Splitting a Beverage Line to Two Taps.

[Revvy]

There's a few threads on this topic around the web, including here, and usually most of the answers given are "Good Lord, why would you want to do a thing like that?" Or "Have two kegs." Neither very helpful....

Thanks to Good Brewing Buddy/HBT Mod, Homercidal, I am the proud owner of a new/used chest freezer to replace my beloved keezer which suffered an in-wall freon leak that killed it.

So with New Keezer obviously comes New Collar. So I'm looking at the space inside and what I learned from the last one, and where I want to put things, etc. And I thought maybe it would be interesting to actually mount/suspend my ghetto water filter Randall to the collar instead of just sitting it wherever down inside the freezer.

This puppy;

Then while posting in my "Favorite Two Hop Combinations" Thread about running a different hop through my randall to compliment an all citra Ipa, and looking at my soon to be new collar and freezer that I can actually fit at least 2 more kegs (if not 3) in there, I decided to add another tap to the front wall.

This got me thinking about how fun it would be to be able to do side by side comparisons of the same base beer with one going through the randal and the other one directly to the tap.

It would be cool not just for hops, but to be able to do some of the other things I've put in there, smoked pineapple, cookies, etc, and not have to unhook/swap out my beverage line with the randal lines.

So has anyone ACTUALLY done this for whatever reason? Run two lines off the same tap?

And would it be as simple as a 3/16th barbed t- fitting like this work?

I'm thinking of coming off the keg with a short bit of hose and splitting it to 2- 5 foot beverage lines, one going straight to one tap, and the other to the randall....

In using my randall I've not had noticeable resistance issues that I recall at serving pressure, but I've wondering if I'm going to have to do some math on the beerline length to the randall and from that to the 4th tap.

Thoughts? Hardware ideas?

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

Interesting idea for sure. Ill be following to see how well the filter works. I wonder how often you will need to change the filter with beer running through it.

I added line to my existing line with a coupler awhile back and you could see bubbles directly downstream of the coupler.. Turbulence in the splitter could be a concern.

 

[daveMN]

I'd say to include a shut-off with check valve after the T fitting. It would make changing the Randall easier and keep things flowing where you want it.

 

[Revvy]

Interesting idea for sure. Ill be following to see how well the filter works. I wonder how often you will need to change the filter with beer running through it.

I added line to my existing line with a coupler awhile back and you could see bubbles directly downstream of the coupler.. Turbulence in the splitter could be a concern.

There's no filter inside of the randall, just some sort of holed tube to allow the beer to flow through and keep the particles out...some use a screen... Mine is a ghetto as you can get.... a piece of 1" foodgrade hose (I think it's for an RV I guess) and a stopped on the bottom.

I made this 2 years ago. Love it.

 

[Revvy]

I'd say to include a shut-off with check valve after the T fitting. It would make changing the Randall easier and keep things flowing where you want it.

Very good point.

 

[Stillraining]

You may have to play with balancing out each side to get equal delivery with different line lengths etc. ( If that even matters to you) But It will definitely work..pressure is pressure, it doesn't care where you direct it. As long as both taps were not pulled open at the same time screwing up delivery pressures there should be no issue other then balancing it out as stated.
My pee brain says the Randell side will require a bit more pressure, but you have more experience with that then I...If it does them more line length on the non Randal tap will be required to compensate.

And yes I like your not so new Snazzy Avatar...

 

[Revvy]

You may have to play with balancing out each side to get equal delivery with different line lengths etc. ( If that even matters to you) But It will definitely work..pressure is pressure, it doesn't care where you direct it. As long as both taps were not pulled open at the same time screwing up delivery pressures there should be no issue other then balancing it out as stated.
My pee brain says the Randell side will require a bit more pressure, but you have more experience with that then I...If it does them more line length on the non Randal tap will be required to compensate.

And yes I like your not so new Snazzy Avatar...

Yeah I figure I'm going to have to play with the balance again. I was actually surprised that I DIDN'T have to play with the lines with when I hook up the randal normally...it does add more line length to it.

I'm also not sure where down the line out of the keg to put the splitter... do I go 6 inches or a foot out from the QD, and then go two lines... 4-5 foot to the "normal" tap and 3 or so to the randal. If I do that, then I'm going to start with 5 feet each side and trim down as needed.... I think.

 

[kiwipen]

I don't have any answers to you, only a question. Does the beer go trough brass fittings when it enters and exits the filter?

 

[bfish]

This is what a bar I used to work at, used to split to different taps. Maybe add some type of adapter/reduction to go from 3/8 to 3/16.

http://rapidswholesale.com/american...nHGisVZXWvGNqibyutJ_mkw3AsWGkhzvtKBoCQ0_w_wcB

 

[Revvy]

This is what a bar I used to work at, used to split to different taps. Maybe add some type of adapter/reduction to go from 3/8 to 3/16.

http://rapidswholesale.com/american...nHGisVZXWvGNqibyutJ_mkw3AsWGkhzvtKBoCQ0_w_wcB

So people do actually have need to do this? It's so weird that in all these forums people ask why folks want to do it... rather than solving the problem.

Seriously there's a cool thread on here where someone ask it, and it turned out the guy was building a party bus, where he wanted taps both inside and outside the bus... made sense to me. But by just asking the simple question he got all this negativity and he finally had to explain why... and people still couldn't offer solutions beyond "have to kegs."

SMH.....

Thanks for confirming.

Although I think for homebrew scale a normal 3 way fitting in my scale will work. Do you know about line balancing? Did they have to do that when splitting the line.

 

[Stillraining]

So people do actually have need to do this? It's so weird that in all these forums people ask why folks want to do it... rather than solving the problem.

Seriously there's a cool thread on here where someone ask it, and it turned out the guy was building a party bus, where he wanted taps both inside and outside the bus... made sense to me. But by just asking the simple question he got all this negativity and he finally had to explain why... and people still couldn't offer solutions beyond "have to kegs."

SMH.....

Thanks for confirming.

Although I think for homebrew scale a normal 3 way fitting in my scale will work. Do you know about line balancing? Did they have to do that when splitting the line.

Like anything else Revvy..if its doesn't line up with tradition or standard practices its considered waked by most. Iv always gone my own way.
Carry on!

 

[Revvy]

Like anything else Revvy..if its doesn't line up with tradition or standard practices its considered waked by most. Iv always gone my own way.
Carry on!

Me too, me too!!!

 

[bfish]

So people do actually have need to do this? …... Do you know about line balancing? Did they have to do that when splitting the line.

If I remember correctly, they run 75% CO2 / 25% N2 blend at 35 on mainline. Trunklines were around 15 (4-10 ft from regulator to keg, then the beer lines were 20-40 ft long). The split on the one arm was short (10 or so ft). The other arm went 40-50 ft and had a regulator (possible beer pump) on it. Both were 3/8 lines (I believe). It was just for a special event room, so it was not used daily. Kegs were often connected in a series too. Not sure how it was balanced but seemed to work well. The walk-in cooler was 36 degrees and taps were directly into the cooler wall.

 

[vrstud]

There's no filter inside of the randall, just some sort of holed tube to allow the beer to flow through and keep the particles out...some use a screen... Mine is a ghetto as you can get.... a piece of 1" foodgrade hose (I think it's for an RV I guess) and a stopped on the bottom.

I made this 2 years ago. Love it.

Hello:

I saw this post in the newsletter and I am interested in your setup. Could you explain in more detail what the intent of the water filter in-line with the tap is? You mention placing hops (or other things) in the line. I am assuming this is to add fresh flavors to the beer. Is this common? Do you have concerns about leaving food items in filter housing for a long time? How quickly do you need to drink the beer? Do you notice a significant effect? How does it change the flavor of the beer?

Thanks

Chris

 

[thegoat506]

As for the "T" Corny keg sells a stainless one that I use to split my C02 lines between 2 kegs. It works pretty well for that purpose and I think it would work here. Interested to see how this works out.

http://www.cornykeg.com/product/stainlesss-steel-tee/

 

[Revvy]

Hello:

I saw this post in the newsletter and I am interested in your setup. Could you explain in more detail what the intent of the water filter in-line with the tap is? You mention placing hops (or other things) in the line. I am assuming this is to add fresh flavors to the beer. Is this common? Do you have concerns about leaving food items in filter housing for a long time? How quickly do you need to drink the beer? Do you notice a significant effect? How does it change the flavor of the beer?

Thanks

Chris

It's a little from my question, but here's an explanation of what it is from Dogfish Head who invented the original one.

“Randall the Enamel Animal is the original gangster organoleptic hop transducing module. Basically, it’s a sophisticated filter system that allows the user to run draft beer through a chamber of whole-leaf hops, spices, herbs, fruit, etc., so that the alcohol in the beer strips the flavor from whatever you add and puts it in the beer.”

Simplistically - a holding tank to filter a draft beer through an ingredient prior to serving. It was invented by Dogfish Head in 2010. Ingredients include but not limited to: hops, fruit, herbs, oak, and vanilla beans. The beer travels from your keg, to the Randall - where it is infused with a fresh, flavor enhancing ingredient, and then to your glass. The Randall allows the user to add a level of complexity, enhancement, and creativity to your brew.

Basically you put what you want into the chamber, and the beer flows through it on the way to the glass.

It adds a burst of fresh, immediate aroma and depending on what else, flavoring.

Answering the rest of your questions... it's common to people who are familiar with DFH's beers, and have ever been their brewery or to a tap takeover, or even watched Sam Caligione's Tv show when it was on.

Over the last few years, since people started making their own with water filter housings and posting online (there's a ton of plans here on this forum, that and this article in BYO is where I got design ideas from) it's more and more common I think.

It's really a fun toy to play with.

Using it with hops is amazing. It's a fresh burst of hops, even for IPAs that may have peaked in the keg, it just lifts the beer again.

But you can do a whole lot more with it.

I was at a DFH tap takeover a couple summers ago and they had several different beers on tap and it was fun, for one of them they ran their Palo Santo Marron brown ale through a bed of chunks of coconut and chocolate (I think it was brownies) and the beer came out tasting like German Chocolate Cake.

Another one they did was a lighter beer, maybe a wit that they ran through one with graham crackers and limes and it tasted like a Key Lime Pie.

I made mine originally for a mesquite smoked pineapple blonde ale I made in honor of my best friend's sudden death. She got me hooked on smoked pineapple for cooking (I made an insane mesquite pineapple/coconut gelato with it and I decided to honor honor memory with a beer. Unfortunately as an experiment the smoke originally was too intense in the beer, but I had the idea to mellow it out by passing the beer through a bed of a mixture of roasted and fresh pineapple, and the beer turned out amazing. I even filled growlers through it and took them to my buddy's brewery and everyone raved about it.

The nice thing is that you can play with flavoring beers without altering the original base beer. You can do something fun for a night and change back, or in my intended case have the same beer run to two taps, one with the option to flavor it and one plain.

I have a couple ideas for summer beers where I may have a couple kegs of my witbier on hand and play with some different fresh fruits.

I also have a new great brown ale recipe that I can't wait to play with next fall/winter, I'm thinking of passing it through gingersnaps, and ever fruitcake.

As to how long something lasts. When using mine I usually have it sitting cold inside my keezer, so in a lot of ways it's no different than a keg- It's a sealed pressurized container, so anything lasts as long as anything else would last in that situation.

And unless you purposely purge it, whatever you leave in there is in contact with beer. In fact that's when it's best, when beer has sat in there for a couple hours or over night, that's when the most flavor comes through.

I think the pineapple lasted 2 weeks, before it was stripped of flavor.

Same with hops, a few days of use and you'll notice when they lose flavor, and then you clean it out.


I don't think anyone has permanently mounted theirs inside their keezer before, a lot of folks like to use the clear housing waterfilters so people can see what fun stuff their running through it. Me, for whatever reason the day I was shopping for parts for to make mine it seemed that every hardware was out of clear filter housings, so I opted for the blue one. It was actually cheaper than than the listed prices of the clear ones anyway.

Hope this helps.

 

[Jbrew]

Do you already have the extra faucet and shank for the additional tap?
What about running 2 tees, one on each side of the filter and running a length of hose parallel to the filter and then a shut off for each branch. I would think since your not changing line length then, it wouldn't require any additional balancing, and you wouldn't have to make room for a separate tap. Plus the 2 tees and 2 shutoffs might be cheaper then another faucet and shank I don't know, maybe I'm just complicating things, then you would have to open the keezer and operate a valve though to switch it. Just a thought.

 

[Revvy]

Do you already have the extra faucet and shank for the additional tap?
What about running 2 tees, one on each side of the filter and running a length of hose parallel to the filter and then a shut off for each branch. I would think since your not changing line length then, it wouldn't require any additional balancing, and you wouldn't have to make room for a separate tap. Plus the 2 tees and 2 shutoffs might be cheaper then another faucet and shank I don't know, maybe I'm just complicating things, then you would have to open the keezer and operate a valve though to switch it. Just a thought.

I think you're over complicating things.

Yeah I will have a separate tap. This new/used keezer even though it's the same cubic inches (or close to it) as the old freezer oddly enough allows me to conceivable fit three more kegs in it than my last one. One more in the normal part with the other 3, and if I wanted since my collar is made with 2x10's 2 more on the hump. So either way I'm adding at least one more tap, and that's why I thought what the heck, might as well do what I've been toying with doing.

And after that I'm thinking a stout tap and nitro system.

 

[terrykalaka]

Flare tee right at the disconnect at the keg: http://www.installationpartssupply.com/category/stainless-steel-female-flare-flare-tee.html

 

[SGTSparty]

Flare tee right at the disconnect at the keg: http://www.installationpartssupply.com/category/stainless-steel-female-flare-flare-tee.html

Not an expert here but one would think that this has the best chance of success with regard to turbulence. If you connect this fitting to the QD, then the line swivel nuts to it your not really introducing much more turbulence than the original QD and swivel and you have the most time remaining in the lines for the beer to reabsorb any CO2 that was knocked out of suspension. Right? Added benefit that I would think having the splitter right now right on the QD would mean its in side the handles keeping it protected vs if its hanging on the line somewhere in the keezer.

 

[vrstud]

Thank you for such a detailed response. When I go to kegs I'm sure to include this in my keezer.

 

[Revvy]

Flare tee right at the disconnect at the keg: http://www.installationpartssupply.com/category/stainless-steel-female-flare-flare-tee.html

Not an expert here but one would think that this has the best chance of success with regard to turbulence. If you connect this fitting to the QD, then the line swivel nuts to it your not really introducing much more turbulence than the original QD and swivel and you have the most time remaining in the lines for the beer to reabsorb any CO2 that was knocked out of suspension. Right? Added benefit that I would think having the splitter right now right on the QD would mean its in side the handles keeping it protected vs if its hanging on the line somewhere in the keezer.

I think you guys are right. So help me think this through, I've been up since 3am... The Bev. Qd would go to the female end Then I'd need to 3/8 female to barb for the lines... And I'd still need some sort of stopcock on the Randall side, correct?

I'm not sure what they mean on that website by it being a "Non-Stock Item" is this something not all that common, or can I find it at a well stocked plumbing/fitting supply place?

Thanks.

 

[SGTSparty]

I think you guys are right. So help me think this through, I've been up since 3am... The Bev. Qd would go to the female end Then I'd need to 3/8 female to barb for the lines... And I'd still need some sort of stopcock on the Randall side, correct?

I'm not sure what they mean on that website by it being a "Non-Stock Item" is this something not all that common, or can I find it at a well stocked plumbing/fitting supply place?

Thanks.

Yeah I think you're on the right track. You'd connect the splitter in question directly to the QD, then I'd do a barb to female swivel nut to connect the lines to either male end. I'm not sure what you mean by a stopcock but basic googling shows its basically just an in line shut off valve? I don't think you actually need that unless you have one on your Randall line now unless your afraid that whatever material you have in the Randall is going to diffuse back down the line and affect the beer in the non-Randall line/keg but my (very limited) understanding of Randalls is that this is not a major concern.

Non-stock item might just mean its a special order and may take an few weeks? IDK.

 

[Revvy]

Update.. It's coming along. Finally figured out a mounting system and where to locate it in the keezer. Found a beverage line splitter and my LHBS nothing fancy just a 3/8 Y connector. I also found a little plastic shutoff valve. I should have the plumbing installed tomorrow. And hopefully have the whole keezer done by the weekend.

 

[daveMN]

Looking good!

 

[Revvy]

Well..it's done and working.....

What I ended up using was just a basic stainless beverage "y" from my LHBS, and this nifty 3/16 beerline quick disconnect from Kegworks.

You can see both the "Y" (more like a "U" with a tail, and the QD here;

A Better pic of the hose configuration

and the splitter.

I'm really happy with it... I even have even made some magnetic tap handle thingys for my handle indicating that a particular tap is running through the randal. With it's own "logo"

This is a generic label when something is in there, that I haven't made a label for....

This is the generic, "There's hops in that there Randall" tap handle graphic.