Lagering - No Fridge for conditioning

[BeerBanana]

Hi Everyone,

I am a relatively novice brewer, I have done 5 AG brews with varying success, all have been ales.

I'd love to brew a lager but I dont have a fridge. I could get one, or a keezer, but space is a concern.

What I do have is a good SS Brewtech fermenter with FTSS temp control system. So I can keep the lager fermenting at 10-12 degrees easily enough, the problem is that I cant "lager" the beer after fermentation.

I live in Melbourne and it's winter at the moment, and a fairly cold one so far. Ambient temps hover around 7-15 C. Are these conditions sufficient to condition lagers? Or do I really need the fridge?

Thanks guys

 

[MSK_Chess]

Lol I love you Aussies ,a fairly cold winter at 7-15 Celsius, thats like a warm summer day in the frozen North

If I had a choice between a fridge and a keezer I would choose the keezer every time because you can get the temp down more quickly and much lower than a fridge. I generally lager at -1 Celsius although good results can be achieved at fridge temp which is 4 or 5 Celsius. I have done a few lagers but was never entirely pleased with the results, they take forever to make and you need to be patient and any flaws are immediately apparent. I settled for a compromise, brewing a Kolsch with WL0029 yeast. I would not attempt to lager at your ambient temp, bottom line, if you gonna make a lager you need a fridge or a keeezer, honestly.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

11 deg C (your average) comes in at 51 F.....sounds like lagering temps to me

 

[MSK_Chess]

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rNP89MDFaHw[/ame]

 

[BeerBanana]

So it sounds like a fridge is necessary? Or keezer? I've been delaying buying one but could take the plunge if necessary. They're not expensive, they just take up room which I dont have.

I've been thinking about buying a kegerator but dont want to lager in that, that's more of a serving fridge.

 

[madscientist451]

If you use the quick lager method, you really don't need the long cold conditioning times.

http://brulosophy.com/methods/lager-method/

A chest freezer would be more versatile than a kegerator, you can put a serving keg and a lagering keg in there together.

 

[applescrap]

Check out my warm ferment lager thread. I would brew it warm and drink it.

 

[applescrap]

Also brulosophy has done many experiments on lager temp as well if you look while you are there. A heated debate happened here under my fermentation temperature reproach thread. Imo fermenting cold and all this other stuff is unnecessary. Just mo.

 

[GrogNerd]

If you bottle prime, you can lager in the bottle

Allow 3 weeks at 70°F to carbonate, then stick them in the fridge for as long as you need

 

[MSK_Chess]

If you use the quick lager method, you really don't need the long cold conditioning times.

http://brulosophy.com/methods/lager-method/

A chest freezer would be more versatile than a kegerator, you can put a serving keg and a lagering keg in there together.

wow that was pretty amazing article and makes sense, absolute sense. If most esters and stuff are produced during the initial growth stage then fine, we ferment at lager temps, but once thats over, ramp it up. Gonna give it a try with a Dortmunder Export or European Lager. I want to experiment with fermenting under pressure but don't have the equipment I need quite yet.

 

[filthyastronaut]

If you bottle prime, you can lager in the bottle

Allow 3 weeks at 70°F to carbonate, then stick them in the fridge for as long as you need

This. The benefits of lagering are there, the only exception being more sediment in the bottle. Not a problem if you pour it carefully, and probably pour for any guests you have as well.

 

[MSK_Chess]

So it sounds like a fridge is necessary? Or keezer? I've been delaying buying one but could take the plunge if necessary. They're not expensive, they just take up room which I dont have.

I've been thinking about buying a kegerator but dont want to lager in that, that's more of a serving fridge.

try and scrounge one first or go on gumtree, its amazing how many people give away stuff they don't need.

 

[GrimBrewer]

When I brew on my own, I only make 10liters. 2.5ish gallons. So the smaller fermenter can fit into a coolerbox.
I add cooldrink bottels of ice to water in cooler box. Get fermenter to 1 to 2c

 

[biggmatt]

You should try w34/70. It's a very forgiving lager yeast with mild honey like esters, if you get any all. I have a couple ferment get up to 68 by accident and didn't get any esters. I lager on the basement floor most winters. I like to put a blanket over it so it is the same temp as the floor

 

[JamieP]

How about the Brew Jacket: http://www.brewjacket.com/

 

[alukaiser]

A bit pricey but I lager in a brew jacket with great success, zero effort.
http://brewjacket.com

 

[witster18]

transfer it to a carboy
... tub.. ice... water... repeat ice... yes for weeks... every morning for 4.5 weeks on my last one.. came out absolute aces... easier to maintain a pretty constant temp than you think.

 

[brewitall]

I built a glycol system with a 5000 btu window air conditioner, small ice chest, and RANCO ETC-111000 Digital Cold Temperature Control for about $250 US, I can set it to 25 F and it will cool a 14 gallon SS Brewmaster fermenter from 65 F to 34 F in ~40 minutes.

 

[Minky]

You should try w34/70. It's a very forgiving lager yeast with mild honey like esters, if you get any all. I have a couple ferment get up to 68 by accident and didn't get any esters. I lager on the basement floor most winters. I like to put a blanket over it so it is the same temp as the floor

Biggmatt is right. W34/70 has become somewhat of a house yeast for me because it is so versatile. The Brulosopher did an xbeeriment which showed most people could not tell the difference between the same recipe fermented warm and cold.

http://brulosophy.com/2016/04/18/fe...ager-yeast-saflager-3470-exbeeriment-results/

 

[10_degrees_play-doh]

You could also use some of the "steam beer/California Common" yeasts such as WY2112 or WLP 810. These are true lager yeasts (S. Uvarum, or S. Carsburgenesis, or whatever they're calling it these days) that maintain a clean profile well into the high 60s F (~20C). In fact, they're pretty sluggish below I believe 55F or so (~12C). Your stated ambient winter temp ought to be cold enough to "cool condition," as in racking to secondary and letting the yeast clean up for a bit while semi-dormant. That should give you decent results, pretty clear and crisp I would think. However, for real lagering the near freezing temperatures are critical for certain chemical reactions (can't remember exactly what for the moment). Otherwise, you can try some clean ale yeasts such as Chico or some Kolsh/Alt yeast. Also, as I believe someone else mentioned, if you're bottling then a few months of the bottles in the fridge ought to do all the same things that a traditional lagering phase would (bring on the purists screaming about my blasphemy...).

 

[wixziu]

I agree with using W34/70. Back in February I brewed a 10 gallon batch of Pilsner and was planning to ferment in my basement which drops to ~50F/10C in the winter months of US Northeast. I had split the batch between W34/70 and WLP800 (Czech Pilsner). Well...we had a couple of warm winter weeks and my basement temp rose to 58F/14.5C almost overnight.

I allowed both to ferment over a month and performed a diacetyl rest. Then lagered down to 38F/3.2C for another month. The WLP800 still had more diacetyl than I think was acceptable for the style. W34/70 didn't give me any diacetyl, it was super clean. You might lose some of the ester characteristics from other strains, but I think it would be hard to notice without a comparison.

 

[Gonjeshk]

How about the Brew Jacket: http://www.brewjacket.com/

What I came here to post. I use my brewjacket to make lagers through the winter (while also making ales with the lower ambient temps), then I use it for ales through the summer.

 

[hendenburg2]

Hi Everyone,

I am a relatively novice brewer, I have done 5 AG brews with varying success, all have been ales.

I'd love to brew a lager but I dont have a fridge. I could get one, or a keezer, but space is a concern.

What I do have is a good SS Brewtech fermenter with FTSS temp control system. So I can keep the lager fermenting at 10-12 degrees easily enough, the problem is that I cant "lager" the beer after fermentation.

I live in Melbourne and it's winter at the moment, and a fairly cold one so far. Ambient temps hover around 7-15 C. Are these conditions sufficient to condition lagers? Or do I really need the fridge?

Thanks guys

Who says you can't lager it in the fermenter? Just rack off the lees into a different sanitized carboy, clean your fermenter and rack back. Of course, your fermenter won't be available for a new brewing cycle, but still...

 

[singmiller]

I agree with the poster who said you can use a tub (or an insulated picnic ice chest, as I do) to hold your fermentor at a desired temperature easier than you might think. I keep plastic containers (think cottage cheese) of ice in the freezer and rotate them in the water bath around the fermentor, with a digital thermometer sensor taped to the side of the fermentor. Works for lager fermentation, cold crashing, and for lagering.

 

[Jtk78]

transfer it to a carboy
... tub.. ice... water... repeat ice... yes for weeks... every morning for 4.5 weeks on my last one.. came out absolute aces... easier to maintain a pretty constant temp than you think.

The place I kept my fermenters was going to get pretty warm, I'm sure 80s in the summer. My plan was this method even for ales. Thought to myself "Self, this can't be that bad. Make ice in containers, get some cooler ice pack things, change every 12 hrs." Within a week of the first warm stretch, I found a freezer to convert. I admire your commitment, but not for me. Set it & forget it.

 

[abnatare]

Great article. Thanks for sharing. I was just thinking about a lager. It made me remember I got into brewing when my dad bought me a Mr Coopers kit for Christmas a decade ago. It came with a lager kit which now strikes me as an odd thing to offer to a person just getting into brewing!

That Mr Cooper kit took me down a long journey to all grain, kegging, glass carboys, 3 tap kegerators, jockey boxes, and a sweet top tier system. Now I just need to find space for a SS fermenter. Thank goodness my wife appreciates good beer! As long as I keep a brown ale, Smithwicks clone, or pumpkin beer and an occasional hard cider on one of the taps she's happy.