Partial mash and then steep?

[mcleanmj]

Hi all,

I've never done a partial mash before, but have done many all grain batches and a few extract. I don't currently have the capacity for all grain, but I'd like to make this recipe:

https://homebrewsupply.com/goose-island-bourbon-county-stout-clone-all-grain-recipe-kit/https://homebrewsupply.com/goose-island-bourbon-county-stout-clone-extract-recipe-kit/
However, I am unable to find Munich LME (in Canada), and would prefer to mash it anyway. If I were to mash the 5 lbs of Munich and all the specialty grains with 1 lb of 2-row, I end up with fairly low diastatic power, and an enormous grain bill. If I only mash the Munich and 1 lb of 2-row, I get higher diastatic power and a smaller grain bill. So, it seems more reasonable to do the partial mash with only the Munich and the 2-row, and then to steep the specialty grains afterwards. However, being new to partial mash, I'm not sure if high diastatic power is important for the specialty grains or if there would be any difference between including them in the mash vs. steeping them separately? Could including lots of specialty grains in the mash reduce the ability of the 2-row and Munich to convert? And is there any problem with doing a mash followed by a steep? I've not seen this anywhere.

Thanks a lot if anyone can shed some light...

 

[VikeMan]

If I were to mash the 5 lbs of Munich and all the specialty grains with 1 lb of 2-row, I end up with fairly low diastatic power, and an enormous grain bill. If I only mash the Munich and 1 lb of 2-row, I get higher diastatic power and a smaller grain bill.

What do the DP numbers look like?

However, being new to partial mash, I'm not sure if high diastatic power is important for the specialty grains or if there would be any difference between including them in the mash vs. steeping them separately?

I would include any grains that will be in the mash as part of the DP calculation. Even though specialty malts like roasted barley and caramel malts don't have much in the way of unconverted starches, they do take up space in the mash tun and make it harder for enzymes to meet starches.

 

[mcleanmj]

What do the DP numbers look like?

47 L for all grains together, 73 L for only the Munich and 2-row

 

[VikeMan]

47 L for all grains together, 73 L for only the Munich and 2-row

47 Lintner is plenty.

 

[Ralphie0523]

Munich is also a Base Malt, should have plenty of DP to convert. Steeping specialty grains after the partial mash is essentially like capping the mash. It is a technique some people use with more roasty specialty grains to limit the flavor contribution while extracting the color contribution. I personally have no experience with it but I am sure everyone's friend Google can help.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

However, being new to partial mash,

Partial mash (or mini-mash) is a mash of part of the wort. You may be new the technique, but you understand the concepts.

Methods of Modern Homebrewing is a good reference book for brewing techniques - includuing partial mashing and steeping techniques.

I'm not sure if high diastatic power is important for the specialty grains or if there would be any difference between including them in the mash vs. steeping them separately?

Testing fermentability of crystal malt (HBT)

And is there any problem with doing a mash followed by a steep? I've not seen this anywhere.

It would work (but it would be a longer brew day). With two heat sources (at the same time) one could also mini-mash in one pot & steep in other.

 

[Charles c]

Has anyone tried John Palmer Partial Mash method of combining dissolve extract and grain bag in kettle cold water. Then heat to 150-160 degrees for 30 minutes. After that regular step boiling hops, etc.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

Has anyone tried John Palmer Partial Mash method of combining dissolve extract and grain bag in kettle cold water.

How to Brew, including the 4th edition, suggests steeping crystal/roasted malts in wort (made from DME/LME) as a way to avoid extracting tannins. In this situation, there are no enzymes in the wort, so it's not a partial mash, just a steep to extract existing sugars / flavors / colors from the crystal/roasted malts.

If you have a link to a specific process, that would be helpful.

 

[Charles c]

Thank you, I got the information from How to Brew 4th edition. So this is a better way to a standard recipe steps of soaking the grain bag in hot water then sparge grain bag with 170 degree water? It sounds like you stated How to Brew steeping would avoid extracting tannins.

 

[BrewnWKopperKat]

The process (steeping crystal/caramel/roasted malts in wort at 120-170 for 30 minutes) is on p 12 of chapter 1. If you are getting tannins from your steeping process, it may be worth giving this process a try.

I'm neutral towards the process. When I brew extract+steep, it's intended to be a short brew day. So I steep while heating the full volume of distilled/RO water: I add the steeping grains at "flame-on" and when the water gets to around 160F I remove the grains without squeezing the bag. I haven't noticed tannins when steeping this way.

edit: updated to note use of distilled/RO water when brewing extract+steep.