Stainless Steel Heating Element
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Gameface
Well-Known Member
Well, you do have to add the element of your choice to your cart and then the enclosure of your choice, but even if "kitted" you'd get the exact same thing in the box because these have to be put together on your kettle anyway, so you wouldn't gain anything by having them assembled before shipping.
Generally speaking retailers will bundle items together at a savings for the consumer. Looking at other examples on Bobby's site however I see this isn't the case. He's probably already selling at rock bottom prices. :rockin:
Any update on the estimated arrival of these?
JoshuaW
Well-Known Member
Just an FYI everyone, those ripple elements are on his site now. I just ordered one for my BK, along with some camlock fittings to integrate a flow switch, like Augie has. I'm going to stick with my original straight stainless elements for my HLT and RIMS, since the HLT won't touch wort, and when the RIMS is touching wort, it will be at 120v.
Just ordered two! Thanks Bobby!
augiedoggy
Well-Known Member
Bobby just a heads up there a typo on your element order page with the diagram below your element comparison picture... You have the watt densities for 240v listed under 120v and vice versa...
Nice catch!
sandyeggoxj
Well-Known Member
Nope. Lime life elements have a plated base. The sheath of most elements is some sort of stainless but that isn't the issue.
So http://www.theelectricbrewery.com/ is fibbing when they say the new elements are all ss?
sandyeggoxj
Well-Known Member
I can't speak to that. If you go directly to camco's site it is pretty vague. That is where i got my information. http://www.camco.net/Products/Item?prodID=11221
There are 3 products in the group for that page. The 02929, 02935 and 02965.
There are 3 products in the group for that page. The 02929, 02935 and 02965.
The Electric Brewery said:
They do call them stainless elements, but they are talking about the base.
augiedoggy
Well-Known Member
The base is zinc coated steel and sometimes they turn black and dont rust and other times they rust... some people treat them with olive oil to condition the surface and I hear that helps if done before the rust starts. Others just coat them in silicone. I had rust so I replaced my HLT element with a lwd element with a lead free brass base... These can be found all over and I found a seller on ebay that sells them for $13... This way I can leave my water in my HLT and not have to worry. my BK element base turned black and I dont scrub it... so far no rust.
bobby at brew hardware has all stainless 5500w ULWD ripple elements as well as a few other sellers but His are priced the best I believe. I use 4500w ulwd elements so I cant use them.
bobby at brew hardware has all stainless 5500w ULWD ripple elements as well as a few other sellers but His are priced the best I believe. I use 4500w ulwd elements so I cant use them.
kal
Well-Known Member
You are referring to the old Camco elements such as the 02963 5500W ripple element. This is the element that brewers have been using for years, including myself - I still use them actually as I don't have rust issues.
For years everyone's been told to not leave water in the kettles for extended durations as the base of the element may rust. Or use an anode. It's a bigger issue in the HLT.
The new Camco 02965 (5500W) and 02955 (4500W) ripple elements that they've recently released have a stainless base that will not rust. This is what we at theelectricbrewery.com now use exclusively. They pretty much look the same as the previous 02963 elements. I tried to summarize the info here.
Pictures:
Kal
kal
Well-Known Member
Correct.
Though "technically" the black heating rod portion is also stainless since it's a mix of nickel-chromium and stainless steel. It's stronger than regular 304/316 stainless.
I used to only say "stainless base" but then people were thinking that having 100% 304/316 shiny stainless (including the rods) was "better" when it's actually the opposite.
These new Camco 02955/02965 are really what brewers should be using if rust is an issue.
Kal
The camco branded ones look pretty close to the ones I stock but I know those particular ones are not made at the same factory due to the plastic base at the back. Although mine do not carry the Camco brand/numbering, I want to be sure people know that they are also made in the USA by one of the two large element manufactures.
augiedoggy
Well-Known Member
You are referring to the old Camco elements such as the 02963 5500W ripple element. This is the element that brewers have been using for years, including myself - I still use them actually as I don't have rust issues.
For years everyone's been told to not leave water in the kettles for extended durations as the base of the element may rust. Or use an anode. It's a bigger issue in the HLT.
The new Camco 02965 (5500W) and 02955 (4500W) ripple elements that they've recently released have a stainless base that will not rust. This is what we at theelectricbrewery.com now use exclusively. They pretty much look the same as the previous 02963 elements. I tried to summarize the info here.
Pictures:
Kal
I believe you but the elements you have pictured appear to have nickel/ zinc bases? look at the color of the base compared to the stainless screws... Those bases looks to be the same as my nickel or zinc coated ones.
kal
Well-Known Member
The colour of the metal/material doesn't really mean anything. There are various types and finishes to stainless.
Kal
augiedoggy
Well-Known Member
kal
Well-Known Member
They're the standard/generic pictures from Camco's website.
Kal
Kal
pablosbrewing
Well-Known Member
I am pretty sure the 02965 ripple element is constructed as follows - I have one in hand at the moment:
- Base is machined out of stainless, not plated
- Element sheath is made of incoloy (800 series stainless)
- Electrical terminals and screws are bright nickel plated, base metal is most likely brass. UL Listed connection I doubt stainless is allowed.
orangehero
Well-Known Member
The CAMCO Ripple elements I've handled also have APCOM embossed on the base.
I think that's just a stock image of the zinc plate element.
Do you have photos of the actual new SS base CAMCO?
kal
Well-Known Member
Good point on the last item. I had not thought about that since the Camco ones are indeed UL rated.
I don't... My manufacturer (Spike Innovations) is supposed to take some official pics but they've just been too busy and it's (rightfully so) not high on the priority list... I'll post if/when we get some.
Kal
augiedoggy
Well-Known Member
Its ironic to me that nickel platesd brass would be allowed (as would steel) But stainless which is mainly a nickel and steel mixture as far as I understand is not allowed...I have read that stainless does not make the best conductor but I had assumed (probably incorrectly) that it was the nickel that caused this? There must be more to it.
kal
Well-Known Member
Most likely. I'm not sure if stainless is allowed, but assuming it isn't there are often all sorts of other factors that aren't immediately obvious. Take aluminum (ALU): ALU wiring was used in electrical wiring work between the breaker panel and receptacles for many years before they stopped allowing it due to the expansion/contraction that could happen over time, causing poor connectivity in some cases, causing excess heat, causing fire concerns. There's nothing inherently unsafe with ALU wiring as long as you go and open up all your outlets once every ~5 years to recheck/retighten. But of course you can't ask or expect a homeowner to do that. ALU is still allowed for service entrance wire (the usually short piece between the meter and the panel because of how it's fastened - I watched an electrician do our ~3 years ago when we upgraded from a 100A to 200A service).
Sorry - that was somewhat off topic!
Kal
Sorry - that was somewhat off topic!
Kal
Stainless is an alloy so it will have different qualities. As to aluminum problem, bad connections is only half the problem. When aluminum is exposed to air it oxides and the oxide is flammable (see Thermite) at 1300f. All it took is a couple of arcs between wire and terminal and the wire would burn and continue into the wall.
pablosbrewing
Well-Known Member
Nickel is about 10X better conductor than stainless. Pure copper is about 40X better than stainless, but too soft to make screws out of, so an alloy (brass) is used. So in the example of household outlets, one screw is brass (hot) one screw is nickel plated (neutral).
So - I think the Camco stock photos may be accurate. There was a machining residue on the base (1st photo) making it look dull - the next 3 are after cleaning with isopropyl (IPA!)
augiedoggy
Well-Known Member
this is a bit silly to discuss but the screws look the same color as the base in your last photo...
kal
Well-Known Member
@pablosbrewing: Who's heating elements are you showing us in your photos? Were these ones purchased through my site at TheElectricBrewery.com? They look identical to the Camco 02965 ones we have for which I posted photos earlier.
Kal
Kal
iijakii
Well-Known Member
I work with various grades of stainless all the time. It's pretty hard to distinguish CA6 and CD4 vs just plain ol ductile iron a lot of times.
pablosbrewing
Well-Known Member
They are Camco 02965's from https://www.plumbingsupply.com/ they were the first place I found the stainless base ripples.
kal
Well-Known Member
Cool - so they are indeed the 02965 stainless base model then. Thanks for confirming.
Kal
akthor
Well-Known Member
So if you are not leaving the elements in liquid for long periods rust is not an issue? I'm going to be doing a one vessel BIAB so besides the mash and boil the element wouldn't be in liquid.
kal
Well-Known Member
It depends on length of time you leave them in water as well as possibly the water chemistry (harder water seems worse?). When in doubt, get ones with a stainless base.
Kal
Kal
augiedoggy
Well-Known Member
I never left water or beer in my kettle ...I still had rust not terrible but rust.
It's very obvious to me now that the Camco brand elements are manufactured by at least two companies, one of which is APCOM. They go through several different materials variations depending on availability. The bases specifically have been 430SS and 304SS. The latter look a lot better but they only subbed those in for a short period when they had trouble with their 430SS source which is a lot cheaper for them. Long story short though, all of them are rust resistant enough that it's a moot point unless you're always looking for shiny stainless hidden in the bottom of your kettle.
AlexisnaveCA
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The stainless steel elements are rust free.
These heating elements include important features a brewer should look for:
1. Ultra low watt density or low watt density.
2. A stainless steel base that will not rust.
These heating elements are available in different sizes.
These heating elements include important features a brewer should look for:
1. Ultra low watt density or low watt density.
2. A stainless steel base that will not rust.
These heating elements are available in different sizes.
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