substitute for briess midnight wheat

[HItransplant]

I'm working on a recipe inspired by Firestone walker's Wookey Jack.

They use both debittered black malt and this midnight wheat malt. Ive never used midnight wheat, but based on briess' fact sheet, where they suggest it as a sub for debittered black malt, it seems the two are more or less interchangeable.

I feel like FW wouldn't use both in their recipe unless they felt each contributed unique qualities to the finished beer.

Im wondering if anyone who has used these two malts can tell me if its worth chasing down some midnight wheat, or should I just get my color from the carafa special III?

thanks!

 

[Prymal]

I have used both and I personally like midnight wheat better then carafa III. It is a lot softer in flavor contributing predominantly color. Even though carafa III is debittered I have always felt it had a sort of astringent flavor.

 

[ReverseApacheMaster]

The midnight wheat probably also adds some head retention and possibly some haze.

 

[barrooze]

I loved midnight weat gen I used it. I found it at Farmhouse Brewing Supply.

 

[HItransplant]

I have used both and I personally like midnight wheat better then carafa III. It is a lot softer in flavor contributing predominantly color. Even though carafa III is debittered I have always felt it had a sort of astringent flavor.

So, it sounds like there is enough of a difference that a recipe with both would taste unique from one with just one or the other?

Thanks for the replies.

 

[Prymal]

Yeah I would totally agree. And to be honest firewalker is a fantastic brewery so of they use both in there recipe I wouldn't question it, they know what they are doing.

 

[HItransplant]

Yeah I would totally agree. And to be honest firewalker is a fantastic brewery so of they use both in there recipe I wouldn't question it, they know what they are doing.

Totally agree!

Thanks again.

 

[bobbrews]

How much of a substitute in ounces and % of the total recipe are we talking about here? Are you looking solely for deeper color, or did you have other goals in mind?

Carafa will sub for color if it's a miniscule amount, but I agree with what prymal says... if you're using a decent amount of it then it can taste astringent.

 

[HItransplant]

How much of a substitute in ounces and % of the total recipe are we talking about here? Are you looking solely for deeper color, or did you have other goals in mind?

Carafa will sub for color if it's a miniscule amount, but I agree with what prymal says... if you're using a decent amount of it then it can taste astringent.

Im not sure yet... still in working on the grain bill. Kinda just looking at rye IPA recipes and black IPAs... hoping to hybridize. Im sure there will be some trial and error, but this sounds like a pretty sweet house IPA for the colder months.

Maybe that is another reason to use both, lots of color but part carafa III and part midnight wheat will soften the flavor you get from all the color. The actual beer is jet black. beautiful.

 

[skeezerpleezer]

Here is a grain bill for you. Straight from the source: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/firestone-walker-wookey-jack-clone-attempt-333436/

 

[HItransplant]

Here is a grain bill for you. Straight from the source: https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/firestone-walker-wookey-jack-clone-attempt-333436/

This is GREAT! I must not be using the search function properly because I searched for a clone with no success.

How did it turn out?

Thanks for the reference. Man I love this forum!!

 

[skeezerpleezer]

If you are using the app, the search function is crap (IMO).

I haven't got it brewed yet. I have a couple trips coming up, so am waiting till after them to do it so I can properly tend the beer.

 

[HItransplant]

If you are using the app, the search function is crap (IMO).

I haven't got it brewed yet. I have a couple trips coming up, so am waiting till after them to do it so I can properly tend the beer.

natural born poet...

I agree. the search function on the iPhone app sucks-- I've tried all sorts of settings with no luck.

I just search for stuff on google, find the thread on HBT, subscribe to it and then read it through the app.

thanks again for the recipe.

 

[Proboscidea]

I'm making a Wookey Jack clone too, and I can't find midnight wheat at my local shop.

They do have chocolate wheat malt. It would only be 0.5lb in a 20lb grain bill. Acceptable substitute?

I should note that I do not have a super-precise or super-professional setup. For example, I ferment in a swamp cooler with bottles of ice on an 8-hour rotation, which ain't precise at all. So this will probably not come out exactly like Wookey Jack anyway. But I'm just wondering if chocolate wheat would be, like, totally disgusting in this brew ... and if it is, do y'all have any other recommendations of commonly available grain to sub for the elusive midnight wheat?

 

[Prymal]

If you can't get midnight wheat (available online) I would just double the Carafa in the recipe. Chocolate wheat would impart flavor undesirable in this clone. I found midnight wheat to be super clean, the toasty flavor from a malt that dark is almost in detectable. I prefer it to Carafa III.

 

[Proboscidea]

Cool, thanks!

 

[passedpawn]

Chocolate wheat? I used this in a black IPA. I think it's great. Very dark.

 

[HItransplant]

If you can't get midnight wheat (available online) I would just double the Carafa in the recipe. Chocolate wheat would impart flavor undesirable in this clone. I found midnight wheat to be super clean, the toasty flavor from a malt that dark is almost in detectable. I prefer it to Carafa III.

great info!

Cool, thanks!

if you dont mind posting your results on this clone. I probably wont brew until fall as I use a swamp cooler and hot summer temps make temp control very difficult.
Sounds like a wonderful early winter brew to have in bottles for the holidays.

 

[Proboscidea]

I probably won't make the Wookey Jack clone for a while. My beer pipeline is currently full of delicious dark stouts, porters, and brown ales, so right now I feel the need to add some some lighter fare before delving back into the darkness. But I'll post the results if & when I go there!

BTW: will use the clone recipe in the link upthread.

 

[skeezerpleezer]

I brewed my Wookey Jack 2 weekends ago, will rack and dryhop this weekend. I will update in that thread, then here if i remember

 

[HItransplant]

I probably won't make the Wookey Jack clone for a while. My beer pipeline is currently full of delicious dark stouts, porters, and brown ales, so right now I feel the need to add some some lighter fare before delving back into the darkness. But I'll post the results if & when I go there!

BTW: will use the clone recipe in the link upthread.

Im in the opposite boat, ready to start brewing dark for the cold months... just gotta wait for fall when I can actually control fermentation temps adequately.

I brewed my Wookey Jack 2 weekends ago, will rack and dryhop this weekend. I will update in that thread, then here if i remember

that would be awesome... Id love to nail a good clone down.

cheers to all!