Noob infection w/pix

[Sammy75]

Ok, so apparently I picked up something between primary and 2ndary on my AHS pumpkin ale. This is just my 2nd batch ever.

Thoughts on this one? I was going to bottle sometime in the next week or so, do I just siphon from below that crud and see how it turns out? I know I know, RDWHAH and all, but that's not terribly nice looking. Does anybody know what that is and what I ought to do about it?

Thanks much!

 

[Runyanka]

No pics, probably because your new, not a supporting member, so you need 25+ posts for pics to show up.

 

[brewingkitty]

based on the present evidence, nothing can yet be discerned.

 

[CaptainCoconut]

Definitely not normal.

I'm no expert, but I'd think that punching anything through that top layer to siphon it out would bring it along too.

I'd just wait and see...

 

[Sammy75]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/49052497@N00/sets/72157624835029741/ In case you still can't see.

 

[millworkman]

I see the pics, looks like the baddies made tunnels connecting their colonies, looks kind of cool. I am no expert but if you can siphon from under the crud you should be good, may taste a little funny.

 

[Suex]

I just asked the same thing..... I've gone under it to get the brew, everything worked out fine, but I have no idea what it is...

 

[carnevoodoo]

Great infection! You should taste it.

If it is going sour (and that is what I am guessing this is. It looks like lacto), I'd guess lactobacillus. Naturally occurring on grain husks and in other places. Pretty common.

If it is going towards vinegar, I'd say acetobacter. This is actually how they make malt vinegar. Common with fruit flies.

Edit: What should you do about it? This will continue to develop. If you bottle it, let it carb and drink it FAST. This is something that will just tear through your beer if you wait. When it gets properly carbed, refrigerate it so you can stop organisms from growing as fast.

 

[Sammy75]

Um, ok, sure why not. I'll go pull some and taste it. Supposing it is either of those, either the lactobacillus or acetobacter, what does that mean for the livelihood of the batch?

Thx!

 

[Suthrncomfrt1884]

MAKE SURE when you bottle this that your gravity has stayed the same for at least a week. Depending on what kind of infection you have, it may create bottle bombs. If it's lacto, it will probably taste sour, and as voodoo said, it will only get worse. Some infected beers turn out okay, some don't. It all depends on your personal taste.

 

[Sammy75]

In my totally non-expert opinion i'd say a maybe a little sour? Difficult for me to say though, given that I'm not really all that familiar with beer in these stages. So then lacto, which you say comes from grain husks and other places. If it did come from a grain husk, how the heck did it get through the boil alive, or do you think it's a cross-contamination issue?

And why only in the 2ndary? This was definitely not there in the primary.

Ok, so check gravity. If it has been changing since I moved it to secondary then that means what? It was stable when I moved from primary to secondary, I'm guessing you mean if it has changed since then, or continues to change? If that's the case then what does that mean?

Again, thanks!

 

[carnevoodoo]

Um, ok, sure why not. I'll go pull some and taste it. Supposing it is either of those, either the lactobacillus or acetobacter, what does that mean for the livelihood of the batch?

Thx!

The batch is infected. Depending on the style, it'll either be not that bad or downright gross. Let us know what it tastes like.

Suthrncomfrt1884: The only issue I see with waiting for the gravity to drop is that these bugs are fighting for food and they can become super-attenuative. This beer could drop to near 1.000 or even lower (I had an infected beer at .997) and at that point, this beer is no longer what you think it is.

 

[carnevoodoo]

So, it could be cross contamination. A little dust is all it would take. There is a lot of lacto that naturally occurs in the world, too. It is everywhere. This could just be a sanitation issue.

edit: I'd bottle, carb, chill, and drink ASAP. Maybe keep it in plastic bags in your fridge just in case stuff starts exploding. Honestly, I think you'll be ok.

 

[Sammy75]

Thx folks, will do. Hopefully I can get it bottled tomorrow night. Then I'll find a plastic bin or something, line that with plastic bags, duct tape it shut, and lock it in a safe or something. I can only imagine how SWMBO will feel about bottle bombs.

 

[carnevoodoo]

Thx folks, will do. Hopefully I can get it bottled tomorrow night. Then I'll find a plastic bin or something, line that with plastic bags, duct tape it shut, and lock it in a safe or something. I can only imagine how SWMBO will feel about bottle bombs.

Just open one after a week instead of two. Honestly, I think you'll be ok.

 

[Sammy75]

The batch is infected. Depending on the style, it'll either be not that bad or downright gross. Let us know what it tastes like.

Kinda tastes like warm flat beer. Given it's my 2nd beer, and a pumpkin ale, I'm not sure what that would taste like at this stage. As I mentioned, maybe a tiny bit sour as voodoo suggested, but that could be my mind playing tricks.

 

[jfr1111]

Thx folks, will do. Hopefully I can get it bottled tomorrow night. Then I'll find a plastic bin or something, line that with plastic bags, duct tape it shut, and lock it in a safe or something. I can only imagine how SWMBO will feel about bottle bombs.

This is probably what I would do too. I've seen bottle bombs happen and while they usually don't cause too much of a mess... scrap that, they are a pain to clean, especially when you catch them after the beer had time to dry .

 

[KeithMoonsLiver]

I'd burn my apartment down if I ever saw something like that going on.

 

[tallybrewer]

Oh, you brewed a marshmallow ale...

 

[Sammy75]

Oh, you brewed a marshmallow ale...

If only...I imagine that'd go nicely with the pumpkin.

 

[Fletch78]

If he dosed it with campden tabs and/or metabisulfite, or p. sorpate, or should I say "wine stabilizer", in his bottling bucket, would it still carbonate, but halt the infection?

 

[Legin]

I've had mold colonies look somewhat similar, given that was after three months. Yup, making sure if the FG lowers is a good way to go. Wouldn't want bottle bombs.

 

[coastwx]

I dry-hopped in a secondary a month or so ago and over a week, got something very similar on top of the floating hops. I thought the addition of hops did not infect beer, so it could have been that my secondary carboy was not complete clean or the siphon. Anyhow, it smelled a little funky. I siphoned to a bottling bucket and bottled. There was a faint odor, but it was drinkable.

 

[Sammy75]

So tonight I took another gravity reading, and it was pretty much indistinguishable from the SG reading from when I dropped it into secondary. So I siphoned underneath that crud, bottled, and sampled a good bit along the way. Tastes just fine. I'm fairly certain there'll be no problem. I'll keep you guys updated though. I did take some precautionary action against bottle bombs, and am soaking both the primary and secondary buckets overnight in starsan, cuz eff whatever that stuff was.

 

[johnnybrew]

Good luck. But I have to say that those pics were scary!

 

[Sammy75]

2 weeks in bottles, no bombs, tasted at the 1 and 2 week marks. All signs are good! Still undercarbed and a little bit green tasting, but otherwise great! Crisis averted, no cause for alarm.

 

[jfr1111]

Just goes to show how hard you have to work to ruin a beer. You basically had cheese growing over it and it came out fine. I've read that the pellicule can grow back in the bottle, so be aware of that if you share with friends so they don't get disgusted when they see the film on the inside.

 

[Sammy75]

Yeah, every once in a while i've been pulling one out and checking out the top surface to see if there's anything interesting there. So far so good.

 

[WillPall]

This thread should be required reading for those who love the phrase, "Oh noes! My beer is 'fected!"

 

[AugustDerleth]

I'd burn my apartment down if I ever saw something like that going on.

HAhAHahaAHa!
This thread was very reassuring to me. I had read "You have to try REAL hard to ruin a batch" and kinda thought "ehhhhh i don't knoooow.." but if THIS turned out just fine?! :fro:

 

[KrayzieVanh]

Is there any smell related to a infection? I ask because I bottle in a bucket. I can't help myself from smelling the co2 from the airlock. Smells great! I wouldn't like to know of an infection before I take the lid off.

 

[CaptainCoconut]

Is there any smell related to a infection? I ask because I bottle in a bucket. I can't help myself from smelling the co2 from the airlock. Smells great! I wouldn't like to know of an infection before I take the lid off.

You wouldn't? You'd rather be surprised and wait to deal with it until bottling time?

 

[AugustDerleth]

You wouldn't? You'd rather be surprised and wait to deal with it until bottling time?

That was almost undoubtedly a typo. I believe the point of his post was that he wanted to be able to tell simply by smelling the airlock so as to not disturb the c02 blanket unecessarily. I think anyways.

 

[KrayzieVanh]

Yea.... I like smelling the CO2, smells great. I haven't had a infection yet (knocks on wood), so I don't know what one smells like- if it does like smell anything.

 

[CaptainCoconut]

That was almost undoubtedly a typo. I believe the point of his post was that he wanted to be able to tell simply by smelling the airlock so as to not disturb the c02 blanket unecessarily. I think anyways.

So I assumed, I just couldn't leave it alone. At least I amuse myself.

 

[goodwood]

wow. i would have tossed this down the drain. i love all kinds of sours, but that looked nasty. cheers for going through the whole process.

we are near completion of our all grain setup. well be kegging beer till we get a good batch. after i read all the posts, i would have kegged it. but not bottled it. too much of a risk. haha.

 

[Fantastical]

So you can actually drink this safely? You won't get sick or anything? Just looking at it gives me the heeby jeebies!

 

[fezzman]

So you can actually drink this safely? You won't get sick or anything? Just looking at it gives me the heeby jeebies!

I believe that the alcohol will keep any nasties from getting you sick. I've had a few mildly infected batches and have been just fine.

During the time when I was experiencing the infections I became paranoid and would bottle a few from each batch in clear bottles. This has now become a norm for me. I like to pick the clear bottles up and give them an inspection under a bright light now and then. Perhaps a bit paranoid but it always sets my mind at ease to see nice clear beer. I store them in the dark except for inspections.

 

[Sammy75]

No smell on this one that I noticed.

Yep, I've consumed two of them post bottling, and a bit when I was stressing out about it pre-bottling. No ill effects on me that I've ascertained. If it was indeed lacto bacteria, then that is actually a necessary component of Belgian lambic brews (http://www.howtobrew.com/section4/chapter21-1.html), so I'm assuming no problems there.

Wacky huh?

 

[jfr1111]

Beer can get infected, but it cannot get you sick unless you munch directly on the mold that is in it, and even then, it's probably not harmful. Beer as been used for centuries in Europe as a way of rehydratation: small beers would be brewed (sometimes at home) because there was a serious risk of dying fromthe bacteria that lied in contaminated and polluted water sources. The process of brewing (boiling + alcohol levels) prevented the harmful bacteria from surviving. Children went straight from milk to beer in many cases, when living in urban area. Remember that rats, vermin and garbage were everywhere and that water sources were largely used as a way to dispose of them.

So drinking moldy beer can tate like used diapers (in this case, it does not) but it cannot hurt you and is actually safer than drinking from an unknown stream in the forest.