Gushing bottles

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centralpabrewer

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I have been having an issue with gushing bottles with nearly all batches i bottle. I have done the whole "replace equipment, sanitize, clean" etc. I am planning to do another thorough cleaning. But my question is does anyone know of a lab that will analyze beer samples to try to isolate the contaminant? I am at the point that I don't know what else to do.
 
It may not be a contamination issue but simple over carbonation. How much priming sugar are you using, and how are you measuring it?
 
For the last few batches I have purposely underprimed. And it didn’t make a difference I calculate the amount of priming sugar needed using BeerSmith and measure it with a scale.
 
How are you cleaning and sanitizing your bottles?
Is you bottling bucket scratched to hell?
Do you disassemble your bottle wand to get out all the boogers? You'd be amazed what can hide in that spring part.
 
Are all your bottles over carbed? When I was bottling I found that I wasn’t mixing the priming sugar well enough.
I got best results by adding priming sugar first to bottling bucket and stirring while I transferred. I then let it sit for 15 minutes before bottling.
 
Seems to be all bottles. I soak them in oxyclean over night. The rinse and air dry. Before bottling I hit with starsan. Bottling bucket is nearly new and I always disassemble the want and bucket.
 
I wish I knew the answer. I was having the same problem, except it wasn't all bottles. Keeping them in the fridge for a full week seemed to help, but there were still issues. I started numbering all my bottle caps to see if there was a pattern of it being early or late fills, but still couldn't figure it out. My final act was to by a kegging setup, which fixed it, but isn't very helpful for you.
 
Appreciate the response. I kinda have a similar problem with kegs. Sometimes after carbing they will continue to increase in pressure like there is still fermentation going on. Makes me think I have an infection. I just don’t know where
 
So you check the gravity but how do you know what the final gravity of YOUR batch will be? Doesn't the ability of the enzymes in the malt depend on the mash temperature and might your fermentable sugars be more than you assume? You hit a lower gravity and then what? Do you wait a few days and measure again to make certain that your fermentation is completely finished?

How do you store your yeast? Are you 100% certain that you are not introducing any bacteria into the yeast that may then continue to act on either the alcohol or the remaining sugars that they can ingest but the yeast cannot?
 
You may have already answered this...I perused through the other posts...but how long did they condition in the bottle before you opened/gushed, and had they been refrigerated prior to you opening them? If so, how long had they been refrigerated?

I've had similar issues after bottle conditioning when putting to the fridge to cool off (I was impatient and wanted to try it so badly). I found that bottles in the same batch that I refrigerated until they were very cold did not gush.
 
But my question is does anyone know of a lab that will analyze beer samples to try to isolate the contaminant? I am at the point that I don't know what else to do.

I can't see much point in finding out what the contaminant is - it's either there, or it's not.

Does your beer taste contaminated? Sharp? Funky? Sour? Fruity?
How long does your beer ferment before you bottle? At what temperature? Do you raise the temperature towards the end of fermentation to ensure completion?
As already asked, do you use (or have you used) diastaticus strains (eg. WY3711 French Saison)? Or Brett?
How long does it take before the bottles start gushing?
You said 'nearly all batches' gushed, which ones didn't? What was the yeast strain?
 
As @Jag75 mentioned, it sounds to me like a diastaticus infection.

Just double checking, but when you disassemble your bottling wand for a cleaning, do you remove the tiny black oring from the tiny black tip piece?
I had a string of infected batches a couple of years ago, no matter what I did I couldn't shake it. That is, until I noticed that tiny little oring. They really should switch to an orange or white oring to make it more noticeable.
 
Could it be ambient contaminants? This is something I've wondered about, not even because of a problem. Just pops into my head every so often:

If I had mold in my walls, would it end up getting into my beer, despite any sanitation efforts I make? We know sanitation doesn't get rid of everything, so if something is at a high enough concentration in the air and on surfaces, might it be next to impossible to keep it out of your beer?
 
Outside air has all kinds of spores and bacteria in it and at a startling density, yet there are many homebrewers who brew exclusively outside without problems.

When I started brewing I spent a lot of time fretting about every detail and obsessing over the risk of infection. It got so bad that I wasn't having fun any more. I had to consciously pull back and emulate the easy approach to sanitation that I saw on youtube videos and watching others brew at social events. Develop good sanitation practices and trust in them. And RDWHAHB.
 
How much sediment do you have at the bottom? I had a few gushing bottles in the past when I wasn't careful and transferred quite a lot of the sediment from the fermentor into the bottles. Once you open the bottle, the release of CO2 agitates the sediment and you get quite a lot of foam.
 
Have you tried using a different sanitizer? Star San does not kill everything and if it is an infection or diastaticus, you may not be able to get rid of it without switching your sanitizing product.
 
As @Jag75 mentioned, it sounds to me like a diastaticus infection.

Just double checking, but when you disassemble your bottling wand for a cleaning, do you remove the tiny black oring from the tiny black tip piece?
I had a string of infected batches a couple of years ago, no matter what I did I couldn't shake it. That is, until I noticed that tiny little oring. They really should switch to an orange or white oring to make it more noticeable.

I was thinking bottling wand too, but then he said he has the same trouble in kegs. So if it's an infection, it's probably coming from the fermenter. It would be helpful to know what he's fermenting in. My hunch is the fermenter valve is the source. Plastic or stainless steel, they need to be broken down, cleaned, and sanitized. It could also be his kettle valve. First time I broke down my 2 piece kettle valve, I was amazed at all the sludge in there, but I never had an infection.

Regardless on what changes he makes on the next batch, I would bottle a few without priming sugar to see what happens. Do they carb at all, or do they remain flat.
 
Outside air has all kinds of spores and bacteria in it and at a startling density, yet there are many homebrewers who brew exclusively outside without problems.

When I started brewing I spent a lot of time fretting about every detail and obsessing over the risk of infection. It got so bad that I wasn't having fun any more. I had to consciously pull back and emulate the easy approach to sanitation that I saw on youtube videos and watching others brew at social events. Develop good sanitation practices and trust in them. And RDWHAHB.

Ah, good point.
 
I have been brewing in my basement for about 3 years now, maybe four. Before that I brewed on my enclosed back porch. I always have fermented in my basement and have had this issue for years. The first batch i remember this happening with was a Sour Raspberry i brewed in 2015. I did not use lacto on this. I just soured it by using Lactic Acid and the tartness of the raspberries. I did brew a Berliner about a year before that and used Lacto Brevis. But I still have some bottled beer brewed between those two that does not gush.

When the beer does gush, i would say there is an off taste. I would not describe it as sour or funky. May be closer to a grape juice flavor.
A Wee Heavy i brewed in March was in the fermenter for a month to be sure it was done. I bottled in April and purposefully undercarbed. After about 4 weeks, the first bottle I opened gushed. This was with White Labs Edinburgh ale yeast. I degassed a sample and it is nearly 13 gravity points lower than when i bottled. Which makes me think it has to be between the fermenter and the bottle.
Sediment at the bottom of the bottle isnt that bad really, but I honestly can't say i really every looked at it closely to see how much there was.
I have used Saison yeast a few times over the years, Belle Saison being one of them. I read somewhere this has diastatic yeast in it. I have not used Brett for close to 15 years.
I use 3 piece ball valves and always dissemble after every brew day. The only thing I don't take all the way apart every time are my quick disconnects and some other stainless fittings.

As for sanitizers...I have used One Step, StarSan, and Iodaphor.

I did replace my bottle bucket a year or so ago, and I have replaced my tubing and siphon...but not at the same time.

Assuming it is ok through the boil, then I would need to replace my all my fermenters (or ferment in glass), siphon, tubing, plastic spoons, bottling bucket, wand...anything else????
 
I have been brewing in my basement for about 3 years now, maybe four. Before that I brewed on my enclosed back porch. I always have fermented in my basement and have had this issue for years. The first batch i remember this happening with was a Sour Raspberry i brewed in 2015. I did not use lacto on this. I just soured it by using Lactic Acid and the tartness of the raspberries. I did brew a Berliner about a year before that and used Lacto Brevis. But I still have some bottled beer brewed between those two that does not gush.

When the beer does gush, i would say there is an off taste. I would not describe it as sour or funky. May be closer to a grape juice flavor.
A Wee Heavy i brewed in March was in the fermenter for a month to be sure it was done. I bottled in April and purposefully undercarbed. After about 4 weeks, the first bottle I opened gushed. This was with White Labs Edinburgh ale yeast. I degassed a sample and it is nearly 13 gravity points lower than when i bottled. Which makes me think it has to be between the fermenter and the bottle.
Sediment at the bottom of the bottle isnt that bad really, but I honestly can't say i really every looked at it closely to see how much there was.
I have used Saison yeast a few times over the years, Belle Saison being one of them. I read somewhere this has diastatic yeast in it. I have not used Brett for close to 15 years.
I use 3 piece ball valves and always dissemble after every brew day. The only thing I don't take all the way apart every time are my quick disconnects and some other stainless fittings.

As for sanitizers...I have used One Step, StarSan, and Iodaphor.

I did replace my bottle bucket a year or so ago, and I have replaced my tubing and siphon...but not at the same time.

Assuming it is ok through the boil, then I would need to replace my all my fermenters (or ferment in glass), siphon, tubing, plastic spoons, bottling bucket, wand...anything else????
A long soak in mild bleach solution can salvage your gear, just make sure you scrub all crevices, etc to remove any potential bio film. If your bottles have a lot of miles on them they are the more likely culprit. To remove the mineral buildup in old bottles I soak for an hour in strong bleach solution followed by a long soak in hot PBW followed by a hot rinse with a bottle blaster. I'm a starsan guy but I would think a prolonged soak in iodophor would be a more thorough disinfection on bottling day.
 
Last night i disassembled everything and soaked it in PBW and hot water overnight. Tomorrow I am going to get some type of acid wash from a local brewery and soak everything in that.

When I clean bottles, I soak them overnight in oxyclean and hot water, then rinse and air dry. On bottling day, i hit them all with starstan, then bottle. I used to also soak bottles in ammonia and hot water, but oxyclean does a better job of getting the gunk off.
 
out of curiosity, is this all grain or extract? moldy malt will cause gushers, and their very bad for your health.....
 
I always rinse my bottles after pouring and use a cleaner and sanitize before using again. For some reason the last batch I bottled I took a bottle brush, cut off the handle and connected it to a drill. I put some cleaner in the bottle, ran the drill for 5-10 seconds then drained. As I progressed I was amazed at how dirty the cleaning solution was getting. They "looked" clean before I did that, but apparently were not.
 
Yes. I agree but from where and how can I get rid of it? Where is it hiding? I’ve been having this issue for years. I just ordered all new plastic. Hopefully that will take care of it
 
I had issues with that way back. replaced all tubing and just got better at sanitizing. not just cleaning but sanitizing everything. Buckets, carboys, fermentors, kegs, whatever was filled with water to the rim and bleach added. I let that sit a couple days and really clean out the hidden gunk. Threw everything else in the vessels to clean them too. I use iodophor for all sanitizing. pbw for cleaning
 
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