I Am NOT a Fan Of Star-San

[BrewDrinkRepeat]

I'm not a fan of star san. Mostly because I want to be able to use the same cleaner for plastics as metal and glass.

To be clear, StarSan is NOT a cleaner. It's a sanitizer. And it sanitizes plastic, metal and glass equally well (minus the potential issues with scratches / gouges on plastic items).

Sanitizers and cleaners are very different products... and to be clear, you must clean anything (with a proper cleaning product like PBW, Oxiclean, soap & water, etc.) before you can sanitize.

 

[Plastic Brewkettle]

@MaxStout Hey! Thanks for the hot tip on a pump thingy. That looks like something I could use. Probably solve half to five eighths of my problems.

 

[BrewDrinkRepeat]

Allegedly it breaks down plastic. I don't claim firsthand experience or the scientific background to back up that claim. It's just something I read here from a poster that seemed like they knew the chemistry well enough.

Yes it can... over time. Not in the typical sanitization times (30 seconds to a few minutes). There are no issues whatsoever with sanitizing plastic items with Star San.

I hold on to my Star San from one brewday to the next (typically about two weeks) in an off-the-shelf food grade bucket from Lowes, no issues whatsoever (to the Star San, or the bucket).

I have left vinyl tubing in Star San by accident for a few weeks... had to toss them, as they were "slimy" from the chemical reaction.

 

[RufusBrewer]

I had one of those Vinator pump things, but the cheesy plastic broke after a year or so. Now I just dunk bottles in a bucket of Starsan and drain. Rubber gloves on for that.

Iodophor, in higher concentrations, is a broad spectrum disinfectant. I think it even kills coronaviruses at the right concentration. I seem to recall seeing it on the FDA list of approved disinfectants.

My first Vinator pump I got used, it had been used for a while and it lasted me for several moreyears. I gave it away when I moved. The replacement has Bern fine. One vote for nope on the Vinator , one thumbs up.

Before that, I would put bottles upright in a plastic tote bin and siphon Iodophore or Stars an up to the lip of the bottle to get enough contact time.

As I understand it, Iodophore is kills the fungus type of stuff as well as the germ-like things. Star San kills mostly germy things. How much if a threat is fungus kind if stuff to the home brewer? I do not know.

I have used both products in some cases.

 

[MaxStout]

@MaxStout Hey! Thanks for the hot tip on a pump thingy. That looks like something I could use. Probably solve half to five eighths of my problems.

Load it up with iodophor solution and you'll have the other 3/8-1/2 taken care of.

 

[Brewdog80]

I'm not a fan of star san. Mostly because I want to be able to use the same cleaner for plastics as metal and glass. But I do keep some around for the occasional use and have never noticed any burns.

IT IS NOT A CLEANER. Don't make the simple mistake of trying to clean with a sanitizer.
It won't hurt HDPE, PP, or PET. it comes in a HDPE container so stick with that (almost 100% of your buckets) and you'll be ok

 

[Brewdog80]

OH, I have used idophor for years, and while it works fine, and i actually trust it more, it does stain pretty easily....

 

[BigEd]

Allegedly it breaks down plastic. I don't claim firsthand experience or the scientific background to back up that claim. It's just something I read here from a poster that seemed like they knew the chemistry well enough.

Star-San comes in a plastic (polyethylene) bottle. Plastic used for brew buckets, fermenters, and the like are also polyethylene. There are many different types of plastic but the ones used commonly in homebrewing are just fine with Star-San.

 

[RufusBrewer]

@MaxStout Hey! Thanks for the hot tip on a pump thingy. That looks like something I could use. Probably solve half to five eighths of my problems.

A few pumps and hanging upside down on a bottle tree (also with the $15-$20) is all I need to keep from worry on bottle day.

 

[balrog]

StarSan is indeed a bacteriacide, whilst iodophor and proper concentrations of bleach are broader spectrum.

[Edited as I've been educated and was guilty of repeating incorrect info]

I do a bleach bombing once in a while of fermenters and equipment, with wash & rinse, just so as to feel better about keeping any nasties at bay.

 

[Brooothru]

I use Iodophor too. It's a broader ranging sanitizer and doesn't seem to be affected as much by water pH as does StarSan.

Though if I shake the water/iodophor out of my bottles after sanitizing, they'll be somewhat bubbly inside too.

And whether I use iodophor or StarSan, I toss it the same day. I don't save it for later after mixing.

Star San can be saved in a sealed container for "a few days" after mixing. I add about 5 ml into a small pint spray bottle. That roughly works out to the recommended dilution of 1 fl oz per 5 gallons. If I haven't used it up in a week I'll toss it and mix a fresh batch.

As long as the pH is within normal range, it is still an effective sanitizer. In an open soaking tub it'll be depleted in a day. Bottled up in a sprayer it's good for at least a week.

 

[Yesfan]

Biggest complaint from me on StarSan is it dries my hand pretty easy. For the most part, I love it.

For those who use EVA Barrier/Duotight for their gas/beer lines, I've read here Starsan is bad on the Duotight connectors. Seems they crack overtime.

Link

Slightly off topic, if the new style keg disconnects from Kegland are made from the same material as the Duotight fittings, are they going to be prone to cracking from Starsan as well?

 

[BrewZer]

I add about 5 ml into a small pint spray bottle. That roughly works out to the recommended dilution of 1 fl oz per 5 gallons.

4.25 milliliters is the appropriate dilution amount for 92 ounces (2720 ml) of water. You're going in with a huge overdose.

 

[mashpaddled]

I've never had problems using starsan although I can confirm the comment above that concentrated starsan will dissolve the finish on formica countertops.

 

[hout17]

I Am a HUGE Fan Of Star-San

and Saniclean

Lol..

 

[RufusBrewer]

StarSan is indeed a bacteriacide, whilst iodophor and proper concentrations of bleach are broader spectrum.

[Edited as I've been educated and was guilty of repeating incorrect info]

I do a bleach bombing once in a while of fermenters and equipment, with wash & rinse, just so as to feel better about keeping any nasties at bay.

There is a great book called "The Hot Zone" about the early days of ebola virus. The researchers that were at risk to be exposed to ebola, always kept a bottle of bleach handy in case of accidental exposure. These scientists and doctors could use just about anything. They trusted bleach.

I use bleach to clean stuff, then rinse well with tap water. Then follow up with something to wipe out what ever might have ridden in with your tap water. Which I expect is an easy job. Star San or Iodophore will work.

 

[BrewDrinkRepeat]

I Am a HUGE Fan Of Star-San

+1000000000000

IMO it's one of the single-greatest homebrew-related products that has ever existed.

 

[Mr. Vern]

4.25 milliliters is the appropriate dilution amount for 92 ounces (2720 ml) of water. You're going in with a huge overdose.

Any time I get a new bottle I transfer my note for spray bottle and pints

 

[RufusBrewer]

edit. deleted duplicate post

 

[Eddy Monsoon]

4.25 milliliters is the appropriate dilution amount for 92 ounces (2720 ml) of water. You're going in with a huge overdose.

Whats the problem with going over .?

 

[Eddy Monsoon]

No mention of the yeast nutrient that starsan supplies ?

Or is that fake news ?

 

[DavidWood2115]

As long as the pH is within normal range, it is still an effective sanitizer. In an open soaking tub it'll be depleted in a day. Bottled up in a sprayer it's good for at least a week.

StarSan is effective so long as the pH remains below 3.5, how long it stays that low varies depending on your water chemistry. I have quite hard water and I find that StarSan still lasts weeks or months in an open HDPE bucket. I use RO water to dilute StarSan in my sprayer which I keep for months.

There are a couple of podcasts with Charlie Talley (creator of StarSan) that discuss this and other issues. Here is one thread that points to these and summarizes many of the key points.
https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/charlie-talley-five-star-chemicals-notes-from-brewcasts.58928/We’ll worth a listen.

 

[Brooothru]

Star San can be saved in a sealed container for "a few days" after mixing. I add about 5 ml into a small pint spray bottle. That roughly works out to the recommended dilution of 1 fl oz per 5 gallons. If I haven't used it up in a week I'll toss it and mix a fresh batch.

As long as the pH is within normal range, it is still an effective sanitizer. In an open soaking tub it'll be depleted in a day. Bottled up in a sprayer it's good for at least a week.

Oh.

I guess that must be the reason I haven't had any infections lately. Oops.

 

[Novacor]

Allegedly it breaks down plastic. I don't claim firsthand experience or the scientific background to back up that claim. It's just something I read here from a poster that seemed like they knew the chemistry well enough.

I made a gallon jug of distilled water into Star San that I kept for about 8 months. One day I found it sitting in a puddle because it had eaten through the jug. It will eventually eat through some plastic, but the contact time required is significantly more than your day to day brewing use.

 

[madscientist451]

Use what you like, I've been using Star-san for years without any issues.

 

[Knkbrand]

Allegedly it breaks down plastic. I don't claim firsthand experience or the scientific background to back up that claim. It's just something I read here from a poster that seemed like they knew the chemistry well enough.

Everyone's water is different, but I have kept my star san in a home depot bucket for the last 5 years, it doesn't seem to harm the orange beast.

 

[Beavis740]

Thought I’d heard it is bad to use with stainless especially if in contact with it a long time as it can corrode it

 

[passedpawn]

Thought I’d heard it is bad to use with stainless especially if in contact with it a long time as it can corrode it

You might be thinking of bleach, which I have proven the hard way will etch a hole right through the bottom of a SS cornie keg.

 

[scrap iron]

I keep star-san in a good spray bottle that I got at a farm and home store. These are better quality than the regular bottles at big box stores. They are made for around the farm. I use 1 1/2 ml per quart bottle mixed with RO water. 1oz per 5 gals when downsized to 1qt [29.57ml in 1oz for 5 gals divided by 20 qts in 5 gals = 1.47 ml]. I write the this on my bottle to remember. Math never lies.
I keep the spray bottle around for weeks with no ill effect. Spraying into bottles when bottling and also spraying down the inside of my SS fermenter bucket, inside hoses etc. I also make a batch in a plastic bucket with RO and it keeps for a long time.

 

[MaxStout]

I keep star-san in a good spray bottle that I got at a farm and home store. These are better quality than the regular bottles at big box stores. They are made for around the farm. I use 1 1/2 ml per quart bottle mixed with RO water. 1oz per 5 gals when downsized to 1qt [29.57ml in 1oz for 5 gals divided by 20 qts in 5 gals = 1.47 ml]. I write the this on my bottle to remember. Math never lies.
I keep the spray bottle around for weeks with no ill effect. Spraying into bottles when bottling and also spraying down the inside of my SS fermenter bucket, inside hoses etc. I also make a batch in a plastic bucket with RO and it keeps for a long time.

Home Despot sells Zep "chemically resistant" quart spray bottles. I do the same, 1.5ml per quart RO water. I also keep 5 gallons in a food-safe bucket for soaking gear, dunking bottles, etc. Never any issue with corrosion.

 

[beerisyummy]

I use PBW for cleaning & StarSan for sanitizing. No issues.

 

[bwible]

PBW will leave a white residue on bottles sometimes. But I’ve only had it happen when the bottles have been soaking for a long time (I’m talking I’ve left them soak for over a week) are not completely immersed. Like if the top of the neck is above the liquid. When this white residue forms I haven’t found anything thst will remove it. Nothing.

 

[eric19312]

I use PBW for cleaning or similar alkaline cleaner and star san for sanitizing. make the star san 5 gallons at a time and save it for 2-3 months before making again.

I find PBW drys my skin terribly. Even with a good rinse I can feel my skin turning into soap. Used to be after a brew day I'd be looking for hand lotion for 2-3 days after. But then I found out a quick dip in my star san bucket stops the PBW reaction. Hands not nearly so dry after a brew day.

 

[balrog]

I use PBW for cleaning or similar alkaline cleaner and star san for sanitizing. make the star san 5 gallons at a time and save it for 2-3 months before making again.

I find PBW drys my skin terribly. Even with a good rinse I can feel my skin turning into soap. Used to be after a brew day I'd be looking for hand lotion for 2-3 days after. But then I found out a quick dip in my star san bucket stops the PBW reaction. Hands not nearly so dry after a brew day.

Very interesting...

 

[day_trippr]

Basic chemistry

 

[RufusBrewer]

No mention of the yeast nutrient that starsan supplies ?

Or is that fake news ?

I think the yeast like the phosphorus (or something like that) that StarSan provided.

I am going to question how much it actually provides. if you go with 1 oz per 5 gallons, that is pretty diluted to start with. then you pour most of that 5 gallons out.

What do you have left? Foam. The foam ain't that much and what foam there is is almost all air. So you have a small fraction of almost nothing.

I am going to believe that StarSan foam is harmless. But it ain't going to help very much either.

 

[Deadalus]

Any time I get a new bottle I transfer my note for spray bottle and pints View attachment 760884

That's completely accurate to decimal places (top line, I didn't check the bottom one). 6ml to a gallon is just slightly over but what I use since I usually mix up a gallon or less since I use a gallon pitcher pretty often.

4.25 milliliters is the appropriate dilution amount for 92 ounces (2720 ml) of water. You're going in with a huge overdose.

The mixture of ml and ounces doesn't bother me, but this is an odd ratio to use. Is there a reason why?

 

[jerrylotto]

I don't understand why people use chemical sanitation for bottles. After clearning, I just put them into the oven, heat it to 350F and then just let everything cool off overnight.

 

[HB2 HughBHomeBrew]

+1000000000000

IMO it's one of the single-greatest homebrew-related products that has ever existed.

I had a 20 year hiatus from home brewing. Star-San and online supplies (especially with no LHBS for 100 miles) were the biggest improvements for me coming back. A stainless steel fermentor was good too. And BIAB. But I digress.

 

[D.B.Moody]

I don't understand why people use chemical sanitation for bottles. After clearning, I just put them into the oven, heat it to 350F and then just let everything cool off overnight.

I don't even do that. After rinsing sediment from the bottom, I just put them in the dishwasher with the other dishes and then store them in the basement (my fermentation, bottling, and conditioning area) for their next use. No StarSan and no problems for 28 years of brewing. YRMV.