Simple solution to control heating elements?

[glick]

Hello,

I am interested in making the switch to electic brewing from propane and am wondering if there is a simple diy way to control the output of the element? I want to have an element in the HLT and an element in the BK using a cooler as a mash tun. I am not interested in recirculating anything right now, only in being able to control the elements. Is there a way that both elements can be controlled independently and used at the same time? Most of the information that I am finding through searches involves a much higher level of automation than I am interested in. Thanks for your help!

 

[gotbags-10]

If you want something cheap easy and works great check out still dragon.com . They have a diy controller kit for 41$

 

[MikeDanger]

I bought said DIY controller. Should have it set up in the next couple of weeks. I've heard good things about it, though! And if it gets me through for awhile that would be great. I just want to make beer on this thing...


Sent from my iPhone using Home Brew

 

[alphaomega]

If you want something cheap easy and works great check out still dragon.com . They have a diy controller kit for 41$

From the looks of it, that is not an SSR, but an SSVR based controller.
IMHO, that is not appropriate for this application. It will emit a lot of electromagnetic noise, that may interfere with other appliances. And there is just no reason for that. A better solution would be to use a proper SSR and control it with slow PWM (in the order of 0.1-1Hz).
To generate the PWM you could use a cheap LED dimmer (see this thread) or a cheap PID controller that has a manual setting.

That is if you even really need to control the output. Using an element sized for your setup, you won't need to dial it down.
Using both elements at the same time, depends on your setup. It might over load your wiring. I'd suggest a thermostat (like the STC-1000, possibly with an SSR if >10A) to maintain HLT temp. If you use an SSR to control the BK element as well, you could use logic to only allow one element on at the time if that is required.

Now, I do fly sparging, for me HLT is on first, to reach strike temp. Then I run RIMS with a low powered element to maintain temp, while heating sparge water. During sparge/lautering only BK is firing.

Really consider what it is you want to achieve and then go the simplest route at first. I'd suggest a properly sized BK element (probably around 2500-3500W for 5-10 gallon) and a simple thermostat for HLT. That goes a long way.

Cheers!

 

[augiedoggy]

Simple to assemble or simple to use?

An actual pid with manual control is the easiest and most accurate to use this will cost you about $35 minimum for all the components..... One of the scr of ssrv are the CHEAPEST( $10-20) by a few bucks and may have a few less wires during the one time installation but in my opinion the pids make it worth it every time you use them.... You always know your temps and when its safe to walk out of the room without fear of boilover.
and you can even set an alarm to let you know when your approaching the boiling temp.

Would you rather bake in an oven with or without temp indicator /timer?

 

[biertourist]

There's a new option in this space from Auber, no less: http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_30&products_id=444

Dial-based SSR power regulator.

Personally, boil kettles should have dial control. Temperature in the boil kettle isn't super useful and if it is an analog dial works plenty there.

I HATE using my PID controller to boil, pushing buttons back and forth between temp mode and %output mode and waiting for it to respond then holding the buttons- BAH! I just want to turn a dial and have the heat go down.

 

[biertourist]

From the looks of it, that is not an SSR, but an SSVR based controller.

It certainly says its an SSR, and they sell SSRs separately, too.

I'm curious whether I could fit the new Auber controller into that box and use it instead of the potentiometer...

http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_30&products_id=444



Adam

 

[drksky]

There's a new option in this space from Auber, no less: http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_30&products_id=444

Dial-based SSR power regulator.

Personally, boil kettles should have dial control. Temperature in the boil kettle isn't super useful and if it is an analog dial works plenty there.

I HATE using my PID controller to boil, pushing buttons back and forth between temp mode and %output mode and waiting for it to respond then holding the buttons- BAH! I just want to turn a dial and have the heat go down.

It's still a digital control. It just pushes the buttons for you. I've not actually used one, but don't he PIDs toggle between temp and output or do you have to toggle it for every change in output?

 

[alphaomega]

It certainly says its an SSR, and they sell SSRs separately, too.

I'm curious whether I could fit the new Auber controller into that box and use it instead of the potentiometer...

http://www.auberins.com/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=2_30&products_id=444

Adam

Yes, it does say SSR, but look at the picture and what is included. It is pretty obvious what it is.
That auber controller looks really good. It seems they made a really good job with that AND it is not overly expensive. Simple knob to change the setting fast and a display to give direct feedback of the exact setting. Also, reading the specs, seems they made some pretty good design choices.
I'd say buy another box... They are easy to source.

 

[augiedoggy]

Yes, it does say SSR, but look at the picture and what is included. It is pretty obvious what it is.
That auber controller looks really good. It seems they made a really good job with that AND it is not overly expensive. Simple knob to change the setting fast and a display to give direct feedback of the exact setting. Also, reading the specs, seems they made some pretty good design choices.
I'd say buy another box... They are easy to source.

I agree the digital "manual" control would work fine but its going to be just about as complicated as wiring up a cheaper pid that has much more functionality and would end up being about $15 cheaper... If you dont like all the technology and just want a simple dial it will work great though.

 

[wilserbrewer]

That is if you even really need to control the output. Using an element sized for your setup, you won't need to dial it down.

Really consider what it is you want to achieve and then go the simplest route at first. I'd suggest a properly sized BK element (probably around 2500-3500W for 5-10 gallon)

I like this advice and feel it is worth repeating. I feel many more people would be e-brewing if this approach were more widely publicized. Also, while having a thermostat on the HLT is a nice feature, it's not a big deal to heat in manual mode as one would likely do w/ propane anyway. I just feel whenever someone comes in the room looking for a simple DIY e-brewing solution the conversation quickly turns to PID this, SSR, PWM, chugger pumps, rims, herms.

Something as stupidly simple as.....

GFI + power + element + kettle

Is still far better than propane.

 

[biertourist]

It's still a digital control. It just pushes the buttons for you. I've not actually used one, but don't he PIDs toggle between temp and output or do you have to toggle it for every change in output?

You have to toggle it between the two modes and the UI on PIDS is NOT intuitive; it takes a couple seconds to switch the mode -you have to wait a few seconds so that it knows you want it to accept the value. -THEN you have to hold the % output button for a few seconds to lower it, then hold the button for quite a few seconds to decrease your output down from say 100% to 70% (on my system for 10 gallon batches, anyway), then wait a few more seconds for it to accept that value. -While you've had hot break spewing everywhere like an erupting volcano the whole time!

-Then after not brewing for a couple months you forget which button to push to switch modes / aren't 100% sure, OR there's a really magical setting that some how gets set on my PID every 6 months or so that prevents it from switching modes. -Then you have to go get a printed copy of the manual or find it on the interwebs and find the esoteric, poorly named setting that enables you to get it out of temp mode and back into % output mode and then perform the above process. -Again, pretty ridiculously over complicated for just needing to turn down the output on your boil kettle to prevent boil over. People really want to believe more expensive and more features is better, but its definitely not always the case (switch to tri-clamps on all your equipment and see how much faster / easier they make your brew day). You want form to meet function; dial control does that perfectly for a boil kettle.

There's so much technical geekery and desire to be "more like the professionals" in Home Brewing, but what we REALLY, REALLY need right now is professional design in home brew equipment. By that I don't mean designers to make our breweries look prettier; I mean someone who can take a cold hard look at combining form and function so that our breweries work easier and enable us to focus on making better beer.

Centralized vs. decentralized control, as is the case with most modern electric brewery setups gets us farther away from that ideal.
TriClamps vs. quick disconnects, get us farther away from that ideal.
Well planned plumbing gets us closer to that ideal (if you're going with a single-tier design).
3 Tier Gravity fed systems get us closer to that ideal.
Tippy dump mashtuns definitely get us closer to that ideal.
Well planned CIP systems which includes bottom draining vessels, gets us closer to that ideal.
Well designed hop separation is hugely important, too (hop spiders are pretty hard to beat in terms of simplicity and cost).


I think there's a reason that BIAB has exploded in popularity and part of it is that you can make pretty good beer relatively easy with minimum space and equipment and some of that homebrewer bling that people love.


Adam

 

[biertourist]

I like this advice and feel it is worth repeating. I feel many more people would be e-brewing if this approach were more widely publicized. Also, while having a thermostat on the HLT is a nice feature, it's not a big deal to heat in manual mode as one would likely do w/ propane anyway. I just feel whenever someone comes in the room looking for a simple DIY e-brewing solution the conversation quickly turns to PID this, SSR, PWM, chugger pumps, rims, herms.

Something as stupidly simple as.....

GFI + power + element + kettle

Is still far better than propane.

While I generally agree with the sentiment... (I've bought some really expensive, really complicated gear in the past couple years that I'm now ditching for cheaper equipment that "just works". I've learned this lesson repeatedly in different flavors for the past couple of years.)

I don't think it applies as much to HLTs as it does to boil kettles. With an HLT you need ACCURATE control of the temperature as your hot liquor temp drives your mashtemp which is the most critical temp to control during the all grain brewday. Crazy over and under shooting occurs if you don't have PID control. A properly calibrated PID controller is a "set it and forget it" affair; vs. a simple power on / power off controller they're really only $20-$30 more, too. (Same price if you go with a Chinese model and aren't worried about +/-2F.)

Just properly sizing an element so that you can leave it permanently on in an HLT is only a thing if you always brew the same batch size and if you always brew roughly the same gravity; you're never going to hit that perfect equalibrium in the HLT. You get many times more FLEXIBILITY and a much less stressful and labor-intense brew day by simply implementing PID control for the HLT.


-For the boil kettle, I agree 100% full PID control is both an expense and an unnecessary complication.

I lived and brewed in Ireland for 4 years with 240v power and I had a boil kettle that is much like you are talking about and it worked well with two elements -literally tea kettle elements powering a boil kettle with a computer power cord plugged into each one -to bring the kettle up to boil leave both plugged in (about 3 kw of power), then once the boil starts, unplug one of the elements and 1.5 kw can keep a boil going for 5 gallon batches. It WAS beyond simple, but sparge water had to be monitored constantly and I'd over shoot and undershoot and wait for it to heat back up and stir it to try and get it to cool back down. Again, the boil kettle worked great this way with the ability to cut out one element, but for an HLT, not so much unless you're "no sparge" brewing.

Summary: For the same reasons that I recommend AGAINST PID controllers for boil kettles, I recommend FOR PID controllers in the HLT. (It makes the brew day easier and less stressful; Form, I'd like to introduce you to Function: Hey they're hitting it off great!.)



Adam

 

[biertourist]

I agree the digital "manual" control would work fine but its going to be just about as complicated as wiring up a cheaper pid that has much more functionality and would end up being about $15 cheaper... If you dont like all the technology and just want a simple dial it will work great though.

Penny wise and pound foolish, IMHO.

-You're talking about the INITIAL, one-time, non-recurring labor cost vs. the constant recurring, every time-you-brew labor cost.

The problem with the current PID controller offerings when it comes to brew day (for boil kettles) is that they're complicated and non-intuitive to operate. It takes time and effort to switch them between modes and then set settings, change them and then wait a few more seconds for them to take effect. -Dials are simple and feedback is essentially instantaneous.

Extra technology for the sake of extra technology even when it makes your brew day more painful is a dumb idea. What "extra technology" do you get with a PID controller? -The ability to hold your boil kettle at a set temp... -WTF would you use that for? -It's a BOIL KETTLE -you want to get it up to boil as fast as possible and then turn down the temp so you maintain a rolling boil but not a volcanic eruption of hot break. -That's it. Those extra features that you're paying for come with a financial cost, but more importantly a huge ease-of-use cost that you pay every time you brew; they don't add any value either. (An alarm feature is nice to let you know that you're getting close to boil, I agree with that; having the ability to DISPLAY temp if you chill with an immersion chiller is NICE, but the cost is pretty high to pay for these nice-to-have features and it impacts the "must-have" features that you need in a boil controller.)

-It's like paying extra for a car that has a built-in cappuccino maker when that car then can only drive 45 miles an hour because of some stupid trade off made to fit in the cappuccino maker. The car does worse at being a car so that it can provide a feature that no one really needs.

A controller with dial control, temperature display and an alarm feature would be ideal; but it doesn't exist today.


Adam

 

[augiedoggy]

Penny wise and pound foolish, IMHO.

-You're talking about the INITIAL, one-time, non-recurring labor cost vs. the constant recurring, every time-you-brew labor cost.

The problem with the current PID controller offerings when it comes to brew day (for boil kettles) is that they're complicated and non-intuitive to operate. It takes time and effort to switch them between modes and then set settings, change them and then wait a few more seconds for them to take effect. -Dials are simple and feedback is essentially instantaneous.

Extra technology for the sake of extra technology even when it makes your brew day more painful is a dumb idea. What "extra technology" do you get with a PID controller? -The ability to hold your boil kettle at a set temp... -WTF would you use that for? -It's a BOIL KETTLE -you want to get it up to boil as fast as possible and then turn down the temp so you maintain a rolling boil but not a volcanic eruption of hot break. -That's it. Those extra features that you're paying for come with a financial cost, but more importantly a huge ease-of-use cost that you pay every time you brew; they don't add any value either. (An alarm feature is nice to let you know that you're getting close to boil, I agree with that; having the ability to DISPLAY temp if you chill with an immersion chiller is NICE, but the cost is pretty high to pay for these nice-to-have features and it impacts the "must-have" features that you need in a boil controller.)

-It's like paying extra for a car that has a built-in cappuccino maker when that car then can only drive 45 miles an hour because of some stupid trade off made to fit in the cappuccino maker. The car does worse at being a car so that it can provide a feature that no one really needs.

A controller with dial control, temperature display and an alarm feature would be ideal; but it doesn't exist today.


Adam

once I've reached a boil It requires me to push the "M" button (for manual)for 2 seconds till it lights up and then enter up or down till I have the percentage I want (usually 65-70) and then hit the set button... when I'm done it will reset with a power cycle or I could just hit the "m" button again and the light goes off and it goes back to auto...
let talk about all the time and labor advantages of the pid like being able to set the pid to climb quickly to say 209 degrees and stop and have an alarm go off when it reaches this point and the temp wont climb higher... this way I can leave and go clean a keg or fermentor in the next room and not worry about babysitting for a boilover, see There is a use for it afterall.
...you also do get the temp readout... we can talk about something that doesnt exist or adding more components but when just comparing these two on functionality and cost the pid wins... for some its a hassle and I agree for those people a knob would be best. Im not saying everyone should go this way, Just that it is more practical in this case for most...Especially those that embrace technology instead of fighting it..

There is one advantage of the knob over the buttons and that if your eyes or fingers or mind dont work as well as they used to it is easier to operate... I have this discussion with my father all the time as he wishes his new tv still had knobs instead of buttons on a remote... He doesnt mint the hundreds of channel options vs a dozen on the knob though... He also hates cell phones as you probably guessed...and hes only 63.

I,m sure there will come a day when Im on the other side of this argument..

 

[augiedoggy]

You have to toggle it between the two modes and the UI on PIDS is NOT intuitive; it takes a couple seconds to switch the mode -you have to wait a few seconds so that it knows you want it to accept the value. -THEN you have to hold the % output button for a few seconds to lower it, then hold the button for quite a few seconds to decrease your output down from say 100% to 70% (on my system for 10 gallon batches, anyway), then wait a few more seconds for it to accept that value. -While you've had hot break spewing everywhere like an erupting volcano the whole time!

-Then after not brewing for a couple months you forget which button to push to switch modes / aren't 100% sure, OR there's a really magical setting that some how gets set on my PID every 6 months or so that prevents it from switching modes. -Then you have to go get a printed copy of the manual or find it on the interwebs and find the esoteric, poorly named setting that enables you to get it out of temp mode and back into % output mode and then perform the above process. -Again, pretty ridiculously over complicated for just needing to turn down the output on your boil kettle to prevent boil over. People really want to believe more expensive and more features is better, but its definitely not always the case (switch to tri-clamps on all your equipment and see how much faster / easier they make your brew day). You want form to meet function; dial control does that perfectly for a boil kettle.

There's so much technical geekery and desire to be "more like the professionals" in Home Brewing, but what we REALLY, REALLY need right now is professional design in home brew equipment. By that I don't mean designers to make our breweries look prettier; I mean someone who can take a cold hard look at combining form and function so that our breweries work easier and enable us to focus on making better beer.

Centralized vs. decentralized control, as is the case with most modern electric brewery setups gets us farther away from that ideal.
TriClamps vs. quick disconnects, get us farther away from that ideal.
Well planned plumbing gets us closer to that ideal (if you're going with a single-tier design).
3 Tier Gravity fed systems get us closer to that ideal.
Tippy dump mashtuns definitely get us closer to that ideal.
Well planned CIP systems which includes bottom draining vessels, gets us closer to that ideal.
Well designed hop separation is hugely important, too (hop spiders are pretty hard to beat in terms of simplicity and cost).


I think there's a reason that BIAB has exploded in popularity and part of it is that you can make pretty good beer relatively easy with minimum space and equipment and some of that homebrewer bling that people love.


Adam

is that an auber pid your talking about? that seems a lot more complicated than mine... I believe there a vide of someone going to manual on a mypin pid on youtube...

 

[Bobby_M]

Penny wise and pound foolish, IMHO.

-You're talking about the INITIAL, one-time, non-recurring labor cost vs. the constant recurring, every time-you-brew labor cost.

The problem with the current PID controller offerings when it comes to brew day (for boil kettles) is that they're complicated and non-intuitive to operate. It takes time and effort to switch them between modes and then set settings, change them and then wait a few more seconds for them to take effect. -Dials are simple and feedback is essentially instantaneous.

Extra technology for the sake of extra technology even when it makes your brew day more painful is a dumb idea. What "extra technology" do you get with a PID controller? -The ability to hold your boil kettle at a set temp... -WTF would you use that for? -It's a BOIL KETTLE -you want to get it up to boil as fast as possible and then turn down the temp so you maintain a rolling boil but not a volcanic eruption of hot break. -That's it. Those extra features that you're paying for come with a financial cost, but more importantly a huge ease-of-use cost that you pay every time you brew; they don't add any value either. (An alarm feature is nice to let you know that you're getting close to boil, I agree with that; having the ability to DISPLAY temp if you chill with an immersion chiller is NICE, but the cost is pretty high to pay for these nice-to-have features and it impacts the "must-have" features that you need in a boil controller.)

-It's like paying extra for a car that has a built-in cappuccino maker when that car then can only drive 45 miles an hour because of some stupid trade off made to fit in the cappuccino maker. The car does worse at being a car so that it can provide a feature that no one really needs.

A controller with dial control, temperature display and an alarm feature would be ideal; but it doesn't exist today.


Adam

You make switching a PID to manual mode sound like walking to school in the snow with no shoes uphill both ways.

The button is labeled "A/M" for auto/manual. You should have a positive on/off switch for the element power anyway so if you have an emergency situation where killing the boil immediately is necessary, throw the switch off and then adjust the power level.

Just like your argument for HLT control, PID control of the boil kettle is useful when you're ramping up to boil. Set it to 3F below your boil temp and set the alarm. Walk away with no fear of boil over. The alarm tells you when to care. It also gives you a temp readout to see how far away from boil you are.

You agree with those benefits but adjusting the power level on a push button is really the grand deal breaker?

 

[theichthus]

I used this thyristor from eBay for simple analog control of a 5500E element. I have not seen anyone use this component. I could have put numbers around the dial to mark my setting but the super cheap analog volt meter seemed way more fun. I removed the pot and added leads so I could mount the thyristor to my back panel and the pot to the door. The fuse on the thyristor did blow on my second use. I have not brewed again since I replaced the fuse. There is a 9500W version for a couple more dollars I wish I would have purchased.

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=160833921374

 

[drksky]

The High Gravitu EBC controllers use a pot to control the boil output.

 

[augiedoggy]

The High Gravitu EBC controllers use a pot to control the boil output.

Yup, But they also used pids for bringing the temp up and then switching over to manual. Plus I believe they used the cheapest auber pids without that manual control built in... judging by the 99cent switches and $30 home depot enclosure lower building costs/profit were their main priority. (Theres under $300 in parts that $1,000 box as mentioned in other threads)

 

[drksky]

Yup, But they also used pids for bringing the temp up and then switching over to manual. Plus I believe they used the cheapest auber pids without that manual control built in... judging by the 99cent switches and $30 home depot enclosure lower building costs/profit were their main priority. (Theres under $300 in parts that $1,000 box as mentioned in other threads)

Glad I didn't buy one. That's a lot of labor for wiring.

 

[cank]

View attachment 232983

I used this thyristor from eBay for simple analog control of a 5500E element. I have not seen anyone use this component. I could have put numbers around the dial to mark my setting but the super cheap analog volt meter seemed way more fun. I removed the pot and added leads so I could mount the thyristor to my back panel and the pot to the door. The fuse on the thyristor did blow on my second use. I have not brewed again since I replaced the fuse. There is a 9500W version for a couple more dollars I wish I would have purchased. View attachment 232984

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=160833921374

Digin-it!
I totally want to do a manual readout with dials and nixie tubes.

Can you give me some more info on thyriators?

 

[theichthus]

I would suggest reading the Wikipedia article on thyristors. The potentiometer regulates the required gate voltage as far as I understand. It adjusts at what point the wave form is clipped... Not totally sure my understanding is correct but it works. Let me get my kids to bed and I will take a couple photos for you!

 

[theichthus]

Thanks for introducing me to Nixie tubes!!! Those are pretty sweet--but I have no clue how you would incorporate them. Attached is my wiring. It is very simple. One leg of the 220 goes through the thyristor.

 

[Tegra]

theichthus:

I am using the same control, except for the fuse location. Mine had a smaller sized fuse that actually melted (not blown) on my first 3000w element. (I could smell a burning smell on full and though the entire unit was overheating but it was just the bad fuse connection).

The pot also shorted out against the frame due to a manufacturing defect.

After some mods I think I have a setup that should handle my new 4400w heater.

I found I needed a fan blowing in the heat sink even at 3000w.

Tom

 

[Tegra]

theichthus:

Sorry, I forgot to add this....

I see from your picture that the circuit board is looking burnt (especially around the fuse)?

The same with mine, it thought the whole control was overloaded but found that, although the fuse could handle the current, the fuse holders were what were overheating. In mine the fuse cap actually melted because of the heat.

I ended up jumpering out the fuse and bolstering the circuit traces with 12 gauge wire. That and a fan blowing over the heat sink seems to be the solution for me.

I like the simplicity of a knob and I too have a analog meter (a large audio VU meter adjusted to full scale at full power). Simple but beautiful.

Tom

 

[cank]

https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/36162341/raspberry-pi-nixie-tube-driver
Use the pi to drive nixie tubes for time and temp displays.

 

[theichthus]

Tegra.

Thank you so much for all that info. Did I understand correctly that you removed the fuse entirely and just soldered a wire in there? Isn't that unsafe? I think mine actually melted the fuse too now that I think about it. There was a hole in the end. I would love to see a photo of at all possible.

 

[Tegra]

Theichthus:

I believe yours is the same design with a slightly different board layout.

(I must say that my setup pales in comparison to yours and is about as "desert island engineering" as you can get. It has no beauty whatsoever and was patched together with "fail cheap" as the number one goal)

The fuse was a 30 Amp and there is enough fusing upstream so removing it is not a safety issue and it was causing more harm (heat) than good.

The way I see it, the Triac can handle the current as long as heat is sinked quickly enough.
When we start putting 20 Amps through it, every small bit of resistance starts to generate heat.

After my (and yours) fuse melted down I realized that this was not a well designed product and, in my meat handed way, sought to make it stronger. I noticed the traces had excess solder added to try to increase their area. I thought that since I was jumpering the fuse I might as well beef these up so they would not produce any heat, and might actually help in sinking some heat away from the device. (Although the Triac appears to be rated for 60 Amp I think the 23 Amps a 5500 Watt heater will pull might be the practical maximum for this board) However in my paranoia, because of the extra thickness of the added wire on the bottom of the board, I also added a spacer between the board and the mounting studs to keep a generous space to the aluminum frame.

I have since done some tests and there is no longer any "heat smell" and the heat sink only gets warm. (I had to power down and open the case first so I had to guess as to running temp)

I reserve the right to still call this cheap dimmer a "piece of junk" (as it has blown up once and blown out once) but for now I think it might actually (with the mods) be a nice solution.

(Because of its constant heat input it is also useful if I was to want to heat (cough)something in the pot that boiled at a lower temperature than water (cough)).

Tom

 

[augiedoggy]

theichthus:

Sorry, I forgot to add this....

I see from your picture that the circuit board is looking burnt (especially around the fuse)?

The same with mine, it thought the whole control was overloaded but found that, although the fuse could handle the current, the fuse holders were what were overheating. In mine the fuse cap actually melted because of the heat.

I ended up jumpering out the fuse and bolstering the circuit traces with 12 gauge wire. That and a fan blowing over the heat sink seems to be the solution for me.

I like the simplicity of a knob and I too have a analog meter (a large audio VU meter adjusted to full scale at full power). Simple but beautiful.

Tom

So you bypassed fuse and don't have GFCI protection? Please tell me you at least have a breaker in the main box??

 

[Tegra]

Sorry, I should have made this more clear. There is a 20 amp circuit breaker and fuse "upstream". So the 30 amp fuse is just providing two more possible bad connections and its own internal heat.

Tom

 

[augiedoggy]

Sorry, I should have made this more clear. There is a 20 amp circuit breaker and fuse "upstream". So the 30 amp fuse is just providing two more possible bad connections and its own internal heat.

Tom

Ahh that makes more sense now I have to edit my other comment in the other thread.

 

[theichthus]

Thank you! I have yet to try it but I just modified mine. Same thing--I do have over current protection down stream. I also traced the PCB and see that it goes from triac through fuse to L terminal. So everything that was in common with the fuse in removed is in common with the one down stream.

 

[Tegra]

theichthus:

You are welcome!

From that angle the board sure looks burnt!

Despite the conclusion that some have jumped to, I am actually quite cautious in my designs and would have thought that this module is too small for 5500w. It appears obvious that this is true with the well intentioned fuse that ended up being a fire hazard.

(The size of the pcb traces is also a little bit concerning but, as they say, the proof is in the pudding)

We have a beautiful resistive load so heat is the only thing that will kill this.

Looking at my use of this in a BIAB keggle, I have it on full for 40 minutes to get to mash temp, 8 minutes to get to "sparse" temp and then 20 minutes to get to boil temp. The rest is running at half to two thirds power. At this duty cycle, and with temporary use I think a tighter design is appropriate.

I would be very curious to know, after you have run the heater on full for about ten minutes and then killed the power, what the temperature of the actual circuit board, the heat sink and the Triac is?


Tom