I think my beers are oxyidized

[urg8rb8]

I brewed an IPA that was 95% 2-row. I also cold crashed for the first time and also dry hopped for the first time. Three weeks after bottling, hop flavor and aroma were popping! Best beer I've ever made. The beer was also very light in color. However, three weeks later, the beer is much darker and the flavor has changed. The only thing I could think of is oxidation. But I read so many people saying how cold crashing and dry hopping doesn't affect oxidation.

Not sure what I did wrong. I allowed an awesome IPA turn into a not so awesome one.

 

[schematix]

You got it. The solution is not as easy as you probably want though.

Read this... it's not 100% applicable to what you're doing, but it'll get you thinking in the right direction: http://www.germanbrewing.net/docs/Brewing-Bavarian-Helles.pdf

 

[urg8rb8]

I guess next time I won't cold crash. I'll just let the beer sit in the fermenter longer.

 

[V-Fib]

You got it. The solution is not as easy as you probably want though.

Read this... it's not 100% applicable to what you're doing, but it'll get you thinking in the right direction: http://www.germanbrewing.net/docs/Brewing-Bavarian-Helles.pdf

I'll never be a Bavaria brewer
Unless I can fill my backyard with CO2, breath it and make fire burn in it.

 

[schematix]

I'll never be a Bavaria brewer
Unless I can fill my backyard with CO2, breath it and make fire burn in it.

There's something to this that until you try it, you don't know what you're missing.

There is a subtle flavor difference between commercial beer and home brew, and it's oxidation.

Ignore it and there is a limit as to how good your beer can be. But ignorance is bliss as they say.

 

[urg8rb8]

There's something to this that until you try it, you don't know what you're missing.

There is a subtle flavor difference between commercial beer and home brew, and it's oxidation.

Ignore it and there is a limit as to how good your beer can be. But ignorance is bliss as they say.

It's not possible to ignore it now that I know what the difference in taste is!

 

[MadHomebrewer]

Had the same issues for hoppy beers when I was bottling. I have since upgraded to kegging and I'm pretty happy with the beers now. I do drop a tea infuser with some hops in it into my kegs to prolong the hoppy goodness.

 

[urg8rb8]

Had the same issues for hoppy beers when I was bottling. I have since upgraded to kegging and I'm pretty happy with the beers now. I do drop a tea infuser with some hops in it into my kegs to prolong the hoppy goodness.

I have a bunch of kegs myself. I just bottled so that I could share with people. I think it's the cold crashing that messed it up. I won't cold crash next time with the same recipe and see how it goes.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

I thought I read here oxidation takes a few months to make a difference in taste. My beers are long gone by then.I cold crash in buckets every brew but I think Ill do a split batch and cold crash one in the keg and one in the bucket next time just to see if I notice a difference.I'm already thinking no but worthy of a test

 

[jddevinn]

Cold crashing without positive CO2 pressure means that you pulled air into the fermenter.

 

[jeremy0209]

Cold crashing without positive CO2 pressure means that you pulled air into the fermenter.

True, but it doesn't mean that you lost the protective blanket of C02 that you already had. Having said that, I've been experimenting with fermenting in kegs and using C02 to transfer. So far, I've done one saison and it's pretty damn tasty. I'll see how it holds up in a couple of weeks.

 

[Derp]

True, but it doesn't mean that you lost the protective blanket of C02 that you already had.

The general consensus is that such a blanket doesn't exist. CO2 and oxygen mix quite well.

 

[jddevinn]

True, but it doesn't mean that you lost the protective blanket of C02 that you already had. Having said that, I've been experimenting with fermenting in kegs and using C02 to transfer. So far, I've done one saison and it's pretty damn tasty. I'll see how it holds up in a couple of weeks.

Gases homogenize by diffusion they do not stratifying by density.

 

[JONNYROTTEN]

I spoke to Brulosophy today he said he'll be doing a cold crashing ExBEERement testing for oxidation. Should be interesting

 

[schematix]

I spoke to Brulosophy today he said he'll be doing a cold crashing ExBEERement testing for oxidation. Should be interesting

Hopefully he includes the use of a Dissolved Oxygen meter in the experiment. The threshold concentration for oxidation is so low that he could easily end up serving 2 oxidized samples and be none the wiser.

 

[rhys333]

How come everybody's getting oxidized beer all of a sudden? I've had a few issues here and there, but oxidation has never been one of them. Are you folks 100% sure the issue is O2?

 

[LKABrewer]

How come everybody's getting oxidized beer all of a sudden? I've had a few issues here and there, but oxidation has never been one of them. Are you folks 100% sure the issue is O2?

What makes you think you do not have oxidation issues? Just because you don't taste cardboard does not mean your beer is not oxidized. Unless low oxidation is part of your brewing process, then you have oxidized beers. You just don't know it

 

[schematix]

How come everybody's getting oxidized beer all of a sudden? I've had a few issues here and there, but oxidation has never been one of them. Are you folks 100% sure the issue is O2?

Oxidation has been happening to home brewers for millennia, but no one knew what it was, or even knew otherwise. The flavor isn't so objectionable as to raise a huge red flag. It's more of a loss of potential better flavor than it is a bad flavor.

 

[MadHomebrewer]

Plus with beers such as enjoy by, beer freshness has come along way. Best option probably would be transfer to a keg cold crash under co2 and transfer to another keg to serve or bottle out of.

 

[jddevinn]

My beer was definitely "good" before I started addressing oxidation post fermentation, adding in measures to stop this made a noticeably different "gooder" beer. Changes in the hot side O2 uptake is still in progress but making a difference in certain styles.

 

[Brew_G]

How come everybody's getting oxidized beer all of a sudden? I've had a few issues here and there, but oxidation has never been one of them. Are you folks 100% sure the issue is O2?

It's the big craze now after that article came out about low-dissolved oxygen brewing.

 

[doug293cz]

The general consensus is that such a blanket doesn't exist. CO2 and oxygen mix quite well.

It's not a consensus, it's a scientific fact. There is no such thing as a protective CO2 blanket, unless you are generating CO2 faster than diffusion and/or convection can dissipate the CO2. When you get to cold crashing, you are no longer generating significant CO2, so no blanket. There is no room for discussion or debate. Watch the video. Br2 is 3.6 times heavier than CO2, and homogenizes in about 30 minutes. CO2's molecular wt (44) is more like the NO2 (46) shown later in the video, so it will homogenize at about the same rate as the NO2 (much faster than the Br2.)

[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oLPBnhOCjM[/ame]

Brew on

 

[brewcat]

How come everybody's getting oxidized beer all of a sudden? I've had a few issues here and there, but oxidation has never been one of them. Are you folks 100% sure the issue is O2?

My guess is time of year. Letting bottles sit at warmer temps just ages the beer faster exposing oxidation issues.

 

[m00ps]

How come everybody's getting oxidized beer all of a sudden? I've had a few issues here and there, but oxidation has never been one of them. Are you folks 100% sure the issue is O2?

Oxidation in your beer causes cancer. Didnt you read the article???

 

[rhys333]

What makes you think you do not have oxidation issues? Just because you don't taste cardboard does not mean your beer is not oxidized. Unless low oxidation is part of your brewing process, then you have oxidized beers. You just don't know it

I certainly can't taste the effects of oxidation, so I would say that I don't have oxidation issues.

 

[jddevinn]

It's the big craze now after that article came out about low-dissolved oxygen brewing.

The discussion on post fermentation oxidation has been going on much longer than that.

The hot side oxidation talk is mostly new.

 

[imasickboy]

I certainly can't taste the effects of oxidation, so I would say that I don't have oxidation issues.

This is exactly how I feel about it. While I'm not dumb to the fact that oxidation is, in fact, occurring, I can say for certain that it is not happening at a rate that causes negative results in my beers. Thus, no oxidation "problem" here.

Something else that people might be experiencing is the taste of ****ty grain bills. People are so tuned into crafting the hoppiest IPA's they can that they're putting together really one-sided beers. Once those hops fade, the malt starts to show through, and because of the lack of attention paid to the grain bill, the results aren't very good.

I understand that times change, and that cellaring is pretty much gone by the wayside lately, so long-term change in a beer is not something most are concerned with. But it's worth the reminder that our beers will go through changes, even in the short term. Recipes should be crafted with this understanding, or smaller batches should be brewed for quicker consumption.

 

[Brew_G]

The discussion on post fermentation oxidation has been going on much longer than that.



The hot side oxidation talk is mostly new.

I don't disagree, but it seems like so many conversations right now revolve around oxidation in whatever form, and that's a lot to do with the LoDO discussion.

 

[rhys333]

Oxidation in your beer causes cancer. Didnt you read the article???

Hehe I dialed back on my article reading after that whacky BIAB write-up a few weeks ago.

 

[urg8rb8]

This is exactly how I feel about it. While I'm not dumb to the fact that oxidation is, in fact, occurring, I can say for certain that it is not happening at a rate that causes negative results in my beers. Thus, no oxidation "problem" here.

Something else that people might be experiencing is the taste of ****ty grain bills. People are so tuned into crafting the hoppiest IPA's they can that they're putting together really one-sided beers. Once those hops fade, the malt starts to show through, and because of the lack of attention paid to the grain bill, the results aren't very good.

I understand that times change, and that cellaring is pretty much gone by the wayside lately, so long-term change in a beer is not something most are concerned with. But it's worth the reminder that our beers will go through changes, even in the short term. Recipes should be crafted with this understanding, or smaller batches should be brewed for quicker consumption.

That did not apply to me in this case. No doubt I started with a light colored beer that ended up being noticeably darker with different flavors. I think this is because of the cold crashing. I will do the same batch with no cold crashing and see what happens. For dry hopping, I will not take the buckets lid off. I will just pull the airlock out and pour the hops through the whole.

 

[doug293cz]

That did not apply to me in this case. No doubt I started with a light colored beer that ended up being noticeably darker with different flavors. I think this is because of the cold crashing. I will do the same batch with no cold crashing and see what happens. For dry hopping, I will not take the buckets lid off. I will just pull the airlock out and pour the hops through the whole.

How long did you cold crash? It's true that cold crashing will suck O2 into the fermenter headspace, and the longer the cold crash time before packaging, the more O2 (and potential for oxidation) the beer will pick up. If you cold crash without CO2 back pressure, you should keep your cold crash time to the absolute minimum.

Brew on

 

[urg8rb8]

How long did you cold crash? It's true that cold crashing will suck O2 into the fermenter headspace, and the longer the cold crash time before packaging, the more O2 (and potential for oxidation) the beer will pick up. If you cold crash without CO2 back pressure, you should keep your cold crash time to the absolute minimum.

Brew on

Cold crashed for a few days. I will no longer cold crash because having clear beer isn't my number one priority. Not worth the risk of having this happen again.

 

[rhys333]

I get clear beers without cold crashing. 7 -10 days in the fridge and they're usually crystal clear.

 

[urg8rb8]

I get clear beers without cold crashing. 7 -10 days in the fridge and they're usually crystal clear.

That's what I used to do and that is what I will continue to do. No more cold crashing.

 

[rhys333]

That's what I used to do and that is what I will continue to do. No more cold crashing.

Simple is often best hey? I find even the low floc strains drop clear given 7-10 days in the fridge. I did a kolsch recently with the powdery WY 2565 and that sucker looks filtered! A good hot break, kettle fining and cold break does wonders.

 

[ballandkeg]

If you are using an auto siphon to transfer or bottle, look for oxygenation there first. A leak at the o ring is a very efficient way to aerate your beer. You can check it by siphoning water into a clear glass vessel. Submerge the siphon outlet. If you see bubbles you are drawing air from somewhere.

 

[urg8rb8]

If you are using an auto siphon to transfer or bottle, look for oxygenation there first. A leak at the o ring is a very efficient way to aerate your beer. You can check it by siphoning water into a clear glass vessel. Submerge the siphon outlet. If you see bubbles you are drawing air from somewhere.

Thanks for the suggestion. Can you explain in more detail what you mean?

 

[ballandkeg]

Sure. If you Google " auto siphon leaks " you will see lots of posts about this. It tends to draw air in around the seals on the piston. You can confirm if yours is leaking by siphoning water into a clear container with the hose submerged in the tank you are siphoning into. You will see lots of bubbles if it is sucking air in at the piston seal. If it is leaking you will oxygenate your beer while transferring to your bottling bucket and into your bottles.

 

[urg8rb8]

Sure. If you Google " auto siphon leaks " you will see lots of posts about this. It tends to draw air in around the seals on the piston. You can confirm if yours is leaking by siphoning water into a clear container with the hose submerged in the tank you are siphoning into. You will see lots of bubbles if it is sucking air in at the piston seal. If it is leaking you will oxygenate your beer while transferring to your bottling bucket and into your bottles.

I get it. Thanks for the explanation! I'll give it a test.