Switch options to control 5500W element

[MmmmBeeeerrrr]

Just getting into e-brewing and gathering parts. I've read lots of posts and am curious about the practicality of controlling the 5500W element with a three way switch. It seems that I've seen that with the element wired 240v will bring 12gal of water to a boil, and with it wired with 120v will maintain a boil.
I like keeping things simple and would like to find a three-way switch that will in one position run the element 240v, a middle position of OFF, and a third position running the element at 120v.
While I am digging around reading & looking, if anyone knows of a switch or has an opinion wether this is a good idea or not please let me know.

 

[iijakii]

It seems that I've seen that with the element wired 240v will bring 12gal of water to a boil, and with it wired with 120v will maintain a boil.

Nope, running it at 120v is nowhere near powerful to maintain 12gal at a boil.

 

[BrunDog]

I agree. This will not work - someone would have done it already if so. That said, you could probably get away with a combination of 2 elements. But that's not more simple. For single vessel, the EZ Boil is probably the best route. Its simple because the name says so! But seriously it is.

 

[doug293cz]

Here's about the simplest design that you can do with the EZBoil (DSPR120.) If you don't need the pump control circuit, you can delete that, and connect terminal 9 of the DSPR120 to line2 (since the DSPR can use 120V or 240V power.) You'll need a second 1A fuse for line2. If you delete the pump circuitry, you only need to have a 3 wire (G - H - H) power cord for the control panel.



Brew on

 

[wilserbrewer]

12 gallons will boil well with a 4500 w element in a 20 gallon kettle on 240v.

 

[doug293cz]

12 gallons will boil well with a 4500 w element in a 20 gallon kettle on 240v.

OP was talking about switching a 5500W element between 240V and 120V, and at 120V you only get 1/4 the power you get at 240V (P = V^2 / R, and R is constant.) So at 120V, OP would only have 1375W, which won't boil 12 gal. A lot of electric brewers run their 5500W elements around 60% (or 3300W) for the boil.

Brew on

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

Why are you looking to switch to 110?

 

[BrunDog]

Why are you looking to switch to 110?

He said 120V. Pay attention please!

;-)

 

[wilserbrewer]

A lot of electric brewers run their 5500W elements around 60% (or 3300W) for the boil.



:

Thanks Doug,

I was aware the op was trying to boil with 1375 w, no good.

I recall most 5500w users using a little more wattage, 3700-3900. Anyways this is usually in a 15 gallon kettle boiling closer to the rim, or perhaps 5 gallon batches.

My experience is that approx 4500w does well in a 20 gallon kettle for approx 13 gallons pre boil volume. I'd guess the larger kettle surface area, and larger wort surface area consumes a bit more wattage. Of course this will add a little time vs using a 5500w element.

If the op is looking to make a very simple e kettle my suggestion would be 20 gal pot and a 4500w element with a simple on/off switch for 10 gallon batches. Adjust starting water to account for boil off.

While maybe not the best way, just a simple effective way imo.

 

[doug293cz]

Thanks Doug,

I was aware the op was trying to boil with 1375 w, no good.

I recall most 5500w users using a little more wattage, 3700-3900. Anyways this is usually in a 15 gallon kettle boiling closer to the rim.

My experience is that approx 4500w does well in a 20 gallon kettle for approx 13 gallons pre boil volume. I'd guess the larger kettle surface are, and larger wort surface area consumes a bit more wattage. Of course this will add a little time vs using a 5500w element.

If the op is looking to make a simple e kettle my suggestion would be 20 gal and a 4500w element for 10 gallon batches.

While maybe not the best way, just a way imo.

Yes, the total surface area is one of the main factors in amount of heat lost to the environment vs. heat turning water to vapor (boiling), or increasing the beer temp to get to boiling temp. The hotter the kettle gets, the more heat is lost to the environment, and the less is available for raising the liquid temp. If you are under powered, the hotter you get, the more trouble you have getting even hotter.

Brew on

 

[wilserbrewer]

If you are under powered, the hotter you get, the more trouble you have getting even hotter.



Brew on

The death spiral principle....

I recall years ago a fellow had a large wide alum kettle, maybe 25 gallon, intuitively everyone thought he had enough wattage 5500? (Can't recall) to boil, but no go....

Long thread w lots insisting he wasn't getting full power, in the end the kettle was determined to be an energy suck.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

He said 120V. Pay attention please!

;-)

I thought he was looking to open one leg of a 220 line for a pump or something...this thread has become way over my head...will be following though
That being said the OP said he was getting things together to start Electric brewing. A simple 5500W element with a pid and 40 amp ssr works more than perfect for 12 gallon batches...you don't need much to brew beer, controlled heat..thats about it

 

[BrunDog]

I thought he was looking to open one leg of a 220 line for a pump or something...this thread has become way over my head...will be following though

That being said the OP said he was getting things together to start Electric brewing. A simple 5500W element with a pid and 40 amp ssr works more than perfect for 12 gallon batches...you don't need much to brew beer, controlled heat..thats about it

Busting ur chops! Hence the wink!

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

I just saw this and remembered an old video from bobby that looked like what your wanting, im not sure how this is wired

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0AGUOCeM-WU[/ame]

 

[BrunDog]

Per above, 120V (or 110 depending on your nomenclature) will not have the oomph to maintain a boil.

It's wired with a 3-way switch, with the common going to the element, the other sides are the other hot leg and neutral.

And yes, oomph is a technical term to quantify power.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

and just like above you cant go wrong with an easyboil, Ive built several bib boxes using these, I have each of these in my panel one for mash and one for just the boil

http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=53&products_id=560

http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=53&products_id=444

 

[wilserbrewer]

Per above, 120V (or 110 depending on your nomenclature) will not have the oomph to maintain a boil.

And yes, oomph is a technical term to quantify power.

Well, 120v or 110v (nomenclature depending) has plenty of oomf, as long as you bring plenty of amps / circuits to the party....

It does get busy as you will need more than one element for anything over 5 gallons (stretch grainfather or mash and boil)

 

[BrunDog]

Well, 120v or 110v (nomenclature depending) has plenty of oomf, as long as you bring plenty of amps / circuits to the party....

It does get busy as you will need more than one element for anything over 5 gallons (stretch grainfather or mash and boil)

Ya, we agree (see post #3) but the OP wanted simple and a 5500W element.

 

[MmmmBeeeerrrr]

Thank you for the responses and for S&G's I checked my voltage, I'm at 122.2 vac o_0

Wishful thinking on my part that it could be a simple flick of the switch, I'm just weighing all the options and brainstorming really.

I inherited a 15gal keg with a valve/diptube and a 12.5"dia hole in the top I would like to update to electric.

Yes wilserbrewer, very simple is what I'd like for now. I have temp controllers, relays, and arduinos that I'll use later. I was just hopeful that 1375W would maintain the boil.

I start looking at switching times and insulation.

 

[augiedoggy]

Thank you for the responses and for S&G's I checked my voltage, I'm at 122.2 vac o_0

Wishful thinking on my part that it could be a simple flick of the switch, I'm just weighing all the options and brainstorming really.

I inherited a 15gal keg with a valve/diptube and a 12.5"dia hole in the top I would like to update to electric.

Yes wilserbrewer, very simple is what I'd like for now. I have temp controllers, relays, and arduinos that I'll use later. I was just hopeful that 1375W would maintain the boil.

I start looking at switching times and insulation.

You can accomplish your goals very simply... Just with 240v with a temp controller or a simpler pot controlled ssvr like the stilldragon kit... IMO its a hell of a lot simpler than all the brainstorming and insulation you need to try and cheat physics...

 

[BrunDog]

You meant "cheat" physics.

 

[augiedoggy]

You meant "cheat" physics.

I did..