liquid super high gravity beer yeast which you can push past 20% but doesn't like really high starting gravities so you have to feed it. Your "turbo" yeast used by distillers are probably least desirable but you can start with a high gravity must with these yeasts.

Craig

 

[RadicalEd]

Definitely don't use a turbo. They can't take any gravity higher than a decent champagne yeast can, ferment a heck of a lot warmer, and the nutrients are so over-abundant that the resulting wash tastes like crap. Lavlin EC-1118 would do well for you; it's used a lot by distillers these days.

If I might suggest, why not get the best of both worlds and try some apple jack? Some people here aren't too fond of the "D-word", so I won't go further into it here, but I can tell you from personal experience that it is mighty tasty .

 

[Jim Karr]

Another yeast to use for higher alcohol wine is Fermichamp. It comes from South Africa, and I bought it from PI Wine on the East Coast. They have a great website, and they offer tons of advice. Another plus is that Fermichamp won't strip out the color of the wine as it ferments.

Orfy provided me with a recipe for Carrot Wine that I have yet to try. Maybe shoot him a PM.