Tropical Stout help

[DonT]

I'm thinking of brewing a Tropical Stout type beer and would like to get folks opinions/suggestions on the recipe. I had a commercial brew last year called Motor Oil from Alvarado St. that was quite tasty that I would like to recreate. The issue with that is I'm working from memory and if I asked, they probably would have a hard time helping as it's one of those recipes that changes every batch.
I'd like to make something with a low roastiness, sweet and fruity with pineapple.
So here is what I came up with....

#4 Pale malt
#4 Marris Otter
#2 Caramunich II
#1.5 flaked Oats
#1 Simpsons DRC
#.5 Carafa II
#1 Dememera Sugar

.25 oz Magnum @ 60
2 oz BRU-1 @ flameout
1 oz Citra @ flameout
1 oz Sabro @ flameout

#2 lbs? Crushed Pineapple
2 Vanilla Beans

Considering Voss Kviek or 1318

SG = 1.070
ABV ~ 7.5%

The BRU-1 is pineappley and the Sabro is coconutty so there might be a little Pina Colada thing going on....

What do you think?

 

[Dr_Jeff]

Consider replacing the Dememera Sugar with molasses

 

[DonT]

Consider replacing the Dememera Sugar with molasses

I've never worked with molasses, what flavors would that impart?

 

[Dr_Jeff]

It's hard to describe, although I always add it to an old ale and to most stouts that I brew.
I've even used Jaggery, which is a dried date palm molasses.

 

[Dgallo]

@aharri1 this style is your jam

 

[aharri1]

@aharri1 this style is your jam

If you use crushed pineapple make sure to heat it up 150 to 170° for 20 min to pasteurize, and I would add it to secondary for the most flavor. Personally, hornindal kveik has the most tropical flavors if you're going in that direction. If not, on my last two tropical stout brews I've used Omega dipa 052 and have loved it. It seems to help accentuate the fruit forwardness. I believe two vanilla beans will be good for sure. If you want to make them last longer you can do what I do and make a small extract with them in like a two or four oz container and just break them in half. Soak them in vodka or any neutral liquor with a proof of 80 or higher. 100proog would be faster, but I wouldn't go higher than that. I usually like to buy the beans in bulk and make a pint jar of strong extract so I can add it as I like to certain brews. Also, I usually use a pound of brown sugar with 10 minutes left. This was my latest grain bill I brewed with. The Hops you're using makes sense. I used Cascade to bitter and samba hops in Whirlpool.

 

[DonT]

Interesting. How is the roasted barley in there? Does it impart much roastiness?
I plan on doing most of what you described there. I usually don't do a secondary but I think this calls for it.

 

[Dr_Jeff]

A stout really needs the roasted barley to give it the flavor it needs to be a stout.

 

[DonT]

A stout really needs the roasted barley to give it the flavor it needs to be a stout.

Of course. According to BJCP style guide, tropical stouts have low roastiness (Mind you, I've never brewed a tropical stout before). The recipe I put together doesn't have any roasted grains except the carafa II, and that's supposed to be de-bittered. So I was wondering about the roast level... at only 4oz. probably just a bit...

 

[couchsending]

Do you want to make a Tropical Stout or a Stout with tropical fruit? They are two different beers.

 

[madscientist451]

I expect they used some kind of pineapple flavoring, fermented pineapple really isn't all that great....
I'd make an American Imperial Stout and then start tweaking it to get the taste you are looking for.

 

[couchsending]

Nuts.com

Freeze dried Pineapple if you want pineapple in beer

 

[TheMadKing]

Consider replacing the Dememera Sugar with molasses

@DonT I don't think I can disagree with this more strongly. Molasses will overwhelm a beer and is way too much for a tropical stout. It imparts the clear and dominant flavor of molasses. I would go with Belgian Candi Dark 180SRM or invert sugar. Demamera sugar is also a good choice. Dark refind sugars have a more complex subtle flavor, and gives you a hint of that molasses taste without punching you in the face with it.

You need more roasted malt I think, because you still need to have some present to call it a stout, but it should be smooth and not harsh. I've made several tropical stouts and I have had the best luck with cold steeping 1lb of roasted barley in 1 & 1/2 quarts of water and adding it to the last 10 min of the mash. You get roast but it is smooth and easy

As far as the fruit and tropical flavoring goes, that sounds nasty to me when combine with a stout. Pineapple is very acidic and combining that with roast and caramelly taste and vanilla? blech

Tropical stouts are not tropical because they contain tropical fruit flavors. They are tropical because they are replicas of british export stouts that were brewed in the tropics using locally available ingredients (specifically high percentages of sugar, and lager yeast). I would personally recommend against trying to combine fruity and roasty flavors. If you wouldn't want that flavor in your coffee, then you probably don't want it in your stout either

Here is my recipe that I have posted to the recipe database, scored a 43 and a 41 in two separate competitions

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/whats-that-jamaican.656584/

 

[MaxStout]

Following this thread because I'm a big fan of Lion Stout, and I haven't seen it in stores for years.

There's this recipe, from @Revvy, though I haven't brewed it.

 

[DonT]

I don't think I can disagree with this more strongly. Molasses will overwhelm a beer and is way too much for a tropical stout. It imparts the clear and dominant flavor of molasses. I would go with Belgian Candi Dark 180SRM or invert sugar. Demamera sugar is also a good choice. Dark refind sugars have a more complex subtle flavor, and gives you a hint of that molasses taste without punching you in the face with it.

I tend to agree with this... I think I'll stick to sugar.

You need more roasted malt I think, because you still need to have some present to call it a stout, but it should be smooth and not harsh. I've made several tropical stouts and I have had the best luck with cold steeping 1lb of roasted barley in 1 & 1/2 quarts of water and adding it to the last 10 min of the mash. You get roast but it is smooth and easy

I think I will need to add additional roast... I just looked up the beer I remember having on Untappd. Someone described it as "sugary coffee and pineapple upsidedown cake" That's exactly what I remember it to be...

It's Motor Oil #9 if anyone is curious

 

[DonT]

I found this....Make Your Best Tropical Stout

And the recipe.... Marathon Foreign Extra Stout

If anyone is interested...

 

[TheMadKing]

I found this....Make Your Best Tropical Stout

And the recipe.... Marathon Foreign Extra Stout

If anyone is interested...

I'm immediately suspect of any recipe calling for new world hops for fruity flavors

Per the style guidelines "Moderate to high fruity esters. Can have a sweet, dark rum-like quality. Little to no hop flavor."

If it tastes good that's great, and I'm not one to hide behind style guidelines at the cost of making good beer, so that's really what's important. I just like accurately decribed beers

 

[DonT]

If it tastes good that's great, and I'm not one to hide behind style guidelines at the cost of making good beer, so that's really what's important. I just like accurately decribed beers

Exactly! I'm not trying to brew to style, just make a tasty beer I had earlier this year.
And that article was written in 2016 so yeah, Citra is a New World Hop....lol

 

[Knightshade]

I've made this once, it is on my list of beers to make again. Was very enjoyable.

https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/416009/broken-shoestring-stout

 

[Alan Reginato]

Hi! I'm just trying to give another point of view.

Earlier this year, I brewd a single hop Dark Saison. It's still maturing. I usually wait 3 months before opening. With less than half the ingredients in your recipe, at bottling I was a little confused by the tasting notes.
Many different flavors coming from that sample.

Use special carafa if you want something with a low roastiness. It's debittered, huskless or something like that.

Cut the vanilla and pineapple. There are already many flavors in your beer, due to the flame out additions. And that will only complicate things. I'm talking about sanitization and stuff.

A neutral yeast can be good here too. US 05, Nottingham ...

Anyway, I think it will be a great beer. Good luck! And tell us how it turned out!

 

[JimRausch]

I've even used Jaggery, which is a dried date palm molasses.

Jaggery is an ingredient listed in Lion Stout, which, in my opinion, is THE standard for a Tropical Stout. I consider this to be my 'White Whale'. I've come close, but it's not there yet.

 

[InspectorJon]

Alvarado Street is kind of known for its thick sweet flavored stouts. A tropical flavored pastry stout is probably a better description of what the OP is looking for.

I asked the brewer at Alvarado Street about one of their pastry stouts called Nunca Muerto a few years ago and this was his reply:

Glad you liked it!

I'm on a plane right now and don't have access to the recipe, but if I recall, percentages were roughly 8% for roasted grains (carafa and pale chocolate) and about 4-5% each on dark crystal and drum roasted crystal. Flaked barley around 10%, rest 2-row. There was some dark candi sugar used as well - around 10% of the grist sugars.

OG was around 33ish, finished around 13 or so. Boiled for 5-6 hrs to get it that high without adding DME or LME. We mashed low, around 145, to make sure our wort sugar composition was as simple as possible to get it to "dry" as far as it could go. With these stouts they can stall rather high and leave you with a beer that's unpalatable (but good barrel candidates).

 

[Miraculix]

I'm immediately suspect of any recipe calling for new world hops for fruity flavors

Per the style guidelines "Moderate to high fruity esters. Can have a sweet, dark rum-like quality. Little to no hop flavor."

If it tastes good that's great, and I'm not one to hide behind style guidelines at the cost of making good beer, so that's really what's important. I just like accurately decribed beers

I brewed a pale mild recently with verdant ipa yeast. Came out a bit on the edge regarding fruity esters as I did not control the fermentation temperature, but I think if I would have added a bit more malt plus some roasted barley, this would have gone through as a marvelous tropical stout. Higher fermentation temperature, homemade invert plus verdant were the factors I assume to be the reason for these elevated fruity ester levels.

 

[DonT]

Alvarado Street is kind of known for its thick sweet flavored stouts. A tropical flavored pastry stout is probably a better description of what the OP is looking for.

I asked the brewer at Alvarado Street about one of their pastry stouts called Nunca Muerto a few years ago and this was his reply:

Glad you liked it!

I'm on a plane right now and don't have access to the recipe, but if I recall, percentages were roughly 8% for roasted grains (carafa and pale chocolate) and about 4-5% each on dark crystal and drum roasted crystal. Flaked barley around 10%, rest 2-row. There was some dark candi sugar used as well - around 10% of the grist sugars.

OG was around 33ish, finished around 13 or so. Boiled for 5-6 hrs to get it that high without adding DME or LME. We mashed low, around 145, to make sure our wort sugar composition was as simple as possible to get it to "dry" as far as it could go. With these stouts they can stall rather high and leave you with a beer that's unpalatable (but good barrel candidates).

Yeah, Motor Oil #9 was about 12% but I don't want to go that high. Looks like I got close-ish to the grain bill though....