Imperial Amber V2 "Jenny Is A Punk"

[RonPopeil]

I really like Nugget nectar and want to play with the validity of the imperial amber ale. I think their beer is much more about making that nugget hop flavor balance with other hops. My idea is more about resembling a food or desert that would hit the hallmarks flavors of an amber ale. In this i'm thinking of a desert bread or cake with Caramel/Toffee and Pineapple.

Started calling this idea "Jenny is a punk". Was talking to one of the guys at LHBS and he said he has an amber that he does which has a girl next door sort of name. I figured since my amber is supposed to be more edgey and abrasive it needed a girl next door name with an edge. Voila. This is a continuation of my last Amber.

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f12/imperial-amber-453009/

The good about the first try. I'm thinking Jenny is a smoker. I have some C80 in the first run and the subtle burnt sugar is nice. I'd like to get that idea across a bit more. I also really like the pineapple flavor coming off the hops. I want some of that as well.

The bad. The last rendition is very sweet, not bitter enough and hop flavor is mellow and laid back. These are the areas I'm interested in fixing.

So here's the new idea.


12.5# Two Row Pale
2# Munich 10
1# Biscuit
1# C120
0.5# Special B
0.25# Chocolate Malt (US)

2oz Chinook @ 60
0.25oz Citra @ 15
0.5oz Centennial @ 15
0.5oz Citra @ 10
1.0oz Centennial @ 10
0.5oz Citra @ 5
1.0oz Centennial @ 5
1.0oz Citra @ 0
1.5oz Centennial @ 0

1.75oz Citra DH for 7 days

mash at 153. out at 170. Pitch wlp007 and primary for 2 weeks, secondary/DH 1 week, carb 1 week.

OG: 1.074
FG: 1.012
IBU: 93
ABV: 7.9

Gravity numbers are based on the last run. Efficiency was 74% and attenuation really was that high even with 3# of crystal which kinda bummed me out. I was aiming for 1.018 FG. Debating trying it with wlp002 and a step mash.

 

[chickypad]

I mainly wanted to say I like the evolution of the name
It is a lot of dark crystal, but I know your'e going for less sweet and dark crystal does come out much less sweet and more raisiny IME. Do you think the pineapple was citra or from the mosaic? Never used mosaic. Wondering if you should throw some of that in late or DH.

 

[RonPopeil]

lol thanks. people say i'm good at naming my beers. Now I just need to make something worthy of a name.

From what I understand the pineapple is a result of the combination of citra and centennial. I'm not really sure how the math works but I remember other people saying this combo was very pineappley. A friend brought over some Victory Dirt Wolf which is Citra, Amarillo, Simcoe and Chinook and the pineapple is even more in play there so I'm thinking it's the Citra. I'm doing a southern hemisphere IPA soon and that will have loads of citra. We'll see if the pineapple returns.

Mosaic is strong in the nose but doesn't lend much to the flavor. If anything it clashes a bit. I don't think I like mosaic with lots of crystal but it could just be the gross amount of caramel in this stuff.

I figured Arrogant Bastard uses a very dark crystal so I could pull off a dark crystal in a hoppy beer. I also really like this pineapple pound cake idea that is working it's way out of this beer.

Some questions:

How abrasive is Chinook? Magnum doesn't carry this beer at all. It's just bitter enough to not be cloying. I want something that will have a bracing bitterness but not run acid on your tongue and ruin the flavors I'm trying to develop. My first instinct was to just double the Magnum to give it an incognito bitterness. I like the idea of Chinook though. My LHBS owner loves that stuff. Tried a beer he did with citra and chinook. Didn't like the combo but I did like the bitterness.

How much roast should I expect from Special B and Chocolate malt? I want just enough to give some burnt flavor around the edges. I don't want it to be stout like or roasty perse'.

 

[chickypad]

I figured Arrogant Bastard uses a very dark crystal so I could pull off a dark crystal in a hoppy beer.

This is exactly what I was thinking. I seems a bit raisiny to me (in a good way) and not sweet. I don't find chinook to be abrasive or harsh as many folks do, to me it's more what I would call a sharp bittering that I like in American ales. That's more chocolate than I have used in an amber, I tend to go just an ounce or two that I think gives a tiny hint of roast, though I wonder if that's because I know it's in there. Too noticeable and I think you'd be tipping towards a brown.

 

[RonPopeil]

So it's time to bring this guy back. Purchased a version of this. I didn't come home and jot down my notes so I went off of memory.

this time we have:

10# marris otter
3.5# briess munich 10
1.5# crystal 150 (UK)
.5# victory.

Hops are going to be a hot mess. I bought a lot. The main idea is to bitter with chinook this go around so I have one oz of that.

Hop Inventory:

1oz Simcoe
1oz Nugget
2oz Amarillo
2oz Galaxy
2oz Centennial
3oz Brambling Cross
1oz Strisselspalt (FR)
1oz Liberty (don't ask it was supposed to be another pack of strisselspalt)

Fermenting with a large amount of WLP007.

I average 74% efficiency at the fermenter so my numbers look like:

OG: 1.066
FG: 1.012 (this is going off of the measured attenuation from the last batch. same yeast.)
ABV: 7.0
IBU: Around 70's. I don't feel like adjusting all my hop additions for proper alpha's. I also don't care.
SRM: 20.9

The way I envisioned it at LHBS all of the Galaxy, Centennial and Amarillo were going in this thing at 10 and 5. 3oz each. Anyone have any suggestions?

 

[chickypad]

Did you end up making the last version with the centennial/citra? Grainbill looks fairly similar less the chocolate. Just wondering how it turned out.

 

[RonPopeil]

The first batch was Citra and Centennial. I'm subbing Galaxy in for Citra this time. Not a huge change in theory.

This is my second attempt at this. I wanted to brew the proposed changes but I wasn't able to come home and copy down the exact recipe so I put this one together. Pretty close and it does address the changes that were proposed. Down to 1.5# of dark crystal from 3# of C40/60 blend and chinook is in to stiffen the bittering over magnum. Debating using Nugget since I have an ounce of that as well.

The grain bill is somewhat set. I can add to it if need be. The rest is up for debate. I have a beer ahead of this in the pipeline.

 

[RonPopeil]

Brewed this rendition about a six weeks ago and it's now properly aged and ready.

C120/SpecB was replaced with all Simpson's C150 for the total amount of 1.5#. I figured this would be safer than playing with Special B.

Citra was sold out when I went in to get this so I ended up with AU Galaxy. Makes a proper amber flavor but Citra/Centennial/Amarillo would've been much preferred. I'm going to finalize Citra into this beer as well.

Next round is going to be:

12.5# Two Row Pale
3.0# Munich 10 (Light)
.75# C80
.5# Biscuit

.5oz Nugget @ 60
.5oz Citra and Centennial @ 10, 5, 0 (total of 2oz of each hop)
1oz Amarillo @ 5 and 0

Switching house yeast to WLP002 this year. My WLP007 culture lasted me about 2 years