Indoor BIAB

[Behemoth]

Brewed this IPA a few weeks ago.


I really like this juicy, piney, dank beer.

Dat Hop schedule!

 

[Tommydee]

This was a reply to someone looking for the colander I use.

Here is the sterile syphon starter if that's what you are seeking.

Let me know if there is something else you are looking for? I'd be happy to post a different link if you are looking for anything in particular that I showed in the thread.

Wow, this looks 10 times easier for sanitization and use than my auto siphon. If my LHBS has one, I'm getting it. Then I'll use my racking cane for a sparge wand, since I was dumb enough to buy O2 sparge system without the wand....as soon as I hit the regulator, the stone comes to the top. Duh!

Gavin, really appreciate your approach, it has helped me immensely getting set up for BIAB, since I have similar kitchen, taste in beer, and love of process control.

2 questions:

1. Surprised you have the pickup elbow set up like you do in the kettle....while it helps yields, don't you send a lot of trub/cold break to the fermenter that way, or has your experience been it has no impact on flavor getting in the fermenter?

2. Curious if you (or others) see a huge benefit of recirc plate chiller vs just sticking with my immersion chiller. It's 1/2" x 25 ft, gets the job done in about 20 minutes when combined with ice bath, but next batch I'm trying to avoid moving the hot pot off the stove, so I'm expecting longer cool time...and I don't like wasting water. (Rain barrel almost full from last 3 batches, and winter just starting). Did you start out with plate and pump from beginning? I tend to agree with your approach to avoid recirc during mash, seems too troublesome....

 

[Gavin C]

Wow, this looks 10 times easier for sanitization and use than my auto siphon. If my LHBS has one, I'm getting it. Then I'll use my racking cane for a sparge wand, since I was dumb enough to buy O2 sparge system without the wand....as soon as I hit the regulator, the stone comes to the top. Duh!

Gavin, really appreciate your approach, it has helped me immensely getting set up for BIAB, since I have similar kitchen, taste in beer, and love of process control.

2 questions:

1. Surprised you have the pickup elbow set up like you do in the kettle....while it helps yields, don't you send a lot of trub/cold break to the fermenter that way, or has your experience been it has no impact on flavor getting in the fermenter?

2. Curious if you (or others) see a huge benefit of recirc plate chiller vs just sticking with my immersion chiller. It's 1/2" x 25 ft, gets the job done in about 20 minutes when combined with ice bath, but next batch I'm trying to avoid moving the hot pot off the stove, so I'm expecting longer cool time...and I don't like wasting water. (Rain barrel almost full from last 3 batches, and winter just starting). Did you start out with plate and pump from beginning? I tend to agree with your approach to avoid recirc during mash, seems too troublesome....

No worries Tommy. Little if anything in the thread is novel or innovative.

The elbow allows me to completely drain the BK if desired. Cold break gets in the FV as does hot break. Hop debris is largely contained in the hop spider.

Trub in the FV is not a concern of mine.

Recent Brew of a German Pils.

Hot Break (I skimmed it for a few brews but no longer see any need)

Cold Break

Typical appearance as a result of this. 0.5 gallons of break/yeast and other at the end of fermentation.

Non issue for me. YMMV

 

[Gavin C]

...


2. Curious if you (or others) see a huge benefit of recirc plate chiller vs just sticking with my immersion chiller. It's 1/2" x 25 ft, gets the job done in about

I went plate chiller route as I like the fully contained setup in the kitchen. I just hook it to my kitchen faucet after removing the sprayer. Saves me going out to attach a garden hose. I wanted to go fully indoors. Minimally important I suppose.

Plate chillers are prone to blockages so containing hop debris is a must.

An immersion chiller or CFC is a fine approach too. Pros and cons to each..

 

[z-bob]

I've skimmed over the whole thread (I loved the first 30 or so posts); maybe this was answered and I missed it.

I've been doing BIAB for a couple of years (not all that many brew sessions cuz I don't get to brew very often) The biggest problem I'm having is the amount of draff that makes it into the fermenter. Part of the problem this weekend was my bag had holes in it (I threw it out with the spent grain after saving enough for dog cookies) But even with a new bag, without doing a Vorlauf, a lot of malt dust gets through. It wouldn't be so bad except it doesn't compact very well at the end of fermentation, and I feel like I'm losing a lot of beer because of it.

 

[RM-MN]

I've skimmed over the whole thread (I loved the first 30 or so posts); maybe this was answered and I missed it.

I've been doing BIAB for a couple of years (not all that many brew sessions cuz I don't get to brew very often) The biggest problem I'm having is the amount of draff that makes it into the fermenter. Part of the problem this weekend was my bag had holes in it (I threw it out with the spent grain after saving enough for dog cookies) But even with a new bag, without doing a Vorlauf, a lot of malt dust gets through. It wouldn't be so bad except it doesn't compact very well at the end of fermentation, and I feel like I'm losing a lot of beer because of it.

How long do you leave the beer in the fermenter. Mine usually settles pretty well but I leave my beer for 3 to 4 weeks before bottling.

 

[Mer-man]

Yeah, I usually see at least a 3:1 reduction in volume of trub/yeast by end of fermentation

 

[z-bob]

How long do you leave the beer in the fermenter. Mine usually settles pretty well but I leave my beer for 3 to 4 weeks before bottling.

I wait about a month. The yeast and cold-break reduce tremendously and packs down pretty well. If there's a lot of flour though, it seems to stay fluffy when it settles out.

 

[Gavin C]

Oktoberfest in January.

Some grain particulate in the BK and resultingly less clear preboil sweet-wort ( over that typical with using a conventional separate mash-tun) is an oft-cited disadvantage of a single vessel approach given the impossibility of an effective volauf.

A well made fine mesh bag from @wilserbrewer greatly reduces this issue. My view based on my limited personal experience is that on the small HB scales it is a non-issue.

 

[oujens]

Hey Tommy

Thanks for the kind words. I'm glad you're able to get some use from the thread.

Here is a rough out of the mash profile. Essentially a single infusion at 149°F with a gradual loss of heat from the mash over time.

Overnight Mash Profile
View attachment 382397

When I got up from bed in the morning I removed the insulation, fired up the stove, stirred it well and pulled the bag.

I did not do a mash out on the overnight mash.

I insulated the pot with reflectix in my usual manner.

Gavin, this overnight mash has my interest. When reading about an overnight mash, it seems you don't have to worry about your mash souring. Is that what you understand as well, or are there steps needed to prevent this from occurring? I would have a similar mash setup like yours with the reflectix. I think an overnight mash would help me out big time with the family schedule. Will you continue to do this on a regular basis? As always, thank you for the details you provide. Very helpful.

 

[Gavin C]

Gavin, this overnight mash has my interest. ..... Will you continue to do this on a regular basis? ....

I've never made a sour beer nor have I any experience with sour mashing but my understanding is that with the minimal temperature drop and very short time frame of only a few hours (~5-8 hours) souring the mash should not be a concern.

It was not a sour mash in this instance which is in line with many others who have done something similar.

I am brewing a saison tomorrow and may well do an overnight mash tonight.

FWIW, I enjoyed the resulting IPA from the overnight mash. Its character was what I was aiming for.

Hope that helps some.

 

[david_magnuson]

Gavin, I recognized your pics in the Zymurgy article from this month's issue. Congrats-nice write up! Thanks also for sharing your expertise in this thread, too. I started doing Biab last year from your examples. I love the way you document your processes- really helpful for understanding what you are doing. Cheers!

 

[Gavin C]

Gavin, I recognized your pics in the Zymurgy article from this month's issue. Congrats-nice write up! Thanks also for sharing your expertise in this thread, too. I started doing Biab last year from your examples. I love the way you document your processes- really helpful for understanding what you are doing. Cheers!

Thanks very much for the kind words David. I'm glad you enjoyed the article and have found this thread of some use.

Cheers mate.

 

[Gavin C]

..Will you continue to do this on a regular basis? ...

Just a follow up to your question.

____________________________
Hibiscus Saison

I carried out an overnight mash for this morning's brew. The plan is a dry finish on this beer so one could argue there is minimal downside to a prolonged mash.

• A saison.
• ~8hour mash duration.
• 77% Mash efficiency.
• 74% BH efficiency

Grain-Bill



Dough-In

Full volume no-sparge. Single infusion at 151°F

Insulation placed

A temperature measurement 8 hours later. (Mash stirred before reading was taken to eliminate any thermal stratification.)

OG 1.068


~12 hours after pitching Belle Saison (no temperature control)

_____________________

6 Days later dry hops & Hibiscus Tea added to FV

14oz Hibiscus Flowers and 96oz of water (chloramines removed) ~2L of tea final volume.

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1484882083.236957.jpg
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12 days of fermentation. FG is reached.

 

[wilserbrewer]

Good job Gavin, I'm hoping your detailed success with the overnight mashing will debunk some of the myths surrounding this procedure.

 

[oujens]

Awesome, Gavin. I look forward to trying this out.

 

[tzman]

Gavin, I'm just getting started with BIAB and have completed my first brew which is in a keg now. I have to brew outside with a natural gas burner. How are you insulating your kettle during the mash (what materials)? I've looked at your pictures, but maybe I missed text relating to what they are. Although you are doing everything inside your home, what is your typical temp drop in a 90 min mash?

 

[Gavin C]

..
How are you insulating your kettle during the mash (what materials)? ..... what is your typical temp drop in a 90 min mash?

Hey TZ. Welcome to the forum.

I made a lagging jacket out of reflectix, some airconditioner metal tape and a few bolts. You can see more about that in this thread.

Reflectix and supplies from Home Depot

For a single infusion mash I lose about 2F over the course of an hour.

 

[tzman]

Thanks Gavin. I left the message before heading to my LHBS this morning to pickup the recipe for the next brew, so I hadn't seen your response. On the outside chance that what I thought was Reflectix I picked up a roll & that was confirmed when I got home & saw your response. Did you tape the insulation on the lid to the lid?

 

[Gavin C]

Thanks Gavin. I left the message before heading to my LHBS this morning to pickup the recipe for the next brew, so I hadn't seen your response. On the outside chance that what I thought was Reflectix I picked up a roll & that was confirmed when I got home & saw your response. Did you tape the insulation on the lid to the lid?

No worries.
The layers just sit on the lid. Not taped to it.

 

[NTexBrewer]

Gavin,

I'm looking to update my brewing setup and it will be very similar to what you have detailed through this post. Wondered if you would not mind giving your thoughts on this setup and if you had to make any changes to your setup what would it be.

I have a gas stove with a 14,000 BTU burner. With my old 7.5 gallon aluminum pot, I can get 7 gallons of wort boiling. I brew the occasional 5 gallon batch but mostly do 3 and 2.5 gallon batches.

This is what I'm thinking of getting.

From Northern Brewer:
8 Gallon Maga Pot w/ Valve
Transfer Quick Pump Connection kit
Chugger SS inline pump

From More Beer:
Counter Flow Chiller with 1/2" FPT fittings

I already have a Swirl-Boss wort whirlpool wand and an immersion chiller.

I'm thinking with this setup, It will simplify my brew days and save my back some lifting. I'm also in Texas so the plan is to use a bucket of iced water to make a pre chiller with the immersion chiller.

So the biggest thing, I'm not sure about is the pump. Do you regulate the flow of the pump with a valve. Can you get too big of a pump. Is one type of pump better than others?

Thanks!

 

[Gavin C]

Gavin,

I'm looking to update my brewing setup ..

My setup as illustrated sort of evolved over a series of brews at the outset of the hobby. Improving the setup to solve various problems I identified as I learned.

I would advise against a pot smaller than 10 gallons (mine is 11 but called 10)

I stopped using a prechiller after a few summer brews. Didn't bother this summer and simply accept the need for more coolig the the fermentation chamber before a cold pitch. It did work but I didn't see much need after experimenting with one.

I would not bother with a thermometer on the pot. It's redundant and gets in the way during lautering. A good instand read thermometer is a much better investment.

I'm happy with the chugger pump. I regulate the flow with a valve on the out port. Anything from a trickle to full bore is doable.

Plate chillers get a bad rep but I like mine and how it fits my stove-top counter-top setup. No problems cleaning it after a brew.

An IC might be easier but I like not having to trail a garden hose in from outside to get the flow rate I would want. If going the IC route I would go big.

I might install a better dip tube at some point but that's minimally important. The dip-tube I cobbled together works well.

I really like having a whirlpool arm. There are neater ways to install one that I would chose if doing it again but I just wanted to repurpose the hole in the pot from the dial thermometer I removed.

Hope that ramble is of some use. Let me know if there are any other bits and pieces you want outlined in more detail. I'm happy to share what little experience I have. If it's of use, all the better.

Cheers NTex. (You entering BBBO this year? I'll hopefully be there for 1 of the days)

 

[val214]

Just a follow up to your question.

____________________________
Hibiscus Saison

I carried out an overnight mash for this morning's brew. The plan is a dry finish on this beer so one could argue there is minimal downside to a prolonged mash.

• A saison.
• ~8hour mash duration.
• 77% Mash efficiency.
• 74% BH efficiency

Grain-Bill
View attachment 384587


Dough-In

Full volume no-sparge. Single infusion at 151°F

Insulation placed

A temperature measurement 8 hours later. (Mash stirred before reading was taken to eliminate any thermal stratification.)

OG 1.068
View attachment 384589

~12 hours after pitching Belle Saison (no temperature control)

_____________________

6 Days later dry hops & Hibiscus Tea added to FV

14oz Hibiscus Flowers and 96oz of water (chloramines removed) ~2L of tea final volume.

View attachment 385399
View attachment 385400
View attachment 385401

12 days of fermentation. FG is reached.
View attachment 386429

Looking good! @gavinc love the pictorial of the brew day. Now if we can only get you to brew a science Brett saison. I have a nice collection of Brett yeast [emoji6] I can send you.

 

[NTexBrewer]

My setup as illustrated sort of evolved over a series of brews at the outset of the hobby. Improving the setup to solve various problems I identified as I learned.

I would advise against a pot smaller than 10 gallons (mine is 11 but called 10)

I stopped using a prechiller after a few summer brews. Didn't bother this summer and simply accept the need for more coolig the the fermentation chamber before a cold pitch. It did work but I didn't see much need after experimenting with one.

I would not bother with a thermometer on the pot. It's redundant and gets in the way during lautering. A good instand read thermometer is a much better investment.

I'm happy with the chugger pump. I regulate the flow with a valve on the out port. Anything from a trickle to full bore is doable.

Plate chillers get a bad rep but I like mine and how it fits my stove-top counter-top setup. No problems cleaning it after a brew.

An IC might be easier but I like not having to trail a garden hose in from outside to get the flow rate I would want. If going the IC route I would go big.

I might install a better dip tube at some point but that's minimally important. The dip-tube I cobbled together works well.

I really like having a whirlpool arm. There are neater ways to install one that I would chose if doing it again but I just wanted to repurpose the hole in the pot from the dial thermometer I removed.

Hope that ramble is of some use. Let me know if there are any other bits and pieces you want outlined in more detail. I'm happy to share what little experience I have. If it's of use, all the better.

Cheers NTex. (You entering BBBO this year? I'll hopefully be there for 1 of the days)

Thanks for the info. I saw the one picture where you removed the thermometer but missed where you converted that to a whirlpool port. I have to sit down with some of my recipes and volumes to figure out the best size pot that will let me do the most. I'm pretty sure that a 10 gallon pot will be too large a diameter for my stove burner to achieve a rapid boil. My plan for a chiller is counterflow.

I have a few beers in BBBO this year. Hoping to be there as well.

 

[Gavin C]

Hibiscus Saison.

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1486935337.144681.jpg

View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1486935359.444393.jpg

 

[Gavin C]

Today I tried out a couple of techniques I have been meaning to explore for some time.
Grain Conditioning
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Underletting BIAB style

The grains look very fluffy after milling. The husks are largely intact. No dust. I will be doing this from now on I suspect. I'm very happy with the difference from regular milling.

View attachment 393173

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Separate steep of Roasted Grains for this Schwarzbier
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@Tiber_brew
Thanks for the yeast.

Schwarzbier OG 1.049 (My second effort at this style)
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1489880086.944707.jpg

 

[HomeDrewBrew]

Would it be an increase of efficiency this route?.
Thanks

 

[TexasWine]

Isn't grain conditioning incredible!?!?

 

[Gavin C]

Would it be an increase of efficiency this route?.
Thanks

It has no impact on efficiency. (I suppose in theory if you're losing less stuff to dust it will have a negligible positive impact but it would not be measurable on this scale)

Isn't grain conditioning incredible!?!?

Yes. It really makes a difference to the grist's appearance.

Given what I saw, I'm surprised it's not considered the norm for folks using a conventional mash-tun where intact husks are going to be to the brewer's benefit.

I've been meaning to give it a try for ages. I really liked the absence of dust and the light fluffy grist that resulted.

 

[arnobg]

It has no impact on efficiency. (I suppose in theory if you're losing less stuff to dust it will have a negligible positive impact but it would not be measurable on this scale)







Yes. It really makes a difference to the grist's appearance.



Given what I saw, I'm surprised it's not considered the norm for folks using a conventional mash-tun where intact husks are going to be to the brewer's benefit.



I've been meaning to give it a try for ages. I really liked the absence of dust and the light fluffy grist that resulted.

I am probably going to be the only person to disagree. I started grain conditioning about a year or so ago and loved it at first too. For some reason my efficiency suffered though. I was missing my target OG by 2-3 points every time. Last week I decided to try it without doing that again and hit my numbers spot on for both brew sessions. Nothing else in my process changed.

My only thought is that when comparing the crush, the conditioned grains seem more intact and the inside of the grain less split open/exposed.

 

[Gavin C]

I am probably going to be the only person to disagree. I started grain conditioning about a year or so ago and loved it at first too. For some reason my efficiency suffered though. I was missing my target OG by 2-3 points every time. Last week I decided to try it without doing that again and hit my numbers spot on for both brew sessions. Nothing else in my process changed.

My only thought is that when comparing the crush, the conditioned grains seem more intact and the inside of the grain less split open/exposed.

I suppose I should have qualified my assertion WRT the lack of effect on efficiency being based on just theory.

Obviously with me having just 1 personal data point I could neither back up or refute any claim on efficiency with any weight. Seems your bigger data set should give your opinion given greater credence than mine.

I'll continue to condition my grain for the foreseeable future and see how my numbers trend. I'm a bit of a dataphile so always value these sort of insights. Thanks mate.

 

[RevKev]

Hibiscus Saison.

View attachment 388674

View attachment 388675

Last time I did one was extract going to make a recipe up and do a BIAB 15 gallons, 7.75 gallons goes to keg and the rest gets soured. Yum. Making me want this now..

 

[arnobg]

I suppose I should have qualified my assertion WRT the lack of effect on efficiency being based on just theory.



Obviously with me having just 1 personal data point I could neither back up or refute any claim on efficiency with any weight. Seems your bigger data set should give your opinion given greater credence than mine.



I'll continue to condition my grain for the foreseeable future and see how my numbers trend. I'm a bit of a dataphile so always value these sort of insights. Thanks mate.

That would be great if you could chime back in later! It could be that it was just a coincidence during those brews, but my data showed that something was definitely going on and I want to get to the bottom of it!

 

[daveMN]

@Gavin, are you double crushing your grain after you condition? What gap are you using?

 

[daveMN]

Double post.

 

[z-bob]

My stove won't bring my 8 gallon pot to a boil. It has trouble with a 22 quart canner if I have more than 3.5 gallons in it. I'm thinking seriously about getting a brewhardware.com "hot rod" to supplement the heat. It's kind of pricey, but it looks like it will last forever, and cheap immersion heaters don't.

Do you think 875W is enough heat to make a difference? (they are out of 1500W elements, and I have a 3500W 240V element already) I'd really like to use my larger kettle. Worst case is I can try it and it's not enough, then buy a larger element later.

 

[wilserbrewer]

My stove won't bring my 8 gallon pot to a boil. It has trouble with a 22 quart canner if I have more than 3.5 gallons in it. I'm thinking seriously about getting a brewhardware.com "hot rod" to supplement the heat. It's kind of pricey, but it looks like it will last forever, and cheap immersion heaters don't.

Do you think 875W is enough heat to make a difference? (they are out of 1500W elements, and I have a 3500W 240V element already) I'd really like to use my larger kettle. Worst case is I can try it and it's not enough, then buy a larger element later.

While the 875w element may get you to boil, heating times would be much quicker with a 2000w element, assuming you have a 20 amp circuit in your kitchen.

Since you already have the 3500/4 or 875w element give it a try.

With the larger element, you would just run the element at 100% and use the stove dial to control the boil.

 

[Gavin C]

@Gavin, are you double crushing your grain after you condition? What gap are you using?

No. I use a single crush. Double milling is pointless. No benefit for extra dust/work/time. Not a wild lot of extra work but still pointless based on my numbers over repeated brews across multiple variables. Single crush is as effective as double based on my data.

I use the narrowest possible setting on my mill.

 

[z-bob]

While the 875w element may get you to boil, heating times would be much quicker with a 2000w element, assuming you have a 20 amp circuit in your kitchen. Since you already have the 3500/4 or 875w element give it a try.

With the larger element, you would just run the element at 100% and use the stove dial to control the boil.

I ordered the HotRod today. And I decided to get a 1650W stainless steel element and some other junk I wanted from Amazon Prime. My 3500W element is not stainless and I don't know how important that is.

I can buy a 40' SJEOOW extension cord at Fleet Farm (the 'E' is important for the temperature rating) and cut however much I need off the plug end, then put a replacement plug on the scrap for a nice outdoor cold-weather cord.

 

[arnobg]

@Gavin C thanks for the help with my first Dunkel a few pages back. This is the second lager I have done and it came out FANTASTIC! It is almost exactly the Dunkel I was going for. Cheers!

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