Local brewery allows employees to smoke while brewing...

[brandonnys]

I read 8 pages of people arguing about nothing, and still don't know which brewery this is...

 

[Yesfan]

I read 8 pages of people arguing about nothing, and still don't know which brewery this is...

LOL! I was thinking the same thing earlier today.


So who is this brewery??

 

[ericbw]

Don't confuse the issue with facts! Hahaha

 

[foam_top]

True. There should be no rules for any business.

They can mash with used syringes, soiled diapers and cigarette butts for all I care. I don't need symbolic law to convince me my money is better spent elsewhere.

 

[yourlastchance89]

People literally used to brew using pond water infested with poop and dead organisms in barns using equipment that probably had never been cleaned ever. Do I care workers are smoking while brewing? Barely. If I owned the place I'd care more so about customers not seeing it than about the smoking itself. People are so anti-smoking today they'd just hate just hate it with no legitimate logic to why other than that's what they're programmed to think. I would love to see the Brulosophy experiment where a panel picks out the difference between a beer brewed whilst smoking and another whilst non-smoking.

 

[fatherdan]

Have snowflakes infected everything?

9 pages of pussification .... Seriously. I doubt very highly this is common place at any brewery other than my garage.

Few guys have a few beers and yada yada.... probably was their own personal batch.

What's more telling is the reactions here.


Yes it's a bad look and any business owner​ that allows it has a bad business model.

Buy sheesh folks,. what's the common saying around here.

Rdwhahb.

 

[RevKev]

My quick two cents. It is disgusting, I don't care what people do when they are on their time but at work you should respect customers and the product you produce.

Hope they get fined.

 

[fatherdan]

Why?

 

[RevKev]

Why?

It's just a product of the environment I work in. I both work in the beer department giving out samples and recommendations and the pharmacy as a technician. I don't think people would appreciate me not holding myself to the upmost levels of care when dealing with medications and I expect a certain level of sanitary practices everywhere I go. I work at Wegmans and our food safety intercompany is scores more strict than NYS department of health.

If they do it at home or out and about so be it, free will man, but when they are prepping consumables I just think everyone should be held to a higher standard

 

[brandonlovesbeer]

I worked at a craft brewery for two years. EVERYONE smoked (except me). Dogs were all over the place.
Honestly it doesn't matter. Because anything post boil is in a closed system.

No biggie.

 

[fatherdan]

Fair enough​, but let's be realistic. From what I'm gathering it's a small Brewer with a couple guys who probably had a few beers in them.

Pretty sure the guys aren't top paid guys, not so much an excuse as it is a chance for the brewer to remedy the situation.

 

[RevKev]

Oh absolutely, they honestly make probably the same wages are dishwashers or people waiting tables. I wouldn't care if it's just every so often when it's raining outside or was just a ****ty day .. but if I go to the pub everyday and they are just chilling having brews and smoking like a chimney, something to be said about their ideas of health codes and proper conduct. Hopefully they don't have a kitchen attached I could just imagine what Gordon Ramsey would say

And yes it is a closed system and I'm sure they wash down the brew house ever so often when cleaning out tanks, just erks me, kinda like a pet peeve.

It is after all an image that is being projected and if they are tarnishing their public image by doing some questionable practices, as some people do have strong opinions (as shown in the thread) and others are moderately opinionated like me, why not just forgo the what ifs and just not do it.

 

[madscientist451]

Maybe they could make a specialty beer with the cigarette butts?
Butt Bourbon Barrel Stout?
The 90 minute boil would kill any bacteria in the butts....
Would it be better to put the butts in the mash or as part of the hop addition?

 

[woo_pig]

For those of you that are appalled at this, what is the problem with it? Is smoke going to get into the beer? Ashes? I'll bet there are a lot things worse than the ash from a cigarette that get into the mash tun and I doubt that there is a health issue. Are you just butthurt because, Smoking!

I had a very large cigar ash fall in one of my IPAs one time. I'm pretty sure that it didn't affect it and nobody complained...

Did you sell that beer to someone?

 

[flars]

The uncleanliness of smoking is a reason I won't buy traditional floor malted grains. Just thinking of people walking through the grains with what may be on their boots is a turn off.

 

[BeerAddikt]

If they are willing to cross one line, what's to stop them from crossing others? The way I see it, if they are careless enough to smoke in public view while making beer what else are they careless about? I wouldn't give them my business but that's just me.

And I find great irony in people getting upset about people getting upset. "It upsets me that said behavior upsets you." What a fine species we are.

Just my 2 cents.

 

[Hoppity]

Social media may impact their beer sales. The jury is still out on that.

I remember the difference with which I sanitized pacifiers that hit the floor of my first two sons. The first was boiled, cooled, then returned. The second one was swiped through my mouth, wiped on my shirt, then stuck back in his mouth. Both kids came out OK.

It is bad PR for both me and the Brewer, but I wasn't selling a product...

 

[ericbw]

Social media may impact their beer sales. The jury is still out on that.

I remember the difference with which I sanitized pacifiers that hit the floor of my first two sons. The first was boiled, cooled, then returned. The second one was swiped through my mouth, wiped on my shirt, then stuck back in his mouth. Both kids came out OK.

It is bad PR for both me and the Brewer, but I wasn't selling a product...

What if you saw the babysitter do the same thing?

 

[ericbw]

Fair enough​, but let's be realistic. From what I'm gathering it's a small Brewer with a couple guys who probably had a few beers in them.

Pretty sure the guys aren't top paid guys, not so much an excuse as it is a chance for the brewer to remedy the situation.

I'm not sure it matters if they are top paid guys or not. Low paid guys/gals who make food (in production or restaurants) are required to wash their hands after smoking. I think the same goes for eating.

I really doubt that they are infecting anyone. It's pretty unlikely. But like someone else said, if they do this in plain view, then what do they do while bottling or kegging? How clean is the rest of the place?

 

[akthor]

I have to believe the only people in this thread who are OK with this are also smokers.

No normal person in their right mind would ever think it is OK to smoke around something people are making for public consumption. Its disgusting. That smoke sticks to everything. Go in a smokers house, or the way the they smell after a smoke break outside even. Or the inside of their vehicle. There are reasons its practically banned everywhere. Real, scientific, valid reasons. Not just made up BS to inconvenience a small percentage of the population.

Anyone thinking this is OK and no big deal is either a smoker or just plain crazy.

 

[kombat]

We don't have to draw the line, the brewery did that for us, now it's up to the consumer to decide what fits their needs. I find it irrational to tell someone how to run their business.

I agree. I own a restaurant, and I'm sick of "The Man" telling me what temperature I have to keep my walk-in at, or demanding that I store my cooked meat separate from my raw meat, or making me wash my hands so often, or insisting that I throw meat away just because it's older than some arbitrary date some egghead in a lab cooked up. Smells fine to me! And the customers aren't complaining.

#DrainTheSwamp!

 

[Morrey]

Kombat I surely understand that health inspectors can be a royal PITA and I understand your position. Of course the public feels safe eating with you due to these regulations being in place. Both sides of the isle are important.

I grew up in a tobacco growing region and feel the economic hit that we suffered when tobacco all but has gone away as a cash crop. I now grow coastal Bermuda hay in fields that previously represented mega dollars in tobacco. Long gone.

About halfway thru these posts Corky made a good point that the owner may be displaying a lack of concern attitude that goes deeper than just letting employees smoke in a food prep area. This seeming lack of concern may make us wonder what else he is letting "slide" or get by? Are the employees washing their hands after bathroom visits? I'm not supporting one side or the other but I do feel the owner may be developing a public reaction that is questioned as this thread already shows. For his business longevity, it would help him to say something so he knows how at least one patron feels. If you say nothing and simply quit going there, he knows nothing of your reaction.

 

[Brownalemikie]

Pretty sure you can't smoke while making hot dogs either.

This about if it's gross.

Go see how hotdogs are made......the last thing you'll think about is cigarette smoke

 

[kh54s10]

I agree. I own a restaurant, and I'm sick of "The Man" telling me what temperature I have to keep my walk-in at, or demanding that I store my cooked meat separate from my raw meat, or making me wash my hands so often, or insisting that I throw meat away just because it's older than some arbitrary date some egghead in a lab cooked up. Smells fine to me! And the customers aren't complaining.

#DrainTheSwamp!

What is your restaurant? If I ever visit Ottawa I will be sure that I don't eat there.

Keep your insurance up to date for when you make your patrons sick with spoiled food.......

 

[foam_top]

I agree. I own a restaurant, and I'm sick of "The Man" telling me what temperature I have to keep my walk-in at...

Kombat I surely understand that health inspectors can be a royal PITA...

What is your restaurant? If I ever visit Ottawa I will be sure that I don't eat there...

I think kombat is just picking fun at me with sarcasm. However, I should clarify that I don't support unsanitary or unhealthy business practices. If I owned a brewery or restaurant it would be at the most, humanly possible, sanitary and smooth operation. As a brewer, I think the best quality of beer can only be achieved with no shortcuts.

But I don't share the mentality that ericbw and arnobg rely on rules for their protection. I also mean no disrespect. Consider this my withdrawal from the debate on this thread. RDWHAHB

 

[kombat]

Just to be clear, I was being satirical to highlight the absurdity of the notion that government should keep its nose entirely out of how private businesses are run.

I don't actually own a restaurant, but if I did, I would not only adhere to food inspection and storage regulations, but I'd practice food handling procedures and standards that exceed the regulatory minimums.

 

[Mainer]

Smoking while working on the mash: I'm okay with it. In fact, I just had an idea for my next rauch.
Smoking while working on the bottling line: That's inviting infection.

It's like eating or drinking while brewing. Pre-boil, knock yourself out. Post-boil, please avoid.

 

[Mainer]

I agree. I own a restaurant, and I'm sick of "The Man" telling me what temperature I have to keep my walk-in at, or demanding that I store my cooked meat separate from my raw meat, or making me wash my hands so often, or insisting that I throw meat away just because it's older than some arbitrary date some egghead in a lab cooked up. Smells fine to me! And the customers aren't complaining.

#DrainTheSwamp!

I know a guy who owns a restaurant and makes this argument sincerely. "I don't keep my kitchen clean because of government regulation. I keep it clean because if people get food poisoning, they won't come back. We should repeal all food regulation. It would put my competitors who are doing the bare minimum out of business."

 

[Stealthcruiser]

I have to believe the only people in this thread who are OK with this are also smokers.


Anyone thinking this is OK and no big deal is either a smoker or just plain crazy.

I concur.

I prefer to wait until gassing up the car to smoke, to watch all the people scatter, so that I might gas up in peace.......:rockin:

 

[lschiavo]

Some of you guys need one of these to protect you from all the second hand smoke and all those other much worse things you breath and consume everyday that you haven't even thought of yet.

Maybe a drum of hand sanitizer and a support animal too

 

[Baabaadoo]

According to the CDC,health effects of second hand smoke on people are detrimental. Why? Well, the chemicals in the product are carcinogenic and contain many poisons in the product in unhealthy quantities (this is why the smoking/grilling reference is pure ignorance). I certainly don't want to have myself or my family using or around the products. Why would I want it around something that I am putting in my body?

As for the company's rights, it should be able to do what it pleases. The government has overstepped many lines on that front. I hate nanny state politics, but this isn't a question if what SHOULD we legislate. It's a matter of what is healthiest. So stop the ignorant comments please.

There's another line that needs to be drawn by those mocking people taking my position: there's a difference between neglect and incident. Neglect is the product of leaving leaving or promoting an uncaring state of affairs that promotes or permits an unhealthy environment. I believe the brewpubs should be permitted to choose what their practices are, but I believe it should be legislatively mandatory to publicly post their practices so the costumers may choose if they are going to support the business. Post your practices/manufacturing rules in the brewpub and let the money choose.

I wouldn't come back and I would file a report to the USDA/BBB.

 

[jodell]

I need a guy who worked at a local brewery (i know longer live in the area) who quit because one day they found a rat in a fermentation vessel, knew about it, packaged and shipped it out. A rat. Post boil. Thats disgusting

 

[Mainer]

To be fair, if brewers in the rest of the country are anything like brewers in Maine, there's almost no chance that was tobacco they were smoking.

 

[Mainer]

According to the CDC,health effects of second hand smoke on people are detrimental. Why? Well, the chemicals in the product are carcinogenic and contain many poisons in the product in unhealthy quantities (this is why the smoking/grilling reference is pure ignorance).

Just playing the devil's advocate, there is some evidence to suggest that grilling and smoking meats is also carcinogenic...
https://www.cancer.gov/about-cancer/causes-prevention/risk/diet/cooked-meats-fact-sheet

 

[Baabaadoo]

The cancer rates in a smoker is a lot higher than somebody who consumes grilled meat regularly. The concentrations are vastly different. Plus that's not neglect. This brewpub is neglectful.

 

[Mainer]

Just curious how many employees the brewery has. I read a not-wholly-trustworthy source online that said Tennessee allows businesses with 3 or fewer employees to allow smoking in areas not accessible to the public. Still not sure that would make this legal, presuming they'd still be covered under food prep laws, but it could at least introduce a little legal ambiguity. Is this some 3-man-shop nanobrewery?

 

[ericbw]

Go see how hotdogs are made......the last thing you'll think about is cigarette smoke

Do the workers touch their mouths and then touch a food product that I'm going to eat? Then you're right - I'd be concerned.

Or do you mean because it's emulsifying animal flesh from all parts of the animal, and that's gross? Or is it because slaughter is gross by itself?

Surely they are concerned with sanitation in a hot dog factory. I'm not talking about gross.

 

[ericbw]

According to the CDC,health effects of second hand smoke on people are detrimental. Why? Well, the chemicals in the product are carcinogenic and contain many poisons in the product in unhealthy quantities (this is why the smoking/grilling reference is pure ignorance). I certainly don't want to have myself or my family using or around the products. Why would I want it around something that I am putting in my body?

As for the company's rights, it should be able to do what it pleases. The government has overstepped many lines on that front. I hate nanny state politics, but this isn't a question if what SHOULD we legislate. It's a matter of what is healthiest. So stop the ignorant comments please.

There's another line that needs to be drawn by those mocking people taking my position: there's a difference between neglect and incident. Neglect is the product of leaving leaving or promoting an uncaring state of affairs that promotes or permits an unhealthy environment. I believe the brewpubs should be permitted to choose what their practices are, but I believe it should be legislatively mandatory to publicly post their practices so the costumers may choose if they are going to support the business. Post your practices/manufacturing rules in the brewpub and let the money choose.

I wouldn't come back and I would file a report to the USDA/BBB.

Well put!

 

[ericbw]

I need a guy who worked at a local brewery (i know longer live in the area) who quit because one day they found a rat in a fermentation vessel, knew about it, packaged and shipped it out. A rat. Post boil. Thats disgusting

"You'd be surprised at the level of rat that the FDA allows in beer..." (mocking those who have said that already)

You might assume that the rat drowned or suffocated, but you don't know if he had some other disease before that. He might be the cleanest rat ever, or he might not be.

(He probably died from second hand smoke in the brewery. That's a joke!)

 

[ericbw]

Just curious how many employees the brewery has. I read a not-wholly-trustworthy source online that said Tennessee allows businesses with 3 or fewer employees to allow smoking in areas not accessible to the public. Still not sure that would make this legal, presuming they'd still be covered under food prep laws, but it could at least introduce a little legal ambiguity. Is this some 3-man-shop nanobrewery?

I think any size business would still be required to follow the federal code for food. Handwashing.

I'm just going to keep repeating it until the mods shut this thread down for inanity.