Head formation/retention - boil too weak? mash temp too low?

[pwnshop]

Hey guys,

So I'm at a point where my beers have all been turning out fantastic taste-wise, but I'm noticing a trend where the majority of my beers lack body and don't quite form or retain head so well.

I have noticed that most of my beers end up with an FG below 1.010. usually around 1.006 or so. I think that maybe (despite what my thermometer reads) I am mashing lower than I intend to. How significant of an impact on head formation/retention would a lower than intended mash temp have? I generally shoot for 152ish on most beers. Usually over the hour mash i lose a degree or two max. Im wondering even if my thermometer is 10 degrees off (which i highly doubt) would mashing an hour at 142 completely kill head formation/retention? I have read that a prolonged step at 120-130 would kill head...

I batch sparge and typically do not do a mash out. I just wait 60 minutes-ish do an iodine test, then drain the mash tun. When I sparge the grainbed doesn't usually heat up to 170, maybe around 160 or so typically. Does sparge water temp have any affect on head formation/retention? I read in many spots that sparge temp doesnt matter when batch sparging?

My last thought is that maybe my boil is not vigorous enough? I do my boils on my electric stove, and it certainly boils, but its quite a weak boil. I read that a more vigorous boil can help head formation/body/head retention, but I don't know how significant of an impact this has?

This is an issue across the board for me on all beers that i have been making and I really want to sort this out properly. Even a wit I made felt flat and really had no body or head retention...

I don't want to start adding carapils to every batch or anything like that, so I'm just looking for some advice. I keep thinking my low FG numbers are the culprit, but other homebrewers make wickedly dry saisons and such with big rocky foamy heads, so I'm second guessing that... I dont think my thermometer is THAT far off if it is even off at all.

When bottling I am maybe a little heavy-handed with the starsan. usually when each bottle is almost full starsan bubbles out the top of the bottle. Then I cap it. It is dilluted as per the instructions though and I always read dont fear the foam, but could starsan in the bottle affect head retention?

Speaking of bottles, I do clean my bottles using PBW, but not every single time. Just if the bottles are crummy and gross. Otherwise I just rinse and starsan. This issue occurs in batches where I have used PBW on the bottles and also in batches where I haven't..

I don't get it! any advice on body/head formation/retention would be a big help thanks!

P.S my glasses are hand washed, its not because of soap or anything like that. body and head retention is crap in any glass.

P.P.S I bottle all batches, I dont keg. I use one of the priming sugar calculators online and crab to style. I have been thinking maybe those amounts are too low, so I have been overcarbing a bit, and still the beers feel flat and body-less...

P.P.P.S I don't think this is related to pitching rates either. It happens using dry yeast as well as liquid yeast. and i always do a nice big starter when using liquid yeast.

 

[hartlesj]

Two questions.
Have you calibrated your thermometer? I found mine off by almost 15 deg high on the initial calibration. Do both a boil check and an Ice water check. I have checked it about every few months since and haven't had to re-adjust it yet.
How much fining agents do you use? If you use Irish Moss, the instructions seem to require a little too much. I had this same problem, and cut down the Irish Moss by about half.

 

[m00ps]

people are going to ask for a few example recipes to help diagnose it. If its across everything from Belgian wits to IPAs to oatmeal stouts, id guess its something with your water.

The fact that they lack body is weird though, assuming youve tried different mash temps

 

[pwnshop]

Two questions.
Have you calibrated your thermometer? I found mine off by almost 15 deg high on the initial calibration. Do both a boil check and an Ice water check. I have checked it about every few months since and haven't had to re-adjust it yet.
How much fining agents do you use? If you use Irish Moss, the instructions seem to require a little too much. I had this same problem, and cut down the Irish Moss by about half.

I do use Whirlfloc in every batch. I do 5 gallon batches and use half a whirlfloc tablet in the boil (last 15 minutes). Maybe I will try a batch without whirlfoc... I hadnt thought of that.
I also used gelatin for the first time in my last batch. It has only been in the bottle for a week and a half so I'm still reserving judgment on that one until it has had more time to condition.
Regarding the thermometer - I haven't calibrated it and I guess I really should. I'm going to look into upgrading my thermometer because its kind of a pain to work with anyways!

 

[pwnshop]

people are going to ask for a few example recipes to help diagnose it. If its across everything from Belgian wits to IPAs to oatmeal stouts, id guess its something with your water.

The fact that they lack body is weird though, assuming youve tried different mash temps

Yeah I didn't bother to post recipes because its an issue across all styles... most of the recipes I have tried have been from HBT and typically they have all been made hundreds of times. its not the recipes its something in my process!!

I live in toronto and have been told the water is fine for brewing. The water stuff is still a bit over my head but here is our water profile: http://www.gtabrews.ca/toronto-water-profile/

 

[m00ps]

ill let someone else take a look at that. Ive never tried anything above measuring my mash pH a few times. My approach to brewing is bafflingly unscientific. I suppose I should feel lucky my beers turned out as well as they did early on or i wouldve gotten discouraged. Hopefully someone will be able to point something out

 

[dmtaylor]

Calibrate your thermometer.

 

[BlueHouseBrewhaus]

Biggest thing - absolutely calibrate your thermometer! I dropped my old dial thermometer once and didn't realize it had gotten off. I had the reverse problem. I mashed way too high and ended up with FG way off and totally messed up the brew. Calibrate!

 

[pwnshop]

OK I will calibrate before my next brew. Potentially I will just invest in a better thermometer as well.

Lets say for the sake of argument though: I intend to mash at 152, but my thermometer is so off I end up mashing low at 140. At the end of the mash I have lost 3 degrees so I'm at 137 (thermometer reads 149 so i think im fine).

Would the above scenario result in a brew with no body and no head? Because as I mentioned I have seen some brews mashed really low and with an extremely low FG that have killer head, so I find it super confusing

 

[lari]

im having similar issues though FG being too low isnt one of them. stouts, hefes, belgians - all thin and watery and look like soda. bottled a wit recently with 50% unmalted wheat and it is the clearest beer ive ever made without using any finings. im thinking its some kind of protein deficiency in beer, im not sure..

 

[helibrewer]

Low mash temps (120-130F) in highly modified malt can effect head retention and body. This is the protein rest range and is not desirable in highly modified malt. Are your carbonation levels adequate? You can use an entire whirlfloc tablet for 5 gallon batches and can add it at around 5 minutes remaining. Kettle finings actually do most of their work in the fermenter, so adding them later is better. Are you getting a good hot break in the boil? Are you cooling fast enough to get a good cold break after knockout?

Foam and head retention is based on protein, keep your mash temps in the 148 or higher range. I use whirlfloc, gelatin, FermCap and ClarityFerm and have never had an issue with foam or head retention.

 

[GPP33]

Calibrating your thermometer in ice water and boiling water is great if you are measuring ice water or boiling water, but you're not. You need to calibrate it at about 150 degrees.

However if it is off in the ice water and/or boiling water then I wouldn't trust it to read 150 correctly.

 

[laredo7mm]

...You need to calibrate it at about 150 degrees...

How do you go about doing that?

 

[dmtaylor]

How do you go about doing that?

I'm sure you can simply boil the water under a vacuum with pressure regulated to 3.722 psia, that would work.

 

[Epos7]

OK I will calibrate before my next brew. Potentially I will just invest in a better thermometer as well.

Lets say for the sake of argument though: I intend to mash at 152, but my thermometer is so off I end up mashing low at 140. At the end of the mash I have lost 3 degrees so I'm at 137 (thermometer reads 149 so i think im fine).

Would the above scenario result in a brew with no body and no head? Because as I mentioned I have seen some brews mashed really low and with an extremely low FG that have killer head, so I find it super confusing

I think the above scenario would result in a beer with very little alcohol

Around or below 140F, you're not going to convert many starches into sugars. Your thermometer might be off, but if you're making beer, I doubt it's off by 12 degrees.

 

[petrolSpice]

I'm sure you can simply boil the water under a vacuum with pressure regulated to 3.722 psia, that would work.

Now you also need a pressure gauge that's accurate to 0.001 psi