I think this is the most unclear, unspecific debate I see on HBT, so I would hope a few people from the 4-week-primary crowd will specify a few steps in their process. I'm not calling anyone out, so anyone is free to answer.
Above, somone noted that Jamil leaves his beer on the yeast (I think this is easier than calling it a "primary") for no more than about two weeks. I believe that is correct. I've listened to many hours of Jamil's radio shows, and he has said mutiple times, the most important upgrade a brewer can make is going to a full wort boil. The second upgrade should be fermentation control. Not all-grain, not a conical fermenter, not even a wort chiller; fermentation control. The number of days in a primary (be it 10 or 28) barely scratches the surface of a perfect, controlled fermentation.
So:
1.) How do you control fermentation temperature? In other words, do you sit a bucket in a "stable" closet for 4 weeks? Do you drape a wet towel over a carboy? If you can not heat up the carboy/bucket as fermentation slows (I am talking fermentation here, not conditioning), how do you perform a Diacetyl rest? Maybe you ferment in a dedicated fridge. Are you monitoring the air temperature of the fridge, or the temperature of the liquid as fermentation is happening?
2.) How appropriate is your yeast pitch? Is the yeast fresh? Have you followed a yeast pitch calculator? Do you make a starter? If so, is it on a stir plate? Do you use dry yeast? If so, do you rehydrate or just sprinkle on top. Finally, what strain of yeast do you typically use? Does it take 4 weeks to fall out of solution (like US-05), or does it drop like a rock (like WLP007)?
3.) How do you sanitize your equipment? Are you using a bleach and rinse? One-step? PBW for cleaning and Star-san for sanitizing?
It should be obvious that I am trying to conclude that people who advocate the 4+ week primary are following an OUTSTANDING fermentation procedure, creating the best possible scenario to produce award winning beer, and have found that 4 weeks of precisely controlled fermentation/conditioning has yielded better results than a more "commercial style" 7-10 days of precisely controlled fermentaion/conditioning.
.....otherwise, those who question the merits of an extended primary will continue to argue that it is simply a solution to a problem; a problem that could have be avoided had a superior procedure been in place.
For the record, over the past 2 years, I have sat on both sides of the fence - 2 weeks/ 4 weeks, secondary/ no secondary, heat-controlled fermentation/basement floor, and my process is still evolving. The little upgrades and tweaks are the best part of this hobby.
I look forward to your replies, and continuing the conversation.
Joe
Above, somone noted that Jamil leaves his beer on the yeast (I think this is easier than calling it a "primary") for no more than about two weeks. I believe that is correct. I've listened to many hours of Jamil's radio shows, and he has said mutiple times, the most important upgrade a brewer can make is going to a full wort boil. The second upgrade should be fermentation control. Not all-grain, not a conical fermenter, not even a wort chiller; fermentation control. The number of days in a primary (be it 10 or 28) barely scratches the surface of a perfect, controlled fermentation.
So:
1.) How do you control fermentation temperature? In other words, do you sit a bucket in a "stable" closet for 4 weeks? Do you drape a wet towel over a carboy? If you can not heat up the carboy/bucket as fermentation slows (I am talking fermentation here, not conditioning), how do you perform a Diacetyl rest? Maybe you ferment in a dedicated fridge. Are you monitoring the air temperature of the fridge, or the temperature of the liquid as fermentation is happening?
2.) How appropriate is your yeast pitch? Is the yeast fresh? Have you followed a yeast pitch calculator? Do you make a starter? If so, is it on a stir plate? Do you use dry yeast? If so, do you rehydrate or just sprinkle on top. Finally, what strain of yeast do you typically use? Does it take 4 weeks to fall out of solution (like US-05), or does it drop like a rock (like WLP007)?
3.) How do you sanitize your equipment? Are you using a bleach and rinse? One-step? PBW for cleaning and Star-san for sanitizing?
It should be obvious that I am trying to conclude that people who advocate the 4+ week primary are following an OUTSTANDING fermentation procedure, creating the best possible scenario to produce award winning beer, and have found that 4 weeks of precisely controlled fermentation/conditioning has yielded better results than a more "commercial style" 7-10 days of precisely controlled fermentaion/conditioning.
.....otherwise, those who question the merits of an extended primary will continue to argue that it is simply a solution to a problem; a problem that could have be avoided had a superior procedure been in place.
For the record, over the past 2 years, I have sat on both sides of the fence - 2 weeks/ 4 weeks, secondary/ no secondary, heat-controlled fermentation/basement floor, and my process is still evolving. The little upgrades and tweaks are the best part of this hobby.
I look forward to your replies, and continuing the conversation.
Joe