Just brewed a Marzen today. Used Saflager 34/70 dry yeast. Made a starter per the Fermentis directions. Pitched into ~60F wort. I've been fermenting at room temp (~62F) since 4:00 Eastern Time. I'm already seeing the low Krausen stage and actually already have some bubbling in my blow off tub. My question is, when should I move the carboy to the fermentation chamer (AKA my basement) where it's now 54F? I'm thinking I shouldn't wait until tomorrow. I don't want the yeast getting too used to room temps, correct?
Lager Fermentation Question
- Thread starter RPG27
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Yes, you want to have the lager start fermenting at the proper temperature. Ideally, you'd do it from the beginning as it takes a very long time for 5 gallons of fermenting beer to reduce the temperature, but now would be better than later.
I only did a one gallon batch. I know there are conflicting opinions on what temp to actually start inital fermentation at. I've seen a few sources say room temp and a few others say to start at your intended primary fermentation temp. Last time, I brewed a vienna lager and started it at 54F. I did get a krausen but I had very little bubbling. Although I used a brewform lager yeast strain with the vienna. This time, the blowoff tube is going pretty actively. Hopefully, I didn't overexert the yeast by starting in the low 60's.
freisste
Well-Known Member
Yooper said:
+1.
A water bath wouldn't hurt either. It would bring your temp down faster and help to keep it at a more uniform temperature.
Nothing more than a tub larger than your fermenter with cold water 1/2-2/3 up the side of your fermenter.
freisste
Well-Known Member
RPG27 said:
I'm not sold on starting a fermentation warm and then cooling. It seems like poor form to me, personally. A bit of a band-aide approach for people who did not treat their yeast well enough prior to pitching.
That said, it seems like there are people who have success with this method, so who am I to criticize? To each their own, but people I know as well as myself have had very good luck starting below optimum temp (even on lagers) because under temp is better than over temp in my experience.
I'm pretty confident I did a decent yeast starter. I sprinkled the yeast on 4 oz of 72F wort and let rest for 15 minutes. Then I added a little cooler wort (probably around 60ishF) and gently stirred for 15 minutes before adding to the aerated wort in the fermentor. I'm relatively new to brewing, but from what I've read, the idea should be to gradually get the yeast used to the environment they're going to be in for fermentation, correct? I was just a bit worried that I'd have a repeat of my last underwhelming lager fermentation, so I opted to start it a little warmer.
freisste
Well-Known Member
RPG27 said:
In general, you don't do starters on dry yeast. You just rehydrate to kind of "wake up" the yeast. You do this by sprinkling the yeast in warm water. I'm not sure the precise steps, but I thought instructions were included with the yeast. I'm sure what you did is fine.
Regarding previous "underwhelming lager fermentation," what was the issue? Did it make it to your expected FG? Did it just go slow? In my experience, lager fermentations are much less eventful than ale fermentation. They are considerably cooler and just uneventfully creep toward FG.
Like I said, people have good luck starting warm and cooling, it's just not something I do. I'm sure you will get more activity with this method. All in saying is you may be "fixing" a problem that doesn't exist. Good luck and happy brewing.
P.S. How are you controlling fermentation temp?
FuzzeWuzze
I Love DIY
The first 24 hours of fermentation are the hours that mean the most, you should always start cold and ramp upwards if you have the control.
Fermentation will take longer at cold temperatures so you wont see the crazy krausen, not to mention lager yeasts are bottom fermenting so you may not see any. Just go off of gravity readings, when you get to 75-80% attenuation you may want to bring it up to 62-65ish for a day or two to finish up and clean up. Other than that there's no reason IMO to have a lager yeast above 60F, its just going to stress them.
If your worried about stressing them when pitching throw your starter in the ferm fridge to get down to 52F or whatever your planning to ferment your lager at.
Thank you for the info.
I haven't tasted my previous brew, the one with the underwhelming fert, so maybe it will be fine. It wouldn't have been so bad had I not seen a single bubble in my blowoff for the 2+ weeks it's been fermenting. The krausen was present, but sort of weak as well. Last week my hydrometer read 1.020 (expected FG was 1.015). It's in the diacetyl rest period right now.
Luckily, I live in a part of the country where my basement stays in the low to mid 50s during the winter. If the basement gets a bit warmer than that, I just crack open a window to chill the air.
Fermentation shouldn't be overwhelming (except for a handful of styles known for it). That's often a sign that it was pitched and/or started fermenting too warm. Lager ferments ought to be visually underwhelming compared to most ales.
The "start warm, wait for signs, then cool a lager to the right temp" technique is an attempt to compensate for underpitching the yeast. It can cause flavor problems. If your pitch rate is good (1.50 or better), having the wort a few degrees cooler than the initial ferment temp and letting it come up is the way to go for the cleanest result.
The "start warm, wait for signs, then cool a lager to the right temp" technique is an attempt to compensate for underpitching the yeast. It can cause flavor problems. If your pitch rate is good (1.50 or better), having the wort a few degrees cooler than the initial ferment temp and letting it come up is the way to go for the cleanest result.
No, it should be fine. 52F is perfect for that yeast strain.
