Recommendations for hydrogen sulfide removal in cider?

[Geremy]

Will it just blow off throughout secondary? Or will I need to pull it out somehow (precipitate?)?

 

[dmtaylor]

Time. Many weeks and it will be gone.

 

[Iseneye]

I ended up with what I considered to be hydrogen sulfide in a beer. Brewed it around 6 to 8 weeks ago and it has faded but I can still taste it.

 

[Maylar]

If it's still fermenting, stir it a couple times a day for a week. That'll help expel the sulfur.

 

[bernardsmith]

I strongly agree with Maylar. You might also up the temperature a little if the yeast is still active. You want a very vigorous fermentation to help blow off the S2O and you might want to remove the airlock and bung if you have sealed your primary. Allowing the S2O to sit in solution can help create mercaptans and mercaptans are a real problem to remove.

 

[BoozeMedic]

If still fermenting, immediately add diammonium phosphate (DAP). Do not do this if it's almost done fermenting.

If done fermenting:
A vigorous racking over copper (like copper scrubbing pads) will usually completely dissipate it, but introduces oxygen. If you rack over copper, I'd suggest putting it into a vessel immediately and topping off with co2.

Alternatively, you can just put it into a keg and blast it with co2 through the dip tube. That usually gets rid of the majority of it. Then let it age till it's gone.

I usually rack over copper, then put into a corny keg and blast it with co2 through the dip tube.

The real alternative is prevention. A 3 stage stepped nutrient addition is best. I add fermaid K at pitching, 1/3, and 2/3rds attenuation. If I follow that I never get SO2.

 

[jgmillr1]

Hold on, let's emphasize several statements in this thread so that neither the op or future readers get confused.

1) Hydrogen sulfide is H2S, not SO2
2) Time will not dissipate the H2S and can make the problem worse by allowing it to form disulfides/mercaptans (as stated already by @bernardsmith) which are harder resolve.
3) Copper is the solution to the problem but excess copper is toxic, so you must carefully make copper-sulfate additions so you don't poison yourself. See below for details.
4) Prevention is truly the key. Timely addition of yeast nutrients (as stated already by @BoozeMedic ) will largely prevent H2S formation.
5) H2S is an odor we are very sensitive to but it is also fairly soluble and does not come out of solution easily. So attempts to purge it out of solution with CO2 or splash racking are ineffective.
6) Be cautious with adding yeast nutrients toward the end of fermentation or you may end up feeding spoilage organisms with left-over nutrients.

To solve your H2S problem, get a bottle of 1% copper sulfate and add 0.75ml of it per gallon of your cider. Stir it in and smell it the next day. Repeat until the odor is gone. This slowly steps you toward removal of the H2S without introducing excess copper. It may take several doses. The copper will react with the H2S to form copper-sulfide which will precipitate out. Good luck and brew on.

 

[Geremy]

Hold on, let's emphasize several statements in this thread so that neither the op or future readers get confused.

1) Hydrogen sulfide is H2S, not SO2
2) Time will not dissipate the H2S and can make the problem worse by allowing it to form disulfides/mercaptans (as stated already by @bernardsmith) which are harder resolve.
3) Copper is the solution to the problem but excess copper is toxic, so you must carefully make copper-sulfate additions so you don't poison yourself. See below for details.
4) Prevention is truly the key. Timely addition of yeast nutrients (as stated already by @BoozeMedic ) will largely prevent H2S formation.
5) H2S is an odor we are very sensitive to but it is also fairly soluble and does not come out of solution easily. So attempts to purge it out of solution with CO2 or splash racking are ineffective.
6) Be cautious with adding yeast nutrients toward the end of fermentation or you may end up feeding spoilage organisms with left-over nutrients.

To solve your H2S problem, get a bottle of 1% copper sulfate and add 0.75ml of it per gallon of your cider. Stir it in and smell it the next day. Repeat until the odor is gone. This slowly steps you toward removal of the H2S without introducing excess copper. It may take several doses. The copper will react with the H2S to form copper-sulfide which will precipitate out. Good luck and brew on.

Thanks!!! This is exactly what I’m looking for. I had seen something suggesting a copper sulfate addition but wanted to confirm. Thanks everyone for your input!

 

[bernardsmith]

See if you can find copper sulfate packed for wine makers. I would be very wary about using this chemical in a haphazard manner. Copper Sulfate is not harmless. Try using copper wool (used for scrubbing pots and pans) first.

 

[Geremy]

See if you can find copper sulfate packed for wine makers. I would be very wary about using this chemical in a haphazard manner. Copper Sulfate is not harmless. Try using copper wool (used for scrubbing pots and pans) first.

I found some 1% copper sulfate solution (made from reagent grade copper sulfate pentahydrate). I’ve also reviewed the MSDS. Yes, I’m very wary of using this solution, and will be very precise and methodical while making additions. I’ll be adding 0.1 ppm at a time. Using copper wool in such an acidic liquid I couldn’t be precise as to the amount of copper ending up in the solution, so I’m committed to using the copper sulfate instead.

 

[BoozeMedic]

I found some 1% copper sulfate solution (made from reagent grade copper sulfate pentahydrate). I’ve also reviewed the MSDS. Yes, I’m very wary of using this solution, and will be very precise and methodical while making additions. I’ll be adding 0.1 ppm at a time. Using copper wool in such an acidic liquid I couldn’t be precise as to the amount of copper ending up in the solution, so I’m committed to using the copper sulfate instead.

I think I read that using yeast hulls and bentonite after a copper treatment will absorb and drop out all the copper, but don't quote me

 

[PacificPressed]

See if you can find copper sulfate packed for wine makers. I would be very wary about using this chemical in a haphazard manner. Copper Sulfate is not harmless. Try using copper wool (used for scrubbing pots and pans) first.

Hey! Sorry to jump on this thread many years after it was posted! But I have splash racked a cider (4 times back and forth) and added some SO2 to the carbuoy to prevent oxidation, and will check it a couple of days, maybe splash rack it again. But if I 'need' to go down the copper route, how would I use copper wool instead of copper sulfate solution. I have 1GL batches, so I read 0.5 - 0.75ml for that, but would love to know how to use copper wool instead if its better, less hazardous (and also to learn a new technique...!)

Thank you and hope to hear back

Tks,
A bad cider maker

 

[bernardsmith]

A couple of quick thoughts. Using copper wool - the sort you can buy at your local supermarket used for scrubbing pots is what some folk use. You might slip a few threads inside your siphon tube and rack through the threads or place a small bundle in a hop sock which you attach to the end of your siphon and rack through the sack. There is a potential hazard because you hav no way of controlling the amount of copper sulfate that is produced since you have no way of controlling the amount of copper that will bind to the sulfur molecules: what you are doing is essentially removing the H2S with the copper to produce copper sulfate and water.
OK, you are almost certainly only going to produce a microscopic amount of copper sulfate but that compound is toxic and your control over its production is zero.
Scotts Labs make a product called Reduless which will release a fixed and known amount of Cu into your wine to bind with the sulfur. Reduless is a yeast nutrient with a "large" amount of copper and once you add this per instructions you are adding a very tiny amount of the free copper. I think you can buy this for less than $3 for 3 g.
For some folk the production of H2S in cider making is something they have to live with, but I suspect that the problem may come from juice very low in nitrogen and from pitching a yeast that has a high demand for the same. You might try using 74B. That's a yeast that will transform about 40% of the malic acid into lactic to make a smoother hard cider. But that's another story.

 

[Raptor99]

Use Reduless for all the reasons @bernardsmith mentioned above. Copper is toxic, so you need a way to control the amount that you release into your cider.

 

[bernardsmith]

Use Reduless for all the reasons @bernardsmith mentioned above. Copper is toxic, so you need a way to control the amount that you release into your cider.

Not so certain that it is the copper, itself that is toxic, but for sure even a small quantity of copper sulfate can kill you dead. Using copper pots or copper wool to scrub pans would seem to be harmless even if you cook with lots of acidic foods or you are very aggressive when you clean with the wool.

 

[PacificPressed]

Thanks both! One point on the copper sulfate 1% solution (As a friend has some, and ordering the Reduless will take until next week for me).

I am very paranoid about the copper sulfate, but if I do use that, I have read varying reports on the dosage and I do not want to poison myself... I have read on one page that it's 1.5ml per gallon (but was referring to wine) on another 0.75ml per gallon (referring to cider), and on another 0.5ml per gallon (referring to cider). I am thinking of doing just 0.1ml as the smell has mostly subsided, or should I just wait and order the Reduless? It would arrive Monday. I may splash rack one more time tonight also.

Thanks again, what a big help!