natural ways to leave a little sweetness

[redking11]

Last year I picked ground and juiced about 60 gallons of apple juice from the old orchard, I used a wine or champagne yeast, I don't remember exactly which one, and it came out surprise dry like a wine. I would like to leave a little sweetness. Will an ale yeast do this and if so which one?

 

[55x11]

Last year I picked ground and juiced about 60 gallons of apple juice from the old orchard, I used a wine or champagne yeast, I don't remember exactly which one, and it came out surprise dry like a wine. I would like to leave a little sweetness. Will an ale yeast do this and if so which one?

If you want residual sweetness in otherwise fermented beverage, try lactose or other unfermentable sugars.

 

[redking11]

Will an ale yeast really leave no more sweetness than a wine yeast? What if I added extra sugar and used a year that died off at a lower abv?

 

[gregbathurst]

I suggest you get Claude Joliceour's book, he explains all the methods of making cider with sweetness. Pasteurising is the easiest way.

 

[madscientist451]

Adding sugar will give you a higher ABV. I've used WL 002 and several other beer yeasts. The 002 leaves a slight residual sweetness, stops at about 1.002. I don't know if that will work for you, but I'd suggest running several test batches with different yeasts to see what you prefer.
Fermenting at low temperatures like in the mid 50's can help as well as using apples from non fertilized trees. So there is not really one simple solution.
I siphon my cider into 1.5 liter bottles and when I go to drink it, add about 1/2 can of frozen apple juice concentrate or some times apple/rasperry or apple/cherry. I put it in the fridge and drink it within a week or two of adding the concentrate so it doesn't kick off fermentation.

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

Will an ale yeast really leave no more sweetness than a wine yeast? What if I added extra sugar and used a year that died off at a lower abv?

As I understand it, residual sugar in ales relies mainly on complex sugars that the yeast can't metabolize, and which you aren't necessarily going to get from fruit juice as opposed to grain. I'd go with the suggestions.

 

[casualbrewer]

Kill yeast and back sweeten with juice.

 

[laredo7mm]

Go to the sticky at the top of the cider forum by CvilleKevin. Go to the bottom of the original post and there is a link to where he talks about his process. There is a lot of information there on how to stop fermentation early by cold crashing and racking. I have done it sucessfully a half dozen times to leave the cider at 1.010 to 1.012 FG.

Adding extra sugar may help stopping fermentation early by "tiring out" the yeast so it is easier to stop it before it goes dry. I don't have any problems starting with 1.051 juice, not adding extra sugar, and stopping it early as long as you do a cool, slow fermentation and don't add any yeast nutrient. I have had success with Nottingham, S04, and WLP002.

 

[laredo7mm]

...I siphon my cider into 1.5 ml bottles...

Dang, those are some small bottles.

 

[Transamguy77]

Kill yeast and back sweeten with juice.

^^^^this! That's what I'm going to do, I've made cider a few times and it always goes dry even racking off the yeast. I made 4 gallons of cider last week and I'm going to add campdon tablets to kill the yeast and back sweeten with more juice.

 

[laredo7mm]

^^^^this! That's what I'm going to do, I've made cider a few times and it always goes dry even racking off the yeast. I made 4 gallons of cider last week and I'm going to add campdon tablets to kill the yeast and back sweeten with more juice.

I don't know if campden kills yeast or just prohibits reproduction, but the OP asked for a natural way to leave some sweetness.

Anyway, with proper techniques and yeast, you can stop fermentation and leave residual sweetness without using chemicals or heat. I have had 1.011 cider that I stopped sit at 60 degrees for two months with no change in specific gravity.

 

[madscientist451]

Dang, those are some small bottles.

OOPS sorry 1.5 liter bottles

 

[Transamguy77]

I don't know if campden kills yeast or just prohibits reproduction, but the OP asked for a natural way to leave some sweetness.

Anyway, with proper techniques and yeast, you can stop fermentation and leave residual sweetness without using chemicals or heat. I have had 1.011 cider that I stopped sit at 60 degrees for two months with no change in specific gravity.

The OP asked if an ale yeast and what one will leave residual sweetness, from my experience I've had the same problem as the OP with it drying out and I've used 1056, S05, Notty and S04 and all went to 1.000 and below so this go around I'm using tablets which is supposed to kill the yeast and back sweeten with fresh juice. I'm sure there are other ways but this way should be an easy way to not have dry cider.

 

[timdillon36]

The short answer, use 4184.

The long answer, continue reading.

I am by no means an expert on cider making but I made a few batches last fall with fresh cider that I ordered from my LHBS. I wanted it to be slightly sweet and all natural as well as sparkling with bottle conditioning.

After a lot of research I came up with a simple plan and it all came down to the yeast I used.

4184 sweet mead.

I made a test batch that was also a starter as I then used the cake and pitched that into the larger batch.

I think the test batch turned out better but the big batch took 3rd this weekend at the indiana brewers cup.

For the test batch I bought a ~1/2 gal bottle of Simply Apple brand juice. Poured out a small glass and and let warm to room temp as the smack pac swelled. Drank the glass of juice and and added the yeast. Placed the cap back on loosely and let it sit for 2 weeks, racked to secondary for 3 weeks and primed with corn sugar and bottled.

You could start a test batch this week and it should ready to drink before the apples are ripe this year. If you like it great and you already have your yeast plus you have a bottled of home cider to drink while you are making your big batch. If not all you are out is the $8 for yeast and a bottle of juice and you can go with one of the more complex methods or use a non fermentable sugar or splenda to achieve a sweet cider.

Good luck and let us know how it turns out.

 

[laredo7mm]

The short answer, use 4184..

What was your OG and FG when using this yeast? I have read accounts where 4184 fermented the cider bone dry.

 

[timdillon36]

1.058 og
1.004 fg

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

1.058 og
1.004 fg

*whistle* okay, my reference point is beer, but that looks bone dry to me. Like, maybe a bone with a few scraps of flesh, but... o.o

 

[Jwin]

Many threads about this out there but b I had an idea a while back and figured I would share
Why not steep a moderate amount of crystal malt for a half hour or so on the stovetop, then boil it down? Not only is it still cider, not Graff or appleale or whatever, but you could experiment with different grains and different amounts of caramelization of the "wort" AND still bottle condition. Essentially creating your own adjunct.
No, it won't yield more apple flavor, but it will get you sweetness without resorting to lactose or risking bottle bombs. I may do this myself at some point if I find the time. Just grab some c20 and c120 and do a split batch.
The time to boil down 1-1.25qt is pretty short. Now, if I wanted to really reduce it to a syrup and do different levels of caramelization, that would be a whole other experiment.

Any reason this wouldn't work?

 

[timdillon36]

*whistle* okay, my reference point is beer, but that looks bone dry to me. Like, maybe a bone with a few scraps of flesh, but... o.o

In my defense I said SOME sweetness.

Also a dry cider or wine often finishes as low as .990

Juice from the same source fermented with an English ale yeast finished at .996

 

[Jwin]

Ok, after some googlefu, crystal malts is totally doable and will raise the fg, and possibly aid in fermentation time as it provides the yeast some natural nutrient.
Search crystal malt cider
One here:
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=111247

Another couple threads at HBA as well.

 

[MindenMan]

I have tried many different yeast strains to make hard cider with and they have all finished dry when left to finish fermenting. I recently tried 4184 Sweet Mead yeast as it is touted to leave a little residual sweetness. I recently made a batch using 6 pounds of ground and processed Granny Smith apples of which I fermented on the pulp. I also added a few odd apples and 2 pears I had in my freezer. To this I added 3-1/2 gallons of TT 3 apple juice blend, and 20, yes twenty, cans of generic FAJC. The O.G was somewhere around 1.094 so it may have hit the 12% ABV limit it is rated for. What I want to say is this is some of the best tasting hard cider I have ever had and my first taste was immediately after fermentation stopped. This is going to be some top shelf cider and some over-the-top applejack; it is not bone dry and I am sure will age quite well for a very long time. I did make a three-step starter for this batch as I didn't want any surprises as I fermented this batch starting @ 65*F for three days and finished @ 68*F. It did ferment faster than any other batch of cider I have ever made (ten days) and none of the delicate aromatics seem to have been lost when using this yeast. At this point, I can not see using any other yeast when making hard ciders or fruit wines.

 

[1bottlerocket]

Here is a great article on this topic.

https://byo.com/stories/issue/item/3282-back-sweetening-hard-cider

If you want to skip to the relevant part, one interesting method they use in France is called "Keeving" but it seems kind of hit-n-miss.

Here is an article on the process: http://www.cider.org.uk/keeving.html