New to all of this

[ArtyS]

Hello. I'm considering getting into home brewing, but I have some questions before I do. I was hoping you might be able to guide me in the right direction. Here are my questions-

1- What kind of equipment would be best for me to start with? I saw one kit at Jungle Jim's (a gigantic grocery store in the Cincinnati area, very well known for their incredibly vast selection of beer and they also have a small home brew section) for $110.00 Does this price point sound about right to start with? Is it too much? Too little? I'm not exactly sure what exactly came with it, all I remember is it said that I'd need my own boiling pot. If I could get started with something cheaper, that would be fantastic, but I don't want to get sub-par beer, either. That leads me to my next question...

2- The type of beer I'm interested in brewing is Czech-style pilsner. Think Pilsner Urquell, Staropramen, Czechvar, or Rebel. My ultimate goal is get a beer that tastes like one I've only been able to find in Europe, Starovar. I absolutely love every single aspect about Czech pilsners, and I'd love to make my own and tweak it to make my own dream beer. Is this type of beer difficult to brew? I've read on a few different forums and it seems like there are many more steps involved in making Czech style beer. Other styles I'd be interested in are Helles, Newcastle type beer, and amber lager. Are these all doable for a beginner?

3- The ultimate question I have is whether or not homemade beer is as good as store bought.

Thanks in advance for any help!

 

[edds5p0]

The starter kits are a great way to get in to brewing. Everything I have made so far has been good and worth drinking, in fact, in many cases better than store bought because I could chose exactly what went in to my brews. As for the lagers, getting the colors right when using extract and partial boils will be difficult. Also, you will need a lagering set up that can keep your ferm temp reasonably low. It is a lot of fun, and I hope you decide to give it a shot.

Cheers!

 

[Captain Damage]

1 - Go to the HBT Vendor List and peruse some online catalogs for their beginner kits. A basic two bucket kit is what most of us started with. You will need a large kettle, capable of boiling at least 3 gallons of water (for partial boils). You'll also need an ingredient kit. I recommend that least your first few batches be kits rather than recipes because you should concentrate on sanitation, brewday procedure, sanitation and workflow at first (oh, and sanitation as well).

2 - Pilsners, and other lagers are pretty advanced beers to make. They require a meticulous process and the ability to strictly control fermentation temperatures (usually with an electronically controlled refrigerator). The Helles and amber lagers fall into this category. These really aren't beers a beginner is likely to have success with. Newcastle style brown ales are very popular with beginners though. There are many styles of lighter ales that a lager drinker is likely to enjoy as well.

3 - Yes, it can be as good as, even better than store bought.

 

[unionrdr]

Lagers & pilsners are more difficult to brew,as you need a way to maintain lower ferment temps (around 50F). Not to mention a couple months of lagering after fermentation,diecytle rests,etc. They are a lot less forgiving of noob mistakes & it'll show in the finished product. Most home brewers brew ales more than anything else.
A good starter brewing kit can be had at http://www.midwestsupplies.com/
Their basic brewing kit is only $64 & likely of better quality than ol' jungle jim has. Plus they have brew kettles,wort chillers,bottles,etc that can be added to that kit as options,depending on how much you have to spend. Good brew kits too,very fresh.

 

[mcspanner]

Hi,


I was in your position not so long ago and the only thing I would say is ont be put off by horror stories about this class of beer being hard to brew. Nobody told me this before I started and my first two brews were Bavarian pilsners. Both were extracts, one was a liquid extract kit and the other I bought some dried extracts and hops and did a partial boil.

Perhaps because nobody told me they would be hard to do I had no issues. Fermentation temp was kept cool by fermenting in an insulated box surrounded by ice packs replaced daily and I have to say both worked out just fine. The instructions said I had to ferment at less than 20°c so I set up something to achieve that.

I made a few errors with the first liquid extract kit and the result was a touch darker than I expected but the taste was in the " better than many commercial beers I've paid good money for" category.

I've lost count of the number of homebrewers I have met who look shocked when I say the first beers I had a go at were lagers but at the end of the day if you take your time, read the kit instructions and control the variables like temp. as much as you can you are much more likely to be pleasantly surprised than disappointed.

Giv it a shot you won't regret it.

 

[RobertRGeorge]

I can heartily recommend the California Common yeast, available from either White Labs or Wyeast, as a good lager yeast that is more tolerant of brewing temperatures in the low 60F range. The only drawback to this yeast that I have found is that it leaves a stubborn deposit on the walls of fermenters and bottles. It takes a good soaking in powder line cleaner or clorox solution to get rid of it. Simple rinsing will not do it. But you can get a nice lager flavor brewing at the low end of the ale temperature range.

 

[ArtyS]

Wow, I wasn't expecting so many helpful posts so quickly! I'm learning something from each post, so I'm off researching all the options right now. One thing I had in mind for the pilsner was this-

I have a detached garage, an outdoor storage shed, and a small crawl space under my house. The garage seems to hold a rather constant temperature over the winter, but I never did check the shed. This past winter I stored all of my beer (lots of Pilsner Urquell) in there and it held really well. There's no direct sunlight and the concrete stays nice and cool. I'd imagine the shed would be similar, but it does have open air vents. It too sits atop concrete. I'm not sure how the crawl space is, because it's tiny and kind of uninviting. But I figured these three spaces would most likely offer something useful over this winter. Am I correct in this?

 

[unionrdr]

Of the three,the garage sounds good. The shed,having air vents,would take in too much cold on bitter winter days,even for a lager yeast.

 

[RobertRGeorge]

I store my pilsners in my basement at a constant temperature of about 62F and they seem to hold up very well. I find that it is more critical to avoid temperature variation rather than trying to find a cave that lagers at 50F!

 

[unionrdr]

That's fine for storage,but too warm for fermenting or lagering.

 

[weasello]

3- The ultimate question I have is whether or not homemade beer is as good as store bought.

I think this is a really tough question to answer. I know some people that *love* the "flavour" of Molson Canadian, and think any homebrew tastes "worse" because they taste like [hops, yeast, etc].

Some people hate beers based on their color alone (I've really gotta do some A/B tests with dark brown food coloring some day).

If you're open minded and enjoy beers, and their complex flavours (which it sounds like you do!) then I think most brews will come out better than store-bought beers.

But if your only metric for measurement is "how close is it to the store-bought one I want to clone" then you might be in for disappointment.

I don't think you have to worry though, you've got good taste

 

[ArtyS]

I think this is a really tough question to answer. I know some people that *love* the "flavour" of Molson Canadian, and think any homebrew tastes "worse" because they taste like [hops, yeast, etc].

Some people hate beers based on their color alone (I've really gotta do some A/B tests with dark brown food coloring some day).

If you're open minded and enjoy beers, and their complex flavours (which it sounds like you do!) then I think most brews will come out better than store-bought beers.

But if your only metric for measurement is "how close is it to the store-bought one I want to clone" then you might be in for disappointment.

I don't think you have to worry though, you've got good taste

Thanks! I try very hard to be as open minded as possible with beer, but I definitely know what I do like and what I absolutely despise (IPA)... but when it comes to variations of the types I do like, I find it to be very interesting to try what I can get my hands on. Sure, I've been let down by the taste of beer I thought would be great, but nothing compares to finding that one beer that just blows your mind when you taste it. Two perfect examples of this are when I first tried a local beer, Hudepohl Amber Lager, and another local, Rivertown Helles. I bought the Hudepohl as a joke, thinking it would be awful. It instantly became the go-to beer. Now I like trying all the amber lager I can find. Same thing with the Helles. I've loved every single Czech beer I've ever tried (while I was in Czech and what I have found outside). So that's the exact reason I became interested in doing this. I figured, if I can make beer by myself that will be exactly what I want, I can't really lose. I've just never had a home made beer, only wine, and I wasn't all that impressed with it. But I feel like wine might be more complicated to make than beer.

 

[ArtyS]

That's fine for storage,but too warm for fermenting or lagering.

What if I bought a fridge to store it in?

 

[unionrdr]

Sounds like you're not gettin me. Storage temps aren't quite as critical as fermenting temps. Lagers have to ferment between about 47-50F. Then lagered at 34-38F. That sort of thing.

 

[ArtyS]

Sounds like you're not gettin me. Storage temps aren't quite as critical as fermenting temps. Lagers have to ferment between about 47-50F. Then lagered at 34-38F. That sort of thing.

You're right, sorry. I'm not all with it today, please forgive me

So anyway, what would you say is the best beer to start off with? Is a Newcastle style ok?

 

[unionrdr]

Yeah,being an ale,it'd be easier to get right without a temp controlled environment. Especially this time of year.

 

[ArtyS]

Yeah,being an ale,it'd be easier to get right without a temp controlled environment. Especially this time of year.

Ok, great. And you say a simple two bucket setup will work? Or are these any specific items I should plan on getting to start off with?

 

[edds5p0]

You should be golden with the starter kit, but you will probably decide that you will want to make some upgrades as time goes on, like an auto siphon.

 

[ArtyS]

You should be golden with the starter kit, but you will probably decide that you will want to make some upgrades as time goes on, like an auto siphon.

Sorry to keep posting questions, I'm just very curious about all of this. One thing I can't get over is the plastic bucket thing... doesn't that affect the taste? I keep going back to that every time I see a bucket.

 

[edds5p0]

Sorry to keep posting questions, I'm just very curious about all of this. One thing I can't get over is the plastic bucket thing... doesn't that affect the taste? I keep going back to that every time I see a bucket.

Unless you plan on aging a beer for months, the plastic works just fine. Never use abrasives to clean it as this can leave bacteria harboring scratches. I've been using buckets for a few years with no issues.

 

[RobertRGeorge]

The plastic bucket that comes with the kit would be food grade. I wash out my brewing bucket using a sponge only. I found that even a plastic-bristle brush can scratch it.

You will need to transfer out of the bucket into a glass carboy after 5 to 7 days so that you can lager at a cold temperature (~35-40F) one week for every 1 degree Plato (4 points of gravity) of your starting wort.

 

[ArtyS]

The plastic bucket that comes with the kit would be food grade. I wash out my brewing bucket using a sponge only. I found that even a plastic-bristle brush can scratch it.

You will need to transfer out of the bucket into a glass carboy after 5 to 7 days so that you can lager at a cold temperature (~35-40F) one week for every 1 degree Plato (4 points of gravity) of your starting wort.

What is the best substance to use in the buckets?

 

[edds5p0]

I've had good experience using straight A to clean mine.

 

[geim32]

Oxyclean free is great and u can get it at grocery store Walmart or target.

 

[RobertRGeorge]

In Canada there is Sani Brew, if you can get it elsewhere--it is a chlorinated TSP. In the states I can buy Powder Line Cleaner. With either one I rinse thoroughly and spray inside with Iodophor. I checked out Star San when I was down in the US last time--wow is it expensive!

 

[WileECoyote]

Hello ArtyS, The cheapest way to get started is a kit from Mid-West, if you call them and ask for help finding a "Groupon" deal for there starter kit, it will only be $68 for almost everything you need to get started, "including the ingredients", You will only need to come up with a boil pot and bottles, start saving the pop top beer bottles that your getting from the store and drinking now, when I drink a store bought beer, I rinse the bottle out with hot water, put in my dish washer upside down to dry, you will need around 54 bottles for a 5 gal batch, I keep the box they come in for storing the clean bottles in, after they are dry.

Google and Look at the Mid-West site, at the beginner kit, and then you will get a better idea of what you really need to brew your first 5 gal batch of beer. its a lot more stuff than just 2 buckets, The Groupon deal is the cheapest way to get your equipment and a ingredient kit that I have ever seen anywhere, the only down fall (if you want to call it that) is you only get a choice of 1 of 3 different ingredient kits.

Hope this helps and Cheers

 

[Slainte-brew]

ArtyS welcome to homebrewing. I am also in the Cincy area, so jut some advice on that. Jungle Jim's is good for kits or odds and ends things. Listemann,s brew supply on Dana avenue near Xavier is great. Fresh extracts and grains, make their own beer there too. Listermann.com. I still order a lot online from midwest or austin. A great homebrewing club is the bloatarians,they have lots of events. Bloatarian.com

 

[ArtyS]

Can I reuse bottles with twist top caps?

 

[freisste]

Can I reuse bottles with twist top caps?

I believe you need a special capper (maybe not the most common version sold at HBS). But it is certainly possible to cap twist-offs.

 

[ArtyS]

I believe you need a special capper (maybe not the most common version sold at HBS). But it is certainly possible to cap twist-offs.

Thanks! The reason I ask is this-
I typically drink three types of beer. Newcastle, which comes in a clear bottle that I don't care to use, Pilsner Urqeull, don't care to use that bottle either, and Hudepohl Amber Lager. The Hudy comes in a common looking brown bottle, but they use twist caps for some reason. So I figured I could reuse these bottles if possible to save some money.

 

[unionrdr]

Even with a bench capper,you can't always get a good seal on them. Hit or miss kinda thing,& the glass is thinner.

 

[ArtyS]

Even with a bench capper,you can't always get a good seal on them. Hit or miss kinda thing,& the glass is thinner.

Probably better to just buy them then?

 

[unionrdr]

I meant the twist off bottles. Just drink beers that come in pop top bottles. They'll work well over & over again.

 

[ArtyS]

I meant the twist off bottles. Just drink beers that come in pop top bottles. They'll work well over & over again.

If I keep the Pilsner Urquell bottles out of direct light while they're fermenting, will they be ok? Because that's what I'm going to have the most of.

 

[unionrdr]

Yeah man,that's cool. I keep my bottles - cleaned or filled-in craft 12 pack boxes since they have flaps,some with tabs to keep the top closed. Keeps the light off them.

 

[BrewerBear]

Keeping them out of the light like unionrdr says you will be able to use the Newcastle bottles,I have several of them myself that I use.

 

[RM-MN]

Buying bottles is a very inexpensive part of the brewing. Once bought the bottles are reusable for many brew sessions so their cost per session is minimal.