Unrealstic Expectations....

[TasunkaWitko]

Would you say that many home brewers, especially beginners, suffer from this?

For example, you hear about a "pumpkin-spice-chocolate-latte-doughnut-with-maple-glaze-and-cinnamon-sprinkles" porter, or something along those lines, and you religiously follow the recipe, expecting the finished beer to taste exactly like that. Ultimately, however, you discover that instead, you get beer, perhaps with a few hints of that profile. The beer is what it should be, but not what you expected.

I've noticed this among a members of FaceBook hang-outs.... anyone else?

 

[jrgtr42]

I think it's more that a lot of brewers, especially new brewers, tend to want to make unncessesarily difficult brews too early in their "career" - that is to say, without the experience to handle all that. Look at all the noob threads that they have a kit and want to add extra hops, grain, bourbon age and so forth.

 

[johngaltsmotor]

I think most true first timers just want something drinkable. But when they realize that kit was really easy and hard to screw up they think that they're an expert and anything they toss together is going to be world class.

(I'll take a 6er of that beer you mentioned, but only if you can add some bacon to balance the sweetness.)

 

[henchman24]

I think it's more that a lot of brewers, especially new brewers, tend to want to make unncessesarily difficult brews too early in their "career" - that is to say, without the experience to handle all that. Look at all the noob threads that they have a kit and want to add extra hops, grain, bourbon age and so forth.

I was guilty of that. After my 4th or 5th beer I tried to make something crazy thinking it would work... yeah it sucked. I've done some more 'difficult' beers since then and been very successful, but starting out I was trying to make something grand before I knew what I was really doing.

 

[Komodo]

Has anyone ever had one of those crazy beers and it was good? Its my main brewing pet peeve. It should be a law to brew a pale first and don't move on until it's actually good.

 

[Sailingeric]

My first beer- the Orange Mocha Frappachino Beer- was good! :rockin: Just kidding. I just don't get the pumpkin beer craze that lot of people try to do. For me, if I want a flavor other than beer, maybe a little vanilla or coffee to a porter, and I don't want a porter that tastes like I am drinking a cup of coffee, just a hint to complement the porter itself.

The other thing I don't get is people on their second brew doing something with 18 different hops. Maybe I am cautious in my brewing but I like to keep it simple with just a couple hops at most so I can learn the flavor profile of what is going in my beer.

 

[ECBrew]

Would you say that many home brewers, especially beginners, suffer from this?

For example, you hear about a "pumpkin-spice-chocolate-latte-doughnut-with-maple-glaze-and-cinnamon-sprinkles" porter, or something along those lines, and you religiously follow the recipe, expecting the finished beer to taste exactly like that. Ultimately, however, you discover that instead, you get beer, perhaps with a few hints of that profile. The beer is what it should be, but not what you expected.

I've noticed this among a members of FaceBook hang-outs.... anyone else?

I think certain homebrewers suffer from a lot of this, especially considering a lot of homebrewers started drinking those interesting styles that the commercial brewers made which is what got them considering brewing to begin with. Often, they don't realize what the different inputs do for the beer and so expect something like adding pumpkin to the beer to give them pumpkin flavors, not realizing that they are probably after the other spices that make it taste like pumpkin pie. You can extrapolate that thinking to many ingredients and using them properly is more of a learned experience. Some will seek out the knowledge and figure it out while other's won't put in the effort. Anyone searching these forums, or reading tons of brewing books, is sure to find plenty of insight to these types of things and will probably end up the better for it than someone just chatting on a facebook group.
I also see a whole ton of beginner homebrewing equipment being sold on craigslist, probably after those guys realized that sometimes it's easier to just buy the stuff.

 

[mattdee1]

I think a lot of wide-eyed brewing newbs see all these flavor "options" out there, which makes plain-jane traditional styles seem boring, so they set out to do ambitious and/or weird things.

I'm thankful I never caught that bug. I'm on batch #5 and they've all been relatively standard beers.

I understand why people have the urge to create, but I guess years of cooking has taught me the valuable lesson that simple is almost always better. I've bought singles of "specialty" beers before, and some of them have been quite good and interesting conversation pieces. But in brewing my own beer, for all of the time and effort it takes, even if my pumpkin-spice-chocolate-latte-doughnut-with-maple-glaze-and-cinnamon-sprinkles porter turns out as good as is humanly possible, am I really going to want 50-60 bottles of it? Or will I drink 1-2 of them and start wishing I had just gone with a standard porter instead?

 

[aprichman]

It's not too different than people who buy an exercise machine thinking they will get as ripped as pro athletes but end up leaving the machine in the corner and never using it. A lot of times our eyes our bigger than our stomachs so to speak

 

[bobeer]

those crazy off the wall beers are sort of a newer thing to do. When I first started brewing, about 4 years ago, there was not a whole lot past pumpkin beer and breakfast stouts. Maybe some blueberry and random fruit beers, but now you see anything and everything in beer. Back when I first started it was all about just making a drinkable beer that you actually enjoyed. It's easy to cover up a crappy beer with chocolate, bacon, spices, etc, etc... IMO you must first master making a regular gravity, non flavored, beer in order to go all crazy with non-traditional ingredients. I think if new brewers did this they wouldn't have such skewed expectations. However, homebrewing, at its core, is about expression and creating what you like to enjoy. So if that's a crazy off the wall beer then go for it but just get it down first before you try and share! haha.

 

[DoomRider]

I think it's more that a lot of brewers, especially new brewers, tend to want to make unncessesarily difficult brews too early in their "career" - that is to say, without the experience to handle all that. Look at all the noob threads that they have a kit and want to add extra hops, grain, bourbon age and so forth.

^^^THIS!!! I don’t post a lot, but this thread kind of resonated with me. I read a lot of the beginner brewing threads, and most of the time I just shake my head. Many of them (not all) are kind of setting themselves up for failure (or at least mediocre beer). I guess I went into this hobby differently than most, but I wanted to get all the basics down before jumping into more advanced techniques. Heck, I just brewed my 50th batch, and it was my first pumpkin ale. To each their own, but I am glad I can brew a solid Pale, Hefe, Porter, and Stout without fail every time. Consistency is my realistic expectation!

 

[N4teTheGreat]

those crazy off the wall beers are sort of a newer thing to do. When I first started brewing, about 4 years ago, there was not a whole lot past pumpkin beer and breakfast stouts. Maybe some blueberry and random fruit beers, but now you see anything and everything in beer. Back when I first started it was all about just making a drinkable beer that you actually enjoyed. It's easy to cover up a crappy beer with chocolate, bacon, spices, etc, etc... IMO you must first master making a regular gravity, non flavored, beer in order to go all crazy with non-traditional ingredients. I think if new brewers did this they wouldn't have such skewed expectations. However, homebrewing, at its core, is about expression and creating what you like to enjoy. So if that's a crazy off the wall beer then go for it but just get it down first before you try and share! haha.

I blame Dogfish Head for this. While I'm not sure I'd have gone off the deep end with my first brew (currently bottle conditioning) I do appreciate that the guy helping me pick out my first recipe took on look at my Pliny the Elder shirt and said "you're not allowed to try that for your first brew" instead I opted for a dry stout.

I think the furthest I will go will be to eventually play around with hops, big beers and simple additions like coffee.

-- Nathan

 

[tmendick]

For example, you hear about a "pumpkin-spice-chocolate-latte-doughnut-with-maple-glaze-and-cinnamon-sprinkles" porter, or something along those lines,

I would like said recipe....
In all seriousness, have fun with your recipes, remember this is a hobby. I personally like to make off the wall beers because they are things that I can't get at any mediocre liquor store.

 

[henchman24]

IMO you must first master making a regular gravity, non flavored, beer in order to go all crazy with non-traditional ingredients. I think if new brewers did this they wouldn't have such skewed expectations. However, homebrewing, at its core, is about expression and creating what you like to enjoy. So if that's a crazy off the wall beer then go for it but just get it down first before you try and share! haha.

I totally agree with this!

Once I was able to get 'normal' beers figured out and make consistently good beers in a variety of styles, I was able to start mixing it up. I have a few off the wall recipies that I'm refining... for the most part they are working now because I have a solid base to work off of and when something goes wrong I can usually identify it.

 

[blizz81]

I would like said recipe....
In all seriousness, have fun with your recipes, remember this is a hobby. I personally like to make off the wall beers because they are things that I can't get at any mediocre liquor store.

Doughnut's Revenge! (I guess that one wasn't that off-the-wall, I just wanted to include it since doughnuts were brought up by the OP)


Sure, some new brewers bite off more than they can chew. If their failures discourage them, they probably weren't long for the hobby / craft anyways. And trying to brew "difficult" beers can expedite teaching lessons / the learning process for those who want to dive into their failures. Personally, trying to brew a barleywine for our third or fourth extract, partial boil batch jump-started us into full boil (oh god, the unfermentable sugar re: partial boil on that batch), being more meticulous in regards to our details and notes...and the jump-start into full boil nudged us to all-grain...and that nudged us to .....

 

[MannyEdwards]

I think most true first timers just want something drinkable. But when they realize that kit was really easy and hard to screw up they think that they're an expert and anything they toss together is going to be world class.

(I'll take a 6er of that beer you mentioned, but only if you can add some bacon to balance the sweetness.)

Ya, I did that. I had a kit that turned out delicious, and so then I started tweaking and substituting, and I got a beer that wasn't anything according to any style that I could tell. I had some experienced brewers confirm that, by the way.

I'm still in the first few weeks of AG brewing, and I'm still amazed every day how many factors affect the outcome. It seems a lot more complicated than cooking, and I'm pretty demanding when it comes to meal time.

 

[bobeer]

I blame Dogfish Head for this. While I'm not sure I'd have gone off the deep end with my first brew (currently bottle conditioning) I do appreciate that the guy helping me pick out my first recipe took on look at my Pliny the Elder shirt and said "you're not allowed to try that for your first brew" instead I opted for a dry stout.

I think the furthest I will go will be to eventually play around with hops, big beers and simple additions like coffee.

-- Nathan

Coffee, chocolate, vanilla, oak, liquors, fruit peels, etc... are all good ways to start mixing it up. Cheers man

 

[beernutz]

Walk before you run imo.

 

[Paps]

Would you say that many home brewers, especially beginners, suffer from this?

I've noticed that it's a far greater problem amongst employers,
especially from those that pay minimum wage or less.

I remember ages ago when i was a taxi cab driver, my employer told me
"Stop telling me that you can't be in 2 locations at the same time."
(apparently the comprehention of `physically impossible` was beyond his grasp)
to which i replied
"There's an easy was for that to happen......STOP asking me to be in 2 places at the same time."

Perhaps i just need to get some licensing so i can just make brew/get people drunk for a living.

 

[cannman]

Sure.

And then if they follow their dreams through discouragement, they will learn that they will learn about sanitation, water, pH, mashing, temps, etc etc etc etc etc.