Perry. Need some recipe advice...

[Snowden]

Hi all,

My first cider (Freezeblade's https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f81/grahams-english-cider-107152/) is happily bubbling away, yet I am already looking for a recipe for cider batch #2. After reading extensively, I would love to do a batch of perry.

I haven't been particularly inspired by the recipes I have found, so I was curious what your thoughts are on potentially modifying Freezeblade's recipe to produce a full-blown perry (utilizing Gerber pear juice) or a pear flavored apple cider with pears added to the primary.

Seems like maintaining the pear flavor seems to often be a challenge...

Thoughts? Suggestions? Critiques? Ideas? Everything is appreciated!

Thanks in advance for your help!


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[Snowden]

Bump!


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[Renoun]

I can't offer much help. I finally gave up on my perry which had sulfur issues and went through multiple fining/racking from November through mid-April. Eventually it cleared beautifully. We tried various acid additions and sweetening without much success. It wound up being so bland that it was better blended with fully fermented apple cider and bottled. Don't know if I'll try a perry next year or just blend while pressing.

 

[Snowden]

Thanks for the great info, Renoun. Looks like a solid perry is definitely a challenge!


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[tokerlund]

I bought Vintner's Harvest 96oz can and then made a 3 gallon batch which I added to a 1 gallon batch of from-pear cider I was attempting. In the end, it simply had almost no pear flavor. I bought some 'essence of pear' or some such thing. . . maybe pear extract. I got 3, 1oz bottles from Amazon and it took 2 of the bottles in my 4 gallon batch (in a keg) to be able to taste pear. That was disappointing because I could have just made apple cider with champagne yeast which would strip out all the flavor, then added the pear extract and had the same result. Now, I just make peach cider, strawberry cider, raspberry cider and the like. At least they keep their flavor. I buy my wife Fox Barrel Perry because it is 100% perry and in the end it is cheaper and less work than home brewing perry.

 

[Jakey2005]

Has anyone found a way to keep some of the pear flavor or at least essence when making pear cider/perry? I too actually bought a 96oz can of the Vinters Harvest and it's so disappointing to hear that even with that much you don't get even a hint of pear. Funny you mention amazon because I also purchased pear extract from there as a backup but was hoping to not need much. From what you're saying it's almost required to get any pear from your cider. I figured I would backsweeten with some lactose in the end anyhow but was hoping that would only be to make it sweeter and the pear essence would already be there.

 

[Randzor]

You could try fermenting at 40 F. It'll take a long time but it may save the flavor more. Also use a yeast that gives a hint of pear, as that might also help.

 

[phug]

In canada the loblaws chains incl superstore have a president's choice unfiltered Bartlett pear/ macintosh cider that I've used with ec1118 and that one does leave you with some pear in the aroma and flavour, but the pear in there is very close to a banana aroma


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[gratus fermentatio]

The problem with making perry (peary) in the US is the pears. We don't have access to the real perry pears; just like there are certain varieties of apple to make real apple cider with, there are special varieties of pears that are grown specifically for making perry.

There is enough flavour in non-cider apples to make an acceptable apple cider from them, but the flavour of pears, especially non-cider pears, is much more subtle & is easily lost or overpowered by other fruits/flavours. I've had pear wine that was so dull, drab & boring that it reminded me of a wet dishrag. Not a literal flavour description, but the pears wine was lacking in just about everything that you would expect from any wine. Maybe it would've been better if it had been sparkling, but it definitely needed something.

Perry pears have more flavour, more acids, more tannins than the eating/dessert pears we have access to here in the US. You could add acid blend & tannin, but you run the risk of using too much. I've over done it with adding tannin, that wine had sort of an astringent plastic taste. A little bit goes a long way.

Short of growing your own perry pears or having a couple bushels shipped to you from France, you're stuck with using eating pears. You might get more flavour if you doubled or tripled the amount of fruit in your cider/wine & use a yeast that won't strip out aromatics, like an ale yeast.

Most importantly, use fruit that is RIPE; unless you gain something from using some unripe fruit, such things are done. Storebought pears are almost always hard as rocks; ripe pears are a bit soft. You might try a few different varieties too. My fav is the Bosc, but you might have better luck with a red D'Anjou. You could vary your juice by blending the juice of green Bartletts with the juice of red D'Anjou and maybe even ripe Bartletts. Add a small dose of wine tannin & acid blend, make it a sparkling perry & you might have something worth drinking.

You might find these useful:
http://www.usapears.com/Recipes And Lifestyle/Now Serving/Pears and Varieties.aspx
And:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/scrumpy/cider/perry.htm
Just my 2 cents worth. Regards, GF.

 

[wozzer]

The problem with making perry (peary) in the US is the pears. We don't have access to the real perry pears; just like there are certain varieties of apple to make real apple cider with, there are special varieties of pears that are grown specifically for making perry.

There is enough flavour in non-cider apples to make an acceptable apple cider from them, but the flavour of pears, especially non-cider pears, is much more subtle & is easily lost or overpowered by other fruits/flavours. I've had pear wine that was so dull, drab & boring that it reminded me of a wet dishrag. Not a literal flavour description, but the pears wine was lacking in just about everything that you would expect from any wine. Maybe it would've been better if it had been sparkling, but it definitely needed something.

Perry pears have more flavour, more acids, more tannins than the eating/dessert pears we have access to here in the US. You could add acid blend & tannin, but you run the risk of using too much. I've over done it with adding tannin, that wine had sort of an astringent plastic taste. A little bit goes a long way.

Short of growing your own perry pears or having a couple bushels shipped to you from France, you're stuck with using eating pears. You might get more flavour if you doubled or tripled the amount of fruit in your cider/wine & use a yeast that won't strip out aromatics, like an ale yeast.

Most importantly, use fruit that is RIPE; unless you gain something from using some unripe fruit, such things are done. Storebought pears are almost always hard as rocks; ripe pears are a bit soft. You might try a few different varieties too. My fav is the Bosc, but you might have better luck with a red D'Anjou. You could vary your juice by blending the juice of green Bartletts with the juice of red D'Anjou and maybe even ripe Bartletts. Add a small dose of wine tannin & acid blend, make it a sparkling perry & you might have something worth drinking.

You might find these useful:
http://www.usapears.com/Recipes And Lifestyle/Now Serving/Pears and Varieties.aspx
And:
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/scrumpy/cider/perry.htm
Just my 2 cents worth. Regards, GF.

I think this post is right onto it. If you've reached a competence in wine/cider-making that satisfies you, the critical difference remaining is the breed/quality of raw material you are working with. I've made several pear wines, rather than strict perries, and the variance between pear breeds is striking. It mirrors the difference between apple breeds I've used when making apple wines. Some apples make great drinks. Others are just best eaten, or sauced and served with pork. You soon learn which.

 

[Andy111863]

Hey! Hoping some of you guys might still have the same emails...

I've just put on a gallon of perry - there's a perry pear tree near my house in the UK and I have a mate with an apple press.

The juice was incredibly tannin-y, made your mouth feel full of fur after a sip but I thought this might go away during fermentation. It's been bubbling for two weeks now with the natural yeast from the fruit and tastes great, except for the fact there's still loads, if perhaps slightly less, tannin.

Anyone know what I can do about this? There's a chance some of the fruit weren't quite ripe (perry pears don't go soft when they are so difficult to be sure) but I think at least 80% were. I don't want to add sweater as it's all balanced at the moment... Would this go away with age?

Any ideas would be incredible, cheers!

 

[Maylar]

Fining with gelatin is supposed to reduce tannins.

 

[Masbustelo]

I have read that with true perry pears that the fruit is ground or milled and then left for 24 hours and then pressed. The exposure to oxygen for 24 hours is supposed to bring down the tannin levels.