Saisan

[ashmgee]

so I wanted to take a stab at this style

I currently have
6 lb munich LME
candied belgian sugar
2 oz saaz pellet hops
munich yeast dry

the store i get my supplies doesn't have and crystal malts, but they do have belgian bisquit malt? would that be appropriate? never used specialty grains before so I don't know what the results of these additions would be.

anything else that could work with this?
the beer calculus site showed the above recipie to match the saison style.


edit:

so this is the recipe that came out of this..

6 lb Munich LME
1/4 lb Belgian biscuit
1/4 lb Belgian aromatic
1 lb Belgian candy sugar
2 oz fuggles (60 min)
Munich wheat yeast
5 gallons

sorry for the mislabeled thread (not sure how to change it)
call it a Munich Wheat Beer

 

[dcp27]

you can't have a saison without a saison yeast.

 

[JonM]

Saisons really need saison yeast and they like to be fermented really warm. Read up on the DuPont strain and some variations.

 

[ashmgee]

is the munich yeast not a belgian style yeast? the only other belgian style yeast at the store was a trappist, but that seemed more for a high OG beer. With this one I was shooting for a beer in the 5% range.

What would the notable difference be between a true saison and the munich yeast?
Thanks all, you are all so helpful.

 

[weirdboy]

Besides the yeast being critical, I would also point out that Saisons are typically Pilsner malt with *maybe* some Vienna or Munich for color/complexity. Caramel flavors are out of place in a Saison. You cannot really trust the beer software to tell you something is "to style" just because it's the right color. You need to consider the flavor and mouthfeel imparted by the things you are adding.

If it were me, I would use mostly Pilsner LME and maybe a pound of Munich LME to give it the distinctive color.


You might refer to the BJCP Style Guidelines for Saison (16C).

Munich is in Germany. It is by definition not a Belgian yeast. And, it's not going to give you the estery/spicy phenolic aroma and flavor that are characteristic of Saisons. You really do need a Saison yeast for a saison. It is one of those beers where proper yeast selection, pitching rates, and fermentation temperature are very critical to making the beer. I mean, those things are always important, but in a Saison it's just not going to remotely resemble what you have in mind otherwise.

 

[JonK331]

The Munich yeast will be much cleaner. 90% of the flavor in a Saison comes the yeast. No Saison yeast = no saison. If you can't keep the temp up at around 85 don't even bother. You can make a fine beer with what you have but it won't be a Saison. I'm not sure what your Munich LME is made up of but if it's 100% Munich malt then it is too dark for a Saison anyway.

 

[JonM]

Check out some online retailers - they might give more options.

If you do go for it, DuPont yeast is tricky to work with because it can give up too quickly. However, I had good results from WLP568. It's a blend of the traditional DuPont strain and another yeast. If the DuPont gives up, the other, less finicky yeast will take over and finish 'er out. cheers!

 

[ashmgee]

The Munich yeast will be much cleaner. 90% of the flavor in a Saison comes the yeast. No Saison yeast = no saison. If you can't keep the temp up at around 85 don't even bother. You can make a fine beer with what you have but it won't be a Saison. I'm not sure what your Munich LME is made up of but if it's 100% Munich malt then it is too dark for a Saison anyway.

thanks, I thought the LME looked a little dark, and there is no way for me to ferment at that high of a temp. one of the drawbacks of being on the northwest coast, and not having heating pads for reptiles or other method.

I guess it is back to the drawing board to figure out what kind of beer this will turn into.

 

[JonM]

You could do a fine wit or Belgian ale, if you're looking for something with that Belgain-y flavor.

 

[ashmgee]

thanks JonM, I originally was looking at doing a belgian, but don't know much about that style. When reading about them I seemed to be led the direction of saison.

now that I know what type recipes to look at I will know what add on stuff to look for. like I said, the store only carries a few supplies so for this one I will need to craft around the selection. Haven't really jumped in to the online sites because I wouldn't be buying enough to constitute the shipping that lots of those stores charge.

 

[JonM]

Take a look at HBT's recipe database. I'm pretty sure there's a Belgian section. Might give you some ideas.

 

[ashmgee]

Ok. I bought a lb of belgian biscuit and a lb of belgian aromatic to use as my first specialty additions. I know that I won't be using the full amounts so what amounts do you all think would be good and not overkill?

 

[JonM]

Try the search function for those malts. I've only used a tiny touch of biscuit in a brew. Others who've used both probably have posted comments in other threads. Cheers!

Oh, and it's the Belgian yeast that really makes a brew Belgian. Take a look at some of those too!

 

[ashmgee]

sorry about that JonM, the only time I tried to use the search function it didn't seem to work, but I wasn't registered here. Worked fine just now and that make things so much easier.

And I don't have to bug all you guys, although it is nice to get opinions.

p.s. "Donny...Your out of your element!!"

 

[JonM]

No worries - I wasn't trying to blow ya off or anything. Happy brewing!

 

[ashmgee]

well this one is in the fermenter. I guess it will be called a Munich Wheat, for lack of a better category. first time using specialty grains, but seemed to come together pretty easy. amber brown color so next time I think I will just use pale extract to try and get a lighter beer color, but I've read this is common for extract brews with out late extract addition.

hopefully it turns out good!