Over attenuation in a big beer

[rjman53]

I attempted my first AG barleywine about two weeks ago and decided to take a gravity reading to see how it was doing. The OG was 1.091 and 12 days in the gravity had dropped to 1.013. I had been expecting, after everything I'd read about making big beers, to have problems getting the FG down in the low 20s--but 13!? The recipe for the beer was essentially the 999 Barleywine from this site. I had to do two mashes in two separate tuns to fit the 20lbs+ grain bill and then combine them for the boil. Both rested for 60 min around 153 (which was a few degree below where I was aiming but seemed like it would still produce only a moderately dry beer). I used 1.5 qts/lb of grain.
This was also my first time attempting a parti-gyle brew so the barelywine was a no sparge batch. I racked the wort onto the yeast cake of an IPA (1.061 OG) I had just moved into secondary. I used two thermometers to get my mash temps. Is the only explanation for this that both thermometers were off, and I was actually mashing much lower? The beer is very dry and has a nasty alcohol burn; the big maltiness I was expecting was completely absent. I afraid it may be undrinkable. That said, can it be salvaged? Or is it to early to tell?
Oh yeah, ambient room temp that my carboys sit in stays around 66 degrees.

 

[Irrenarzt]

If it's not infected, it's not undrinkable. Perhaps build it up a bit with some maltodextrin? Or maybe do another and blend them? Or trade 5 gallons on craigslist for something you need (bartering is fun).

I doubt it'll be undrinkable. I hate diacetyl, fusels or infections. Anything other than that is getting drunk down for sure...

 

[rjman53]

Thanks for the quick reply. The beer wasn't infected. I just seemed intolerably alcoholic and dry. I'm considering a blend with the APA I made from the second running. If I was to add maltodextrin, how would I go about it?

 

[maskednegator]

Your less than 2 week old, 10.2% abv beer isn't ready to drink yet? Stop the presses!
Stick it bottles or secondary for 6 months, then come back to it. I would be absolutely shocked if it doesn't eventually come together.

 

[rjman53]

OK. Like I said, this was my first attempt at a big beer. The rapid drop in gravity was totally unexpected so I just thought I'd ask. Is that sharp alcohol bite generally a characteristic of a green beer?

 

[maskednegator]

Yes, "hot" alcohols will mellow with time.

 

[greenbirds]

What yeast strain did you use?

Also, I think the mashing procedure you used may be to blame. While that first mash sat around waiting for your second mash, a drop in temperature (maybe down below 150 F?) could have let enzymatic activity (beta amylase?) proceed unchecked, thinning your wort. I'm not 100% sure that's possible, but it seems so reading this thread: http://www.craftkb.com/Uwe/Forum.aspx/brewing/5080/Mashout-Questions

I'd definitely let that sucker age though. Could mellow out nicely with time.

 

[hollywoodbrew]

10% ABV is not bad at all, especially if it has high IBUs.

I bet if you sit on it for 3+ months it will be glorious.

 

[rjman53]

Thanks for the reassurance. I hope you guys are right. The IBUs are right about 100. I used a White Labs 001 California Ale yeast cake from an IPA that I'd just moved into secondary. I expected that a five gallon propagator batch would really get things going quickly but not that quickly.
I actually had to let the wort from both mashes sit around for quite a while before going to the boil since I only have one kettle and wanted to do a second run on both mash tuns. So the first run had to sit for two to three hours before boil. I hadn't considered that the enzyme activity hadn't stopped, but that makes sense; I'm sure the temp got well below 150.

 

[JuanMoore]

You essentially had a 4 hour long mash, much of it within the beta amylase enzyme range, so it's no surprise it came out super dry. As others have said, sit on it for a few months and then try it again. It will still probably be drier and more alcoholic than you intended, but it should mellow out considerably over time.

 

[rjman53]

Guess this one is going in the learning experience column.

If I were to do another big beer in the future, is there a way I can still do two seperate mashes without getting an overly dry beer? Could I simply do a thicker mash and then mashout to avoid this? Or would I just need to suck it up and buy a bigger tun? As long as I got the temp high enough to stop the enzyme activity, I could let the wort sit around and cool before the boil with no ill effect, right?

 

[JuanMoore]

As long as you get it over 168-170F it will denature (kill) the enzymes and you should be good to go. Whether you do this by heating the runnings or doing a mashout is up to you. After that you can let it sit at whatever temp you want for up to about 12 hours. Letting it sit too long is an invitation for an infection, and while the critters will get killed during the boil, the off flavors they produced may not. Letting it sit for 2-4 hours shouldn't be a problem at all.

 

[Got Trub?]

Oh yeah, ambient room temp that my carboys sit in stays around 66 degrees.

Did you control the fermentation temperature? Fermentation generates heat so if you didn't cool your fermentor during fermentation it could easily be 10 or more degrees warmer than ambient. If thats the case some of that hot alcohol flavour will not age away as it is caused by fusel alcohols generated by too warm a fermentation temperature.

GT

 

[rjman53]

I'm still working on a good way to control fermentation temp. I haven't got a spare fridge or anything so I've been reading a little on how others do it. Right now, setting them in the coolest part if my house is all I've been doing and has worked fine for my previous batches. I'm beginning to feel like I got some loose ends in my brewing processes I need to take care of though; that being one of them.

Thanks a lot for all the feedback. I'm learning a ton.

 

[artyboy]

I just had a Tommyknocker's Butthead earlier that I got in a mixed, random case that I picked up at a local liquor store. The label was removed so who knows how long it sat around before someone decided to toss it in a grab bag. I've had it before and the alcohol flavor has always been extremely overpowering (14% abv lager). I couldn't even taste the alcohol in this one. Give it time and it should mellow out nicely. If you just can't stand the thought of letting it sit around for a while then you can always send it to me. I'll let you know how it tastes in a year.