Partigyle for two lagers?

[FourSeasonAngler]

I have a high OG lager recipe (1071) I've been planning to brew and I'm wondering if it would be worth my time and effort to bump up the grain bill a touch to get another smaller beer out of the mash. Maybe something in the 1038 to 1045 range...

Has anyone done this with a lager recipe?

My grist is 75% pils, 10% Vienna, 10% flaked corn, 5% Carapils and if I'm making two beers out of this I can make the bigger beer as planned with Motueka hops up to 30 IBUs, and make the smaller beer more traditional with some Tettnanger or Mt. Hood to 22 - 25 IBUs...

 

[JKaranka]

You don't have to make a big and small beer. You can blend the two boiled worts in the fermenters so that you end up with closer OGs for each beer. E.g., use 3/5 of boiled first runnings and 2/5 of boiled second runnings for the stronger beer and the opposite proportions for the weaker beer. You can do some quick calculations on what strength you want your lagers at.

 

[FourSeasonAngler]

You don't have to make a big and small beer. You can blend the two boiled worts in the fermenters so that you end up with closer OGs for each beer. E.g., use 3/5 of boiled first runnings and 2/5 of boiled second runnings for the stronger beer and the opposite proportions for the weaker beer. You can do some quick calculations on what strength you want your lagers at.

How would I hop them differently then?

 

[JKaranka]

Any way you feel like. You can make the stronger wort more bitter and the weaker wort more aromatic for example. You can even use different hops all the way through. As you end up blending the worts both of the beers you end up will be relatively balanced (definitively a lot more balanced than having a first wort beer and a small beer!). Again, it's worth working out the rough IBUs in advance.

Btw: it's the same way as Whitbread use to make all their stouts and porters (partigyled together, the four or five of them) or the way that Fullers still makes their bitters. They are not a weak and strong version of the same beer, but have distinctive characters coming from well thought blends.

 

[JKaranka]

If you check the comments here:
http://barclayperkins.blogspot.co.uk/2010/04/parti-gyle-examples.html

You can see how Fullers produce 3 beers: London Pride, ESB and Chiswick Bitter by partigyling 2 different worts. You don't need to get the same amounts of each either, so they get twice as much London Pride as either one of the other two beers.

 

[FourSeasonAngler]

I see what you're saying, but if I want two beers that are about the same OG, why wouldn't I just split a double batch and blend from there?

What you are suggesting is doing a partigyle so I can blend the two worts before (or after) they ferment. This seems like it is further complicating a rather simple process.

I want to take one grist and make two beers from it, one big and one small.

 

[JKaranka]

Technically that is not a partigyle then. Partigyles are designed to make the most use of your mash and get a variety of consistent beers as an output. For example, a Victorian brewer would have combined boils of first and second runnings to make X (1050), XX (1065), and XXX (1080) with just one mash and two boils. A LOT easier than doing three mashes and three boils.

 

[uncleleon]

Technically that is not a partigyle then. Partigyles are designed to make the most use of your mash and get a variety of consistent beers as an output. For example, a Victorian brewer would have combined boils of first and second runnings to make X (1050), XX (1065), and XXX (1080) with just one mash and two boils. A LOT easier than doing three mashes and three boils.

Everyone here needs to get this terminology correct.

As for the second runnings beer, you can add more grain to the mash, make a smaller batch, or add extract or sugar to hit target OG.

 

[uncleleon]

That being said. Experiment and take measurements. Make as many beers as you can!

I have found that without a mashout rest I loose efficiency, but I don't denature enzymes.

Also, I'm getting different slightly
more grainy taste out of second runnings. And if you throw in character malts it's just like steeping.

I like this experiment. Please let us know what you did and what you've found. Discribe Flavors!