Kombucha beer

[danmerk23]

Where should I post a question about learning how to make a kombucha beer? I'm intrigued as this would be much better than making a traditional lambic using my kombucha culture.

Thanks.

 

[HebrewedsoIbrew]

Sounds interesting, I'd like to try it one day if it can be done.

 

[skadalajara]

This forum is likely fine for your questions. There is also a "lambic and wild fermentation" section in the beer forum that you might want to look at as well.

 

[uglyamerican00]

Couldn't the KB be forced into a beer state with enough sugar? We wouldn't be using yeast to do it but the KB ferments it just fine.

 

[Fuzzymittenbrewing]

Have been trying to figure this out for awhile. New Holland always has one or two alcoholic kombuchas on tap usually around 3-4% abv.

 

[uglyamerican00]

Have been trying to figure this out for awhile. New Holland always has one or two alcoholic kombuchas on tap usually around 3-4% abv.

That sounds like a challenge!

 

[masonsjax]

Maybe it's a blend of beer and kombucha or is fortified with neutral spirits? Adding more sugar to kombucha usually just results in more acetic acid.

 

[Fuzzymittenbrewing]

That sounds like a challenge!

Indeed!

Maybe it's a blend of beer and kombucha or is fortified with neutral spirits? Adding more sugar to kombucha usually just results in more acetic acid.

I wouldn't think so, but I suppose it's possible. The descriptions on the menu make no mention of either of those.

 

[Vaffmedic]

Blue mountain brewery in Virginia made one and was good, not sure how they did it but was a colaboration with a local kombucha maker.

 

[uglyamerican00]

Most folks do a Second Stage to increase carbonation. But this will also increase the alcohol content. The aerobic kombucha ferment results in only about 0.5% alcohol, but with an anaerobic ferment and anaerobic yeasts the bottled kombucha goes up to around 2% alcohol. (beer is around 4%, and wine 7%)


It's getting more promising!

 

[danmerk23]

Had the same thoughts. More sugar makes more alcohol which feeds the acetobacter.

I thought about a blend of beer and booch. Might be how they do it.

I like the idea of more sugar in the bottle and let the yeast take over. The only problem is I have bottles of booch with acetobacters growing in them. Small but they are there.

There has to be someone that does this.

 

[uglyamerican00]

"I like the idea of more sugar in the bottle and let the yeast take over. The only problem is I have bottles of booch with acetobacters growing in them. Small but they are there."

I don't think adding sugar in the bottles is a good idea, that sounds like a recipe for bottle bombs. Add it to the batch. Also, temperature control changes which culture grows. Warmer temps like high 70s helps the yeast, and lower, around 62 helps the bacteria.

There is a good link a fellow forumer gave me while we were trying to solve a problem. He hit gold when it comes to kombucha behavior! Check it out!

Cheers!

http://users.bestweb.net/~om/kombucha_balance/

 

[masonsjax]

Thanks for the link, it looks to be a good resource.

 

[uglyamerican00]

So I think I figured out how to make that "beer." When you brew kombucha, you have an aerobic and anaerobic fermentation, these two are done by the bacteria and yeast.

Because you need one to balance the other, it is important to allow KB to ferment like it was designed, however, after you reach a good KB tea, you can put it in a secondary with more sugar and some Champagne yeast to get the alcohol up.

I know this sounds like you would just make stronger KB, but that's not the case. Remember I was talking about aerobic and anaerobic fermentation? Well, yeast uses anaerobic, which means it doesn't need air, unlike the bacteria. So, when the KB is put into secondary with the added ingredients, put a rubber stopped and a bubbler on the bottle (or any device or process that you use to keep air out and allow CO2 out). By doing this you inhibit the bacteria from continuous growth by cutting the air off and creating CO2.

After the bubbling has started to stop (1 bubble every 30 sec) start tasting your KB BEER! If you let it go too long it will dry out. Once you get a taste you like, you can rack it again or just throw it in the fridge and cold shock it.

DISCLAIMER: this is just my understanding of both processes, and how I can combine the two to get what I want. I have yet to try it...but I do have a batch ready to come out and I'll be testing it.

*Filtered KB, I think, will be best for the secondary, it might want to over bubble with the floaties...idk, maybe more appealing also.

 

[uglyamerican00]

Btw, if there is no wort...is it beer?! I think it's wine.!!

 

[Fuzzymittenbrewing]

The process you are describing is something like what I was thinking I will try. I would think something strong like 1118 would be able to outcompete the bacteria for the sugar and create alcohol

 

[snarf]

In theory that sounds fine, but in practice I doubt that it will work: I don't think that the champagne yeast will do much in finished KT...

 

[uglyamerican00]

The process you are describing is something like what I was thinking I will try. I would think something strong like 1118 would be able to outcompete the bacteria for the sugar and create alcohol

You don't need to out compete it, with the airlock on it, you will starve the bacteria of the O2 required for propagation. The yeast will eat the sugar and push all remaining O2 out.

 

[uglyamerican00]

Why won't the Champagne yeast work? You are practically making a brew without the wort, like a wine. Sugar+yeast= alcohol and CO2.

 

[Fuzzymittenbrewing]

Oh ok I see what you're saying. My wife is the one is kombucha maker but I get it. do you think adding sugar to the finished kombucha then pitching yeast could work

 

[snarf]

Why won't the Champagne yeast work? You are practically making a brew without the wort, like a wine. Sugar+yeast= alcohol and CO2.

KT has a low pH, which probably isn't very good for the champagne yeast.

 

[Fuzzymittenbrewing]

That's why I was suggesting ec 1118 I use it to make Skeeter Pee all the time. Skeeter is a very acidic environment but 1118 never has a problem

 

[masonsjax]

You can't stop bacteria from doing its thing just by throwing an airlock on. Ever made a sour beer, or had an unintended infection? I'll bet there was an airlock on it.

 

[Owly055]

I've done this............

My process was to use a continuous brew kombucha, and a lightly hopped beer fermenting side by side. The beer had been pitched with USA-05, and was a very bland beer. The kombucha was a continuous brew that I harvested 25% of every 4 days. Every 4 days, I would bottle 25% of the kombucha for secondary fermentation which I do in 1L EzCap bottles with a rubber band stretched beneath the bottle holding the unlatched bail down. These are size 64 wide rubber bands, and they allow the EzCap bottles to vent at about 30 psi..........No bottle bombs. As I harvested the kombucha, I replaced it with the fermenting beer instead of sweet tea. Each time the character of the kombucha changed as the percentage of beer increased.

The result was a range of drinks....... all interesting, and none unpleasant.

I have also used a partially fermented dark DME solution with ginger as a bottling syrup with kombucha achieving a really delightful beer/booch.

I don't have recipes......... don't ask............ the key is the safety system with the EzCap Grolsch type bottles,,,,,

H.W.

 

[Kblandfo]

informative link thanks

 

[uglyamerican00]

You can't stop bacteria from doing its thing just by throwing an airlock on. Ever made a sour beer, or had an unintended infection? I'll bet there was an airlock on it.

You can slow the bacteria from doing its thing! Look up your aerobic and anaerobic fermentation. After your KB has reached its peak brew, adding a low ph tolerable yeast to your tea with some sugar will speed the yeast fermentation(anaerobic) and slow the bacteria(aerobic). That's the point of getting it to a "wine."

BTW, there are different bacteria, the kind we are interested in wont die, just slow down.

 

[h0psnobery]

I've also been thinking of making something along these lines, but worried about the acetobacter turning everything to vinegar. SCOBY's contain acetobacter, various yeasts, brettanomyces, lactobacillus, and pediococcus. If I heated the kombucha after primary fermentation was complete, is there a temp that would kill of only some of the bacteria? Either way, I would heat to kill off the acetobacter, repitch some yeast, and do a second ferment. Thoughts?

 

[Owly055]

My very first all grain homebrew used 100% kombucha for strike water. It came out OK, but the conversion efficiency was horrible due to the PH. As a result I added honey to bring the OG up to where I wanted it. The beer came out well, but unfortunately the sourness of the kombucha didn't really come through.


H.W.