would you trust a pro brewer who never homebrewed?

[GrogNerd]

researching a question about open fermentation and ran across this article in BYO:http://byo.com/stories/item/1211-open-fermentation-tips-from-the-pros

brewer from Anchor says he's never homebrewed and it struck me as kind of weird.

I know you can get all your technical knowledge at places like UC Davis or Oregon, and I'm sure they have labs where you can gain practical experience

maybe I've had some very tasty brews from pros who've never homebrewed, I don't know. I do know I've had crappy beers from pros who got their start homebrewing. so homebrewing doesn't guarantee success at pro brewing

bottom line is it wouldn't be a deal breaker for me to drink a commercial beer from a brewer who had never homebrewed, it just seemed odd to me for someone like that to get into the business

maybe this belongs in debate forum.

 

[arnobg]

To me it wouldn't make much of a difference whether they home brewed or not. I would definitely take their advice however, the great thing about brewing is that it is a lot of opinion and personal preference anyways.

Would you trust to eat a home cooked meal that a large scale head chef whom has only ever cooked in a large commercial kitchen before made? To me it wouldn't make much of a difference just a larger scale with larger scaled equipment but the same techniques and practices.

 

[Homercidal]

Why would this belong in Debate?

Anyway, yes I'd trust a brewer who has never homebrewed. It may be rare these days, but it's quite possible that after taking college courses or something like that the brewer may have started working in a brewery under the tutelage of some other professional brewer. They probably learned some great things about their methods and their equipment. They were probably too busy working and taking home free beer to really care to do all of the creative things that a homebrewer usually does.

I've been around a few new breweries and I can say that most of them have startup issues with the beer. Even if the brewer was a fabulous homebrewer, it can take time to get the feel for a much larger system and incidents can happen. Hopefully the owner realizes this and doesn't try to sell the ruined batch to re-coupe some of that loss. That kind of thing doesn't reflect well on the brewery, even though it's completely understandable.

Almost all of the breweries like that have gotten WAY better at brewing after a little time and experience.

And people's taste in beer can vary a LOT. What's "bad" for some might be heaven for others. And one place I know is upgrading their system even though I won't personally buy their beer due to Chlorophenols (Plastic, bandaid, medicinal). So someone must be buying their beer.

 

[JonM]

Sure I'd trust him, I'm just puzzled about how that could happen. Like never ever brewed anything in the kitchen or garage? Not even as a UC Davis or Oregon homework assignment? I'm sure there's a perfectly reasonable explanation, but I'm curious, I guess.

ETA: Just read Homercidal's ninja post. That makes perfect sense.

 

[Mainer]

Who never homebrewed? Sure, as long as he/she came up as an assistant brewer. I know plenty of people here in Maine who work for Allagash who have never homebrewed. They started in the warehouse, then moved to the bottling line, then into maintaining brewing equipment, picked up the processes and trades, then moved up to assistant brewers and whatnot. As long as it's somebody who's paid their dues and taken the time to learn the craft, I don't care whether they learned at home or at work.

I mean, I work in fundraising. At work, I put on a hell of a party. But I almost never entertain at home. Why? Because I do plenty of that at work, so it's not fun for me to do it as a hobby, too. I imagine it's the same thing with brewing.

 

[arnobg]

The head brewer of a local brewery here told me he never home brewed once in his life. He did distill at home though and went to college for brewing. After talking with him in person for a while I absolutely trusted things he was saying.

 

[GrogNerd]

maybe "trust" was the wrong way to put it. just thought it was weird a pro never homebrewed

does say in his bio blurb he started on the production line and worked his way up to being 1 of 5 brewers at the company

 

[bucketnative]

I think you might be looking at it backwards... I wouldn't expect most people to take their professional jobs and perform them at home doing their leisure time as a hobby. I don't know too many accountants that work on taxes as a hobby. And, I certainly don't perform materials testing at home for fun. For a pro-brewer, that's the job. I'm sure he has other hobbies that take up his time.

 

[bernardsmith]

I guess I know a city pathologist who never performed autopsies in his home, an astro-physicist who never tried to observe gravity waves from her garage and a marine zoologist who never worked with giant squids in his basement... all quite trust-worthy folk who are acclaimed in their fields...

bucketnative just beat me to the post..

 

[Firewalker11]

I know the head brewers of two local taprooms, one did the UC Davis route then off to Germany, eastern block area, Colorado and Milwaukee to learn the trade. Never made a single gallon at home. Good beer off the tap from the first pint on.

Second was a home brewer since a child, won county and state fair ribbons, we raved over the beer and then opened the tap room. Beer is mediocre at best. One is coming along nicely but haze and off flavors make it impossible to spend $5 for 12oz.

 

[GrogNerd]

of course, there are professions which would not have home-based/amateur origins, but BREWING BEER DOES

yeah, astronauts & surgeons, can't DIY in their backyard, NOT what I'm talking about.

in my case, I knew I wanted to work on computers in the days before there were home computers, by my dad taking me to his work (at the time going to military college) and teaching me BASIC programming, plus my taking computer courses in high school. so I understand someone could find the work they would like to do and gain practical experience in an environment other than their home

 

[JoshuaW]

I spend a lot of time in pro-brewer forums and hanging out with brewers. This doesnt surprise me at all. I think there is a big expectation that pro-brewing has its roots in homebrewing, or that pros must have come up organically from their love of beer and the process. In many cases, assistant brewers (who move up in their career to become head brewers and even open breweries) start in the warehouse, in the taproom, on the packaging line, etc. Breweries are essentially a factory job. In an existing brewery, someone will teach you how to do the tasks they want you to complete, and if you succeed they will teach you more. So why dont these people later get interested and start brewing in their garage? Why would they! Often times they have access to a pilot system, and this is what they do day in and day out. Who would want to come home and work on the weekend?

 

[ajdelange]

A home brewer who has a bunch of friends that are doctors and lawyers who now happens to operate a brewery is a home brewer who happens to operate a brewery. A professional brewer is a different breed of cat. He's had the formal training he needs to be a success in his profession. This does not mean that everyone who studied under Charlie Bamforth is a great brewer nor does it mean that some great brewers haven't come up through home brewing with or without a pass through one of the university programs but in general I'd certainly be more trusting of a guy with the formal education.

Just at the moment the MBAA meetings are thronged with operators who used to be home brewers. I have been asked questions by some of these that have just floored me for example one pair clearly didn't understand the difference between chloride and chlorine. Just in case it's not clear these were "professional" brewers at an MBAA meeting. But then at that same meeting the person who ran the QC lab at a rather well known industry player's operation asked a question revealing utter lack of knowledge as to the role of ATC in a pH meter.

We should probably judge the beer rather the brewer.

 

[AK7007]

But then at that same meeting the person who ran the QC lab at a rather well known industry player's operation asked a question revealing utter lack of knowledge as to the role of ATC in a pH meter.

I'm curious, in what context do QC labs need to play around with measuring the pH of things that are at wildly different temperatures? One would think that any sample they get would be room temp by the time it gets to lab. I understand why you want your scientists to know how the equipment works, but I'm just struggling to think of a situation where this is relevant to them.

 

[ajdelange]

What was under discussion at the time was the fact that the pH of mash shifts with temperature and the fact that each malt has a different temperature 'glide' as I like to call it. The question, as I recall, was as to why I was worried about this as ATC in the pH meter should take it out. That's a pretty naive question. Now as to how this person used pH measurements in her particular lab I couldn't say but if you don't understand how a pH meter works we can't help but wonder what other things you don't understand that might have relevance to the quality of your work. and your product.

 

[HCbrewing]

Dan Carey at New Glarus never home brewed and he makes damn good beer. He went to Davis then trained under someone at a brewery in Germany. I actually think that is a much better path than someone who starts as a homebrewer and teaches themselves how to do it. Not that those guys or girls cant make good beer also.

 

[Natdavis777]

I know my buddy who is a successful brewer (and whom I received a lot of advice and knowledge from) only homebrewed a handful of times with some friends that were in local beer clubs. Other than that, he never owned any homebrew equipment or took interest in the hobby. Started out a a local brewery, became the assistant, moved to another brewery as head brewer (won several awards including some GABF) and finally opened his own place.

I agree, Ive had some pretty bad beers from places that the brewers started out as homebrewers. I wouldnt call it a deal breaker though.

 

[pdxal]

Something else to consider is that someone who graduated, say, from Oregon State's fermentation science program could be about 21 when they graduate and legally have only brewed in the program while they were underage.
+1 to professional brewers not needing homebrewing in their background to make good beers. Perhaps less frequent, but working up through the ranks and only being interested in it as a job would suit someone just fine too.

 

[Firewalker11]

Dan Carey at New Glarus never home brewed and he makes damn good beer. He went to Davis then trained under someone at a brewery in Germany. I actually think that is a much better path than someone who starts as a homebrewer and teaches themselves how to do it. Not that those guys or girls cant make good beer also.

Ding, ding! And his Spotted Cow wins accolades every year!

 

[SeraW]

Might depend a bit on perspective. If you're an artist, it's expected that you practice your craft at home before or while also practicing your craft at your job. If you're in other fields, maybe not. Therefore, how surprising this sentiment would be to somewhat depends on whether or not that person sees brewing as a science or more as an art.

 

[Kee]

I don't know why any good chemist with practical intelligence and attention to detail would not make an excellent brewer.