Lowering TA - how?

[Sballe]

So i finally got myself a TA test kit — and tested a batch I have in secondary right now. Expecting it to be to low, I also had some Malic acid on hand …

Surprise surprise … it tested at 10,5 g/l !!! Then times 0,89 to get it from tartaric to Malic … still 9,5 !!

What to do now? I was shooting for 6,5 — but how do I adjust it down in TA? Everywhere I read about it adjusting always is about adding Malic acid to increase TA …

Any advice appreciated

 

[Maylar]

what's the pH?

 

[Sballe]

what's the pH?

Didn’t test the ph now … but in other batches from the freshly pressed apples (same trees) it has been pretty consistent around 3,75…

I guess you are asking b/c if the ph is too high — it is too risky to lower the TA? (Resulting in an even higher ph which would be bad)

 

[Chalkyt]

Interesting problem. What type are the apples? Depending on the volume you are dealing with you could blend in some lower TA apples that don't have a high pH.

Jolicoeur (The New Cider Maker's Handbook) has published a chart of pH vs TA for almost 200 different apples. He doesn't identify which is which, but it is clear that there is a cluster of apple types that have a pH between 3.2 and 3.6 and TA between 3 and 8 g/L and every combination of these. For example, there are some with pH around 3.4 with TA 3.2 - 3.8 g/L which could bring your blend to more normal levels.

The hard part is finding out what type of apples they are and getting them. Generally, I find that common eating apples such as Delicious, Fuji, Gala, etc have a pH in the order of 4.0 but a TA around 3 -5 g/L so they might help a bit if blended in. I imagine that this might be the case with "store bought" juice.

Andrew Lea (Craft Cidermaking) suggests that the acid taste can be chemically neutralised by using potassium or calcium carbonate up to 0.3%, with potassium hydrogen carbonate being preferred to avoid a chalky taste from calcium. However, he doesn't really seem to recommend this approach and notes that potassium may affect the flavour.

For my own purposes I checked the pH and TA of some quite drinkable commercial ciders and note that most of them have a pH in the order of 4.0 and some sweetness which negates any excessive acidity anyway.

 

[Sballe]

Interesting problem. What type are the apples? Depending on the volume you are dealing with you could blend in some lower TA apples that don't have a high pH.

Jolicoeur (The New Cider Maker's Handbook) has published a chart of pH vs TA for almost 200 different apples. He doesn't identify which is which, but it is clear that there is a cluster of apple types that have a pH between 3.2 and 3.6 and TA between 3 and 8 g/L and every combination of these. For example, there are some with pH around 3.4 with TA 3.2 - 3.8 g/L which could bring your blend to more normal levels.

The hard part is finding out what type of apples they are and getting them. Generally, I find that common eating apples such as Delicious, Fuji, Gala, etc have a pH in the order of 4.0 but a TA around 3 -5 g/L so they might help a bit if blended in. I imagine that this might be the case with "store bought" juice.

Andrew Lea (Craft Cidermaking) suggests that the acid taste can be chemically neutralised by using potassium or calcium carbonate up to 0.3%, with potassium hydrogen carbonate being preferred to avoid a chalky taste from calcium. However, he doesn't really seem to recommend this approach and notes that potassium may affect the flavour.

For my own purposes I checked the pH and TA of some quite drinkable commercial ciders and note that most of them have a pH in the order of 4.0 and some sweetness which negates any excessive acidity anyway.

 

[Sballe]

But my batch is already in secondary. Would it be ok to mix in new fresh juice (with less acids) at this point ?

 

[Chalkyt]

Should be O.K. it is just the same as priming with juice. The yeast will just keep chewing away at the extra sugar.

 

[Zambezi Special]

Maybe make another batch and you can mix in the glass?
Or mix in glass till you find the right balance and then mix all according to those proportions?