Overdone citric acid or just contamination?

[Trenloco]

Hello brewers , I'm having a issue with my latest beer and would like some input.

This Wednesday I kegged an amber ale fermented for 2 weeks in primary with s04.

In every gravity sample I took (at kegging and throughout fermentation) I could always taste a really acid flavor (tart might be a better descriptor), but not much on the nose , just taste.

Now I tried a half-carbed sample and the taste lingers, it's just hard to drink with such an acid aftertaste.

For reference I used around 13 grams of citric acid (almost half an ounce) for 34L of final beer (10 gallons). I can't measure pH so blindly rely on brewers friend water calc for mash pH adjustment.

I'm worried as this is my first time using a second-hand speidel fermenter I bought recently. It harbours no scratches but I'm really worried it might have come with some uninvited guests.

What should I do? I really don't want to risk another spoilt batch, but at the same time it could be just the acid I'm tasting.

If I rule out infection (how??) I have some leftovers of brown ale I could blend the amber with to drown the tartness in smoke and roast.

Thanks ahead !

 

[Jag75]

Did this issue just start with the new to you fermenter?

 

[Trenloco]

I think so , I had a beer go slightly tart before with a similar dose of acid, but it was an IPA so it was more a feature than a flaw.

The brown I fermented in a diff vessel and has no tart flavour whatsoever, used same hoses and stuff to transfer than I used on the tart amber

 

[IslandLizard]

Citric Acid does leave a citrusy flavor above a certain ppm. Not sure where that becomes noticeable in a beer.
Phosphoric Acid (the acid used in most sodas such as Cokes) is much more neutral in flavor (character), but intensely sour.
Lactic Acid is a little less neutral, but often more acceptable as a flavor in beer when it shows.

Are you sure that's the right amount to correct your mash/sparge pH?
If your resulting beer tastes positively sour it may well be from adding too much acid that didn't get neutralized by the alkalinity/hardness of your water, which is all you're after.

Also try Bru'n Water's calculator, it's free. See if it recommends different amounts of acid. You can compare using Phosphoric Acid or Lactic Acid and then proportion your Citric Acid, if that's all you can get, accordingly.
Do you know your brewing water's mineral profile? Does it change with time/seasons? That could throw your beer off suddenly.

Your Speidel:
Have you completely disassembled the spigot on the bottom? And scrubbed, cleaned and well sanitized the all the parts, threads, openings, seals, etc.?
There can also be welding seams on the inside of the body that are rough, feel around for anything that could harbor bugs.
Rubber seals can harbor bugs too. Boil or at least soak in hot water with a good cleanser such as (homemade) PBW or at least a (generic) Oxiclean. Or replace them if that'd an option.

After thorough scrubbing, cleaning and a close grime inspection, bleach bombing is always a good idea.
Followed by a sun bath. Place open in direct sun for a few days, making sure all the inside surface can get a good UV soak, it kills bugs.

 

[jgmillr1]

For reference I used around 13 grams of citric acid (almost half an ounce) for 34L of final beer (10 gallons)

I have somewhat alkali water since I'm on a well and it goes through a water softener. It is about 7.8 out of the tap. I have to dose citric at a rate of about 0.75g/gal at mash to achieve a pH of 5.3. This is in addition to the effects of the malt and 1g/gal dose of gypsum. Your 13g in 10gal is almost double that rate, so you might want to try halving your dose next time and see if that helps.

You could also try a pinch of baking soda in a glass to see if neutralizing the excess acidity helps you determine if is just excess acidity or spoilage.

 

[Trenloco]

Looking up citric acid , found that flavor threshold is 150 ppm (I'm at nearly triple that for this recipe). My water is highly alkaline and hard to boot, so I might switch to bottled water as there is no way I can get mash pH near 5.3 without using too much acid. Will give brunwater a try though to confirm this.

Nevertheless, I performed extensive cleaning and sanitizing of everything involved with this beer just in case.

As for the beer , it's gorgeous looking (pic for proof) and I really don't want to dump it down the drain. Will try to blend with my other darker batch to see if I can get the acid subdued enough.

 

[Tobor_8thMan]

Let is sit for awhile. The acid "bite" will subside.

 

[IslandLizard]

I have somewhat alkali water since I'm on a well and it goes through a water softener

Don't you get a load of Sodium in exchange for that?

 

[jgmillr1]

Don't you get a load of Sodium in exchange for that?

Yeah but it's better than the load of iron that comes with the well water. Maybe an RO system will be in the offings for me sometime.

 

[Trenloco]

Well, I doubled checked with brunwater. The spreadsheet suggests adding half the acid that brewers friend told me to. It tells me my mash pH was around 5.0 (which may explain the unusually low mash eff. I had).
Upon tasting a bottle of another amber ale I made some weeks ago with similar acid amounts, I could def. taste the tartness hidden beneath the caramel. This amber was done in another carboy.

Everything points to a citric acid overdose lol. Will try to brew this week with brunwater recommended acid amount. If anyones here uses the spreadsheet Im having trouble calculating final ppm values for water. I usually add Calcium chloride as my water has 30 Ca ppm and I want at least 50 ppm. Brunwater shows me my mash water overview, but not the final one, which I would want to see to check if Calcium is at more than 50 ppm in the wort that goes into fermenter. Does anyone know how can I get around this?

Annnd finally, and sorry for the many walls of text, what could I do to fix this sour amber?? Diluting with water ? Blending? Adding minute amounts of some base? Waiting it out? Any input is much appreciated

 

[IslandLizard]

Brunwater shows me my mash water overview, but not the final one, which I would want to see to check if Calcium is at more than 50 ppm in the wort that goes into fermenter. Does anyone know how can I get around this?

I think I know what you're asking.
Just realize that the grain (malts and adjuncts) itself also adds minerals to your wort. So numbers based on your water alone may be misleading.

But we do know the ion content in you mash/sparge water: Tab 4. Water Adjustment. Look at the first table (the one on top). The last line "Mashing Water Profile" gives you the ppm for your mashing/sparging water. Now the ppm values gets concentrated due to boil off, so they will be a higher in your fermenter.
Same info is in Tab 5. Adjustment Summary.

You could ask this question in our Brew Science forum and see what the gurus there have to say.