Light Lager Stuck Fermentation

[Jkrags]

Hi All - It's been a long time since we've come on the forum. Not that we haven't been brewing, but we are much better at it these days! Haven't lost an ale batch in many years. Decided to try our hand at a lager finally. It's a light Brooklyn clone. Starting gravity was supposed to be 1.037, we hit 1.038, final gravity should be 1.006. We are using saflager W-34/70. Optimum temperature for this yeast is 48 to 72 degrees according to Fermentis. Fermenter has been in the basement at a consistent 61° as per our Tilt readings. It has now stalled at 1.019 for two days. Ugggggggg. Yesterday, went down with the old sanitized spoon and gave it a good stir. No change. I guess the next options are...

1) Throw in some more yeast? Don't have any more of the 34/70. But we do have a good package of Safale S-23 (and various other dry Ale yeasts).

2) We have some Fermaid K yeast nutrient. Never used it, but the instructions say "rehydrate and distilled water and add after 1/3 sugar depletion".

3) Something else to get those yeasties going again?

4) Rack it to a keg? Try to keep some of the cake and get it colder... maybe down into the '50s?

Looking for opinions. As always, thank you in advance for your assistance!

 

[VikeMan]

I wouldn't do anything drastic based on Tilt readings. Have you measured the gravity with a regular hydrometer?

 

[Jkrags]

Hi VikeMan - Appreciate response! And No, but curious why you would think that reading would be different? And even if it was a .001 - .002 differential we are still stuck for days. :-(

 

[VikeMan]

And No, but curious why you would think that reading would be different? And even if it was a .001 - .002 differential we are still stuck for days. :-(

The forums are full of issues with Tilts. And the error, if there is one, could be more than a couple of points. Also, how long has this been fermenting? "Stuck" could actually be "slowing down," depending on where it really is.

I'm not saying it's not stuck or that it's not at 1.019, just that I would confirm that before doing anything unusual.

 

[Frank Nobrega]

Hi All - It's been a long time since we've come on the forum. Not that we haven't been brewing, but we are much better at it these days! Haven't lost an ale batch in many years. Decided to try our hand at a lager finally. It's a light Brooklyn clone. Starting gravity was supposed to be 1.037, we hit 1.038, final gravity should be 1.006. We are using saflager W-34/70. Optimum temperature for this yeast is 48 to 72 degrees according to Fermentis. Fermenter has been in the basement at a consistent 61° as per our Tilt readings. It has now stalled at 1.019 for two days. Ugggggggg. Yesterday, went down with the old sanitized spoon and gave it a good stir. No change. I guess the next options are...

1) Throw in some more yeast? Don't have any more of the 34/70. But we do have a good package of Safale S-23 (and various other dry Ale yeasts).

2) We have some Fermaid K yeast nutrient. Never used it, but the instructions say "rehydrate and distilled water and add after 1/3 sugar depletion".

3) Something else to get those yeasties going again?

4) Rack it to a keg? Try to keep some of the cake and get it colder... maybe down into the '50s?

Looking for opinions. As always, thank you in advance for your assistance!

What is your batch size and how must yeast did you pitch?

 

[jdauria]

Raise your temp up, 61 is pretty warm for a lager in the first place, but 34/70 will work there, so would think the yeast would have done it's job, but try bumping it up to 65-68 at this point for a diacetyl rest anyway and the warmer temps make give the yeast a little kick to get going. Cooling it down will not get the yeast to take off again. I would not add yeast nutrients at this point. Was this a 5 gallon batch? Lagers usually need around 3x more yeast than ales. A 1.038 5 gallon batch should have 270 billion cell yeast pitch rate (plugging in to Brewer's Friend Yeast Calculator and assuming 11g pack of dry yeast), one pack of 34/70 is around 110 billion cells, so it may have stalled out due to underpitching.

If you are using a carboy or bucket fermenter, opening it up and stirring was probably not the best idea due to oxygen intake. It's better to just give the whole thing a gentle swirl. Obviously, if using stainless, not so easy.

Was this extract or all grain? If all grain, what was your mash temps? If you mashed too high, you may have some unfermentable sugars in there. You could try getting some Alpha Amylase, boil a quarter cup of water, add some amylase and let it cool, then add to the beer. What it does is take starch and unfermentable sugars and turns it into fermentable sugars, and then hopefully the yeast will wake up and chow down on that.

Side note, optimal temps for this yeast is 53.6F to 64.4F, not sure where you saw 48-72. Fermentis 34/70 Raising the temp above 64 at this point is fine since you are past the active part of fermentation.

 

[Jkrags]

What is your batch size and how must yeast did you pitch?

3 Gallon BIAB. About 3/4 of the package.

 

[Jkrags]

Hi - didnt know that lagers! Under pitching maybe the culpret. 3 Gallon BIAB, didn't pitch the whole packet :-( Maybe 3/4s (usually what we do with Ales). Mashed at 152.

This is all VERY Helpful. Will warm it up for a few days and see if we can kick start!

Thank you!

Raise your temp up, 61 is pretty warm for a lager in the first place, but 34/70 will work there, so would think the yeast would have done it's job, but try bumping it up to 65-68 at this point for a diacetyl rest anyway and the warmer temps make give the yeast a little kick to get going. Cooling it down will not get the yeast to take off again. I would not add yeast nutrients at this point. Was this a 5 gallon batch? Lagers usually need around 3x more yeast than ales. A 1.038 5 gallon batch should have 270 billion cell yeast pitch rate (plugging in to Brewer's Friend Yeast Calculator and assuming 11g pack of dry yeast), one pack of 34/70 is around 110 billion cells, so it may have stalled out due to underpitching.

If you are using a carboy or bucket fermenter, opening it up and stirring was probably not the best idea due to oxygen intake. It's better to just give the whole thing a gentle swirl. Obviously, if using stainless, not so easy.

Was this extract or all grain? If all grain, what was your mash temps? If you mashed too high, you may have some unfermentable sugars in there. You could try getting some Alpha Amylase, boil a quarter cup of water, add some amylase and let it cool, then add to the beer. What it does is take starch and unfermentable sugars and turns it into fermentable sugars, and then hopefully the yeast will wake up and chow down on that.

Side note, optimal temps for this yeast is 53.6F to 64.4F, not sure where you saw 48-72. Fermentis 34/70 Raising the temp above 64 at this point is fine since you are past the active part of fermentation.

about La

 

[Frank Nobrega]

3 Gallon BIAB. About 3/4 of the package.

I think you should have pitched the whole packet. Lagers need about double the yeast you would use for ales and it never hurts to use yeast nutrient. There is a newer yeast called NovaLager that allows you to brew a bit warmer and it uses ale yeast pitch rates. I have been having good luck with that one lately.

 

[Jkrags]

I think you should have pitched the whole packet. Lagers need about double the yeast you would use for ales and it never hurts to use yeast nutrient. There is a newer yeast called NovaLager that allows you to brew a bit warmer and it uses ale yeast pitch rates. I have been having good luck with that one lately.

Yea, I think that was our fatal mistake! Next time we will give that a try! tx u

 

[We2smart]

Yea, I think that was our fatal mistake! Next time we will give that a try! tx u

You can always pressure fermentation, which works fine for me when making a Marzen Lager. 5 days Fermentation under pressure at 12-14psi. I am currently cold crashing in a CF5 fermenter and I use a BIAB Spike Solo 10g 110v

 

[VikeMan]

You can always pressure fermentation, which works fine for me when making a Marzen Lager.

For a given temperature, fermenting under pressure slows fermentation, so whatever @Jkrags' issue turns out to be, that wouldn't fix it.