Walk me through force-carb with Nitro "beer gas" (75/25)

[olie]

Ok, I've got my tank all carbed up using 75/25 (N/CO2) beer gas at 35psi. Now I want to understand how to get it from there into a bottle.

* Lower tank pressure to __?__ serving/bottling pressure while in cooler?
* On Bottling day, apply __?__ psi of { beer gas?, CO2? } to the tank for bottling.
* Put { beer gas?, CO2? } into the bottle before filling?
* Anything else into the bottle?
* How to prevent huge foam-over at bottling time?
* Etc.
* Eventually: Put cap on as normal.

What are the next steps?

Thanks!

 

[WiseEyes]

So, to start with I suppose it is technically possible to force carbonate a beer with beer gas, but the purpose of beer gas is that nitrogen is not soluble in beer. Beer gas is used to dispense at higher pressures for longer beer line runs and for dispensing beer at high pressure with a creamer faucet.

 

[WiseEyes]

Ok, I've got my tank all carbed up using 75/25 (N/CO2) beer gas at 35psi. Now I want to understand how to get it from there into a bottle.

* Lower tank pressure to __?__ serving/bottling pressure while in cooler?
* On Bottling day, apply __?__ psi of { beer gas?, CO2? } to the tank for bottling.
* Put { beer gas?, CO2? } into the bottle before filling?
* Anything else into the bottle?
* How to prevent huge foam-over at bottling time?
* Etc.
* Eventually: Put cap on as normal.

What are the next steps?

Thanks!

Forgive me if I read this the wrong way

 

[WiseEyes]

I guess what your asking is how to bottle a beer on nitro gas. You would definitley need a CPBF or all the nitrogen gas will escape during bottling

 

[olie]

So, to start with I suppose it is technically possible to force carbonate a beer with beer gas, but [...].

Ok so... Step one: depressure the tank and start over force-carbonating it with straight CO2 "like normal"...?

Ok, let's say I did all that. Now I'm back to the original question(s), though.

Oh! And this is why The Big Boys use those little plastic gizmos in the can. Hrmm... is there no way I can get "nitro" in the bottle with "normal" equipment? Are those little plastic gizmos available for bottles in quantities under a zillion?

What's a CPBF? (Is that the fancy name for "plastic gizmo"? )

Thanks!

 

[beersk]

Unless you discover the magic of how Lefthand bottles their Nitro Milk Stout without a widget, I'm not sure if this is possible.

 

[Bobby_M]

I don't think it's possible. Now let's talk about what exactly you were trying to do to see if anything salvageable is possible. You can't fill that bottle and then be able to pour the beer as if it were poured from a nitro system. Nitrogen being practically insoluble means that the bottled beer will only retain some of the Co2 that was dissolved. If you're at 30psi on the beergas, you have 7.5psi of CO2. and 22.5psi of nitrogen.

Even if you vented the keg down to say 7.5psi, which is about right for filling bottles, you'll have something like .1% nitrogen in that beer. It You'll have relatively low carbonation in the bottle and none of the creamy pour. Long story short, nitro beers don't travel without widgets. Left hand bottles are a lie. That's why they are now in cans with widgets.

 

[Transamguy77]

Thanks for posting this because I just got a nitro setup and I was wondering if I could bottle some.

left hand does a decent job but Firestone Walker has had some on nitro in cans and had a way better pour more like Guinness and I don’t remember a widget being in the can.

 

[day_trippr]

Right, I'm pretty sure Firestone Walker's canned stouts don't use a widget.
And they also recommend inverting the can a few times before pouring to produce something resembling "head"...

Cheers!

 

[beersk]

Right, I'm pretty sure Firestone Walker's canned stouts don't use a widget.
And they also recommend inverting the can a few times before pouring to produce something resembling "head"...

Cheers!

They could be the kind of widget that is attached to the bottom of the can like Belhaven uses. And I didn't realize Lefthand had stopped bottling the Nitro Stout and went to cans with a widget. I swear I just saw some of the bottled nitro stout the other day in the store...

 

[TheMadKing]

The big boys bottle/can after dropping in some liquid nitrogen to increase pressure in the can after its sealed and force beer into the widget.

The fine bubbles you get from a draft nitro are simply because the beer was forced through a small hole at high pressure. They have nothing to do with nitrogen specifically, it just happens to be a readily available non-soluable gas that is used to create the high pressure.

So if you're after "nitro head", you should not be asking what you can do to "get nitro in the bottles" you should be asking what you can do to force your beer through a small hole (think 1-3 mm) at high pressure.

The only real solutions for packaged products are either the widget (a ball with a tiny hole that is full of beer and high pressure nitrogen, so when you open the beer, the nitrogen tries to escape and forces the beer out through the tiny hole), or a syringe.

Pour your beer vigorously into a glass, suck up 20ish mL in a small syringe and then submerge the tip of the syringe and shoot the beer back down hard. You'll get the "reverse head" like a guinness pour, and a creamy nitro mouthfeel.

 

[Vale71]

Oh! And this is why The Big Boys use those little plastic gizmos in the can. Hrmm... is there no way I can get "nitro" in the bottle with "normal" equipment? Are those little plastic gizmos available for bottles in quantities under a zillion?

Thanks!

Correct. Also the issue with the gizmos is that they're all too large to fit through a standard bottle's neck which is why all the real nitro beers are packaged in cans. And you'd also need a liquid nitrogen supply to prime the gizmo right before packaging and that's not something one usually has lying around the house...

 

[Jag75]

I've tried multiple times bottling my nitro stouts until I learned it just dont work . I listened to a podcast about some Breweries not using the widgets anymore , just as some of you have mentioned above . It was pretty interesting. If I find it I'll repost it

 

[Jag75]

I believe this is it

https://www.dripsanddraughts.com/04...out-the-widget-using-nitrogen-dosing-systems/

 

[TheMadKing]

I believe this is it

https://www.dripsanddraughts.com/04...out-the-widget-using-nitrogen-dosing-systems/

So that guy doesn't actually understand how widgets work because he explained them wrong, and I'm highly skeptical about their claim of changing the mouthfeel of their beer without a widget. They ARE probably helping with shelf life and soft cans, but simply putting nitrogen into beer won't do anything other than have it come back out