Water Profile help

[thepicklebrewer]

I could use some help with my water profile for an upcoming brew. I am making almost an exact copy of Cream of Three Crops cream ale. I live in Macungie in the lehigh valley if anyone lives around here that knows the water and can weigh in that would be awesome. Anyway I am worried that our high alk is going to cause me a lot of problems with this light crisp beer. I have a few questions here so please stay with me.

My water profile in ppm looks like this:

Ca 62.1
Mg 22.3
Na 20.7
cl .81
SO4 unknown
HCO3- or total ALK 180

My first question for this weekend should I brew with this water, add about 3 gallons of distilled water to bring everything down a bit, use all spring water to brew with?

What is a good RO system to fix up my water. I really think it is a fine water profile for a lot of darker beers, but for pale or light beers should I change things up?

Is it worth getting an RO system to fix my water for just pale styles or should i just buy 8 gallons of spring water when I want to brew those styles? I only plan to brew them a few times a year. I am mostly a dark beer drinking.

Thanks!!

 

[Gnomebrewer]

Lots of questions.....
Firstly, be careful with spring water. Some of it also has lots of alkalinity (bicarbonate). If the spring water doesn't have it's ion levels listed, don't use it.
Do you have access to RO water at a local store? If you do, use that. Distilled is fine to use with mineral additions, but is generally more expensive.
You could boil your water to remove alkalinity, as you have a high-level of 'temporary' hardness. Boiling, then allowing to cool will theoretically precipitate about 120ppm of your alkalinity (and 40ppm of your Calcium). That leaves a far more manageable 60ppm of HCO3- (which can be countered easily with acid). You'll need to add some Calcium back in to your water (now at 20ppm), either as Calcium chloride or Calcium sulphate (gypsum).

Your water is good for a lot of darker beers, so if that's what you primarily brew there's probably no point in installing an RO system. Only you can really answer that though!

 

[thepicklebrewer]

Lots of questions.....
Firstly, be careful with spring water. Some of it also has lots of alkalinity (bicarbonate). If the spring water doesn't have it's ion levels listed, don't use it.
Do you have access to RO water at a local store? If you do, use that. Distilled is fine to use with mineral additions, but is generally more expensive.
You could boil your water to remove alkalinity, as you have a high-level of 'temporary' hardness. Boiling, then allowing to cool will theoretically precipitate about 120ppm of your alkalinity (and 40ppm of your Calcium). That leaves a far more manageable 60ppm of HCO3- (which can be countered easily with acid). You'll need to add some Calcium back in to your water (now at 20ppm), either as Calcium chloride or Calcium sulphate (gypsum).

Your water is good for a lot of darker beers, so if that's what you primarily brew there's probably no point in installing an RO system. Only you can really answer that though!

Thanks for the detailed reply!! Water is one of those things I need to get a book on and really tackle, but I don't want to invest a ton into an RO system and all the mineral additions which I know I will do once I understand all this!

When you say boil the water is there any length of time that is needed? Once it reaches a boil can I let it cool to say strike water temp and then mash in? Then do the same with my sparge water?

Do you think with my level of hardness it will really affect the beer that negatively? I sort of struggle to understand even in the reading I've done how different levels of minerals affect a beer in relation to the grain bill. If I have high alkalinity am I going to get more bitterness even with 2# of corn in the bill to sweeten things up a bit? Could I add something like Honey malt which would obviously change the beer, but counteract the hardness in the mash?


Thanks again!

 

[Gnomebrewer]

I haven't used boiling to remove hardness (and alkalinity), as my water is very soft to start with. I think you typically boil for about 30 minutes. I'm not sure how cool it has to get before the Calcium carbonate precipitates out, but you will have to rack off the top of the sediment to remove it. I think normal practice is to leave the boiled water overnight to cool. If you ask about it in the 'brew science' forum, you'll get far more information and help.

I think you're confusing hardness with alkalinity. Hardness is referring to the Calcium and Magnesium in the water - you want Calcium, so the harness isn't negative at all. The alkalinity is the problem (and typically comes along with the hardness). We say 'Boil to remove hardness' because it was typically done for this purpose, with removal of alkalinity being a side product. In brewing, removing the alkalinity is the goal (with removal of hardness being the side product). Hope this makes sense!

Alkalinity (and pH) affect far more than bitterness - it's important to be in the correct pH range. Adding corn won't add sweetness - it adds a light corn flavour and thins the body. You can add acid to counter the alkalinity, but with the high level of alkalinity that you have, you'd need a lot of acid. You'll still need some acid to brew cream of three crops even if you use RO water, as the grains are alkaline with regards to target mash pH.

 

[thepicklebrewer]

Clearly I need to do a lot more research hahaha!

For this weekend what do you think I should do? Is this a RDWHAHB kind of thing or should I brew another style till I can get a handle on my water. I don't really want to go to the trouble of building a water profile from scratch right now. Plus I am brewing this for a tailgate and don't want to break the bank while still impressing people with a "did you really make this"

 

[Gnomebrewer]

Get some 10% phosphoric acid. Use 12mL per gallon of brewing water. Add an additional 5mL per gallon of mash water (add to the mash). That should get you in the ballpark.