German IPA

[marcownz747]

Hey guys!

I was wondering if anybody has any experience with making an IPA using solely noble hops.

The noble hops are by far my favorite hop varieties, and while I don't much care for the IPA category, I'd love to try to make a noble hop bomb.

Does anybody have any experience making such a beer? Is there a reason we tend not to see this done? Or is it just because 1) American hops are more accessible/popular and 2) English hops are more traditional?

Any thoughts would be awesome. I'd love to try my hand at a saaz/spalt dominant IPA.

 

[Bosh]

Apparently saaz gives a lot of grassy flavors if you dry hop with it, I'm not sure about other ones but I'd be a bit nervous about using large amount of low-AA hops.

On the other hand I love European hop flavors and would be right behind you in making something along these lines but I'd like to hear from some more experienced people about how best to get the flavor into the beer without it being a grass bomb.

 

[BrewMeister49]

Why not make a hoppy pilsner? I think that would turn out a bit better. Although, a noble IPA would be a great beer if done right!

 

[hottpeper13]

I made a kolsch with 10 min and flameout additions whirlpooled for 20 min@ ~180* using hallertau and select and it was so flowery tasting and took 3 mo to get barley drinkable.

 

[moreb33rplz]

I did an IPA recipe using mostly Saaz. It was..... meh.

But then I'm not a very good brewer so.

 

[didinho]

I'd love to try my hand at a saaz/spalt dominant IPA.

reach IPA level of IBU is quite tough with european noble hops, but you can achieve it with spalt or aramis hop in bittering, and saaz in late boiling, and some more in dryhopping.

years ago I did a good clone of XXX bitter with 6 grams per liter of saaz in late boiling. with this amount, floral and herbal is very strong and it's not grassy.

I also made an APA sinle hop with Styrian golding. more or less the same quantities in late boiling (20 to 0 minutes boiling) and that was awesome!

 

[m00ps]

It's not worth it. Trust me. Noble hops just aren't suited for ipas. They aren't assertive enough. I tried to make a noble ipa a long time ago. It had over 16oz of hops in a 5gal batch. Not very good at all and the hop flavors were still muddled

 

[dlutter]

There's a brewery in St. Louis called Urban Chestnut that brews what they call a Bavarian IPA, named Hopfen.

http://urbanchestnut.com/our-beers/hopfen-2/

I tried it this summer when I was on a beercation in the area. I didn't make any tasting notes but recall that it wasn't bad. FWIW, I'm an in your face IPA fan, though.

In case anyone is interested, the craft beer scene in St. Louis is pretty cool and something I haven't heard too much noise about.

 

[GHBWNY]

It's not worth it. Trust me. Noble hops just aren't suited for ipas. They aren't assertive enough. I tried to make a noble ipa a long time ago. It had over 16oz of hops in a 5gal batch. Not very good at all and the hop flavors were still muddled

Agree. Saaz is mainly an aroma hop. To use it start to finish to create an IPA, it will be *something*, but it won't be an IPA. And as someone said, too much of a low-AA hop is possibly going to give you a strange taste. I don't think it's possible with Saaz alone.

 

[Hanglow]

They are great hops, but yeah they will not be as in your face as new world hops. You can make really tasty golden ales/pale ales/strong pale ales with just high quantities of saaz. There's good reason it's been one of the most well thought of hops for so long

 

[ALExanderH]

Here in Iceland, Borg Brugghus(brewery) made a beer called BríóBríó which is a imperial pilsner and was dryhopped with Hallertau Mittelfruh. Very good!!
Maybe you can make an ale with pilsner base malt and Mittelfruh late and dryhops?

 

[JonM]

There was a recent Zymurgy article about making hoppy European lagers - Not American IPA level hoppiness, but hoppy for sure. A local brewery did one for our German Fest and it was awesome.

 

[snowveil]

I made a German IPA this summer using Tettnager and Mandarina Bavaria.

Recipe Specifications
--------------------------
Boil Size: 6.52 gal
Post Boil Volume: 5.98 gal
Batch Size (fermenter): 5.00 gal   
Bottling Volume: 4.60 gal
Estimated OG: 1.058 SG
Estimated Color: 5.0 SRM
Estimated IBU: 56.1 IBUs
Brewhouse Efficiency: 68.00 %
Est Mash Efficiency: 78.2 %
Boil Time: 60 Minutes

Ingredients:
------------
Amt                   Name                                     Type          #        %/IBU         
6 lbs                 Pale Malt (2 Row) US (2.0 SRM)           Grain         1        51.3 %        
5 lbs                 PIlsen (Avangard) (2.0 SRM)              Grain         2        42.8 %        
8.0 oz                Amber Malt (22.0 SRM)                    Grain         3        4.3 %         
3.0 oz                Acid Malt (3.0 SRM)                      Grain         4        1.6 %         
1.00 oz               Magnum [12.40 %] - First Wort 60.0 min   Hop           5        44.4 IBUs     
1.00 oz               Mandarina Bavaria [7.20 %] - Boil 15.0 m Hop           6        11.6 IBUs     
2.00 oz               Mandarina Bavaria [7.20 %] - Boil 0.0 mi Hop           7        0.0 IBUs      
1.50 oz               Tettnang (Tettnang Tettnager) [4.80 %] - Hop           8        0.0 IBUs      
1.0 pkg               White Labs California Ale Yeast WLP001         9        -

If you're thinking you'll get the same "punch" that American hops offer, you're looking in the wrong direction. However, I was very happy with this beer.

I'm not sure if Victory distributes up to where you are in NY, but if you can find their Prima Pils, buy some. It's a hop-forward German Pils with a string bitterness. Firestone Walker's Pivo Pils is similar but uses more new school German hop varieites such as Huell Melon.

If I were to re-brew the German IPA I'd probably take the malt bill more towards a classic Pils malt bill but that's a personal preference.

 

[C-Rider]

This is one of my "house" brews. Always comes out GREAT

5 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 1 100.0 %
0.40 oz Magnum [14.20 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 2 51.5 IBUs
0.50 oz Magnum [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min Hop 3 11.5 IBUs
0.50 oz Magnum [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 5.0 min Hop 4 6.3 IBUs
0.50 oz Magnum [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 5 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Munuch (Lallemand #- ) [50.28 ml] Yeast 6 -
1.00 oz Magnum [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 7 0.0 IBUs

Prefer to use K-97 yeast, to lost my suppier.

 

[Bosh]

This is one of my "house" brews. Always comes out GREAT

5 lbs Munich Malt (9.0 SRM) Grain 1 100.0 %
0.40 oz Magnum [14.20 %] - Boil 60.0 min Hop 2 51.5 IBUs
0.50 oz Magnum [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 10.0 min Hop 3 11.5 IBUs
0.50 oz Magnum [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 5.0 min Hop 4 6.3 IBUs
0.50 oz Magnum [14.00 %] - Steep/Whirlpool 0.0 min Hop 5 0.0 IBUs
1.0 pkg Munuch (Lallemand #- ) [50.28 ml] Yeast 6 -
1.00 oz Magnum [14.00 %] - Dry Hop 7.0 Days Hop 7 0.0 IBUs

Prefer to use K-97 yeast, to lost my suppier.

What temp are those whirlpool additions at?

 

[C-Rider]

What temp are those whirlpool additions at?

They are during the boil except for the 0 min which is added when the immersion cooler drops the temp below 180

 

[Brettomomyces]

That's an interesting beer C-Rider, what flavors does magnum impart when used like that?

 

[C-Rider]

That's an interesting beer C-Rider, what flavors does magnum impart when used like that?

A "hoppy" flavor. LOL Sorry but after 72 years my taste buds ain't to selective anymore.

 

[Wayne1]

Stone produced a German Double IPA for their 17th anniversary,

"Gotterdammerung IPA"

Inspired by new experimental German hops, our brewing team is celebrating our 17ten Jahrestag by taking palates on an unconventional tour of Deutschland by way of Southern California. In doing so, we used a grain bill composed exclusively of pilsner malts and German hops with crazy awesome names: Herkules, Hersbrucker, Magnum, Merkur, Opal, Smaragd & Strisselspalt. Dry-hopping with Sterling, a U.S. hop with Saaz parentage, lends a bit of familiarity, but be forewarned: This is a unique beer that takes the IPA—a style we’ve already pushed far beyond its previous limits over the years—to interesting new territory. Schumpeter chose economics; we chose beer. Our creative destruction has been aimed squarely at the previously-held-dear conventions of what beer can and should be. Stone 17th Anniversary Götterdämmerung IPA is the latest in a long line of innovations, but nowhere near the last. Not by a long shot.

 

[cormano]

I agree that the old school Noble Hops won't work well for an IPA, but there a lot of cool new German hops that I've been wanting to play more with. That Stone beer was great, these new varieties can definitely work in an IPA.

 

[m00ps]

yup, there really isnt any such thing as a "german IPA." I tried making an IPA with over 1lb of noble hops once and it still came out with a very muted hop character.

Now, however, there are a lot fo new fruity aromatic German hops coming out that make this a possibility. Mandarina Bavaria, Huell Melon, Hallertau Blanc, Polaris, are all options. Merkur is great for bittering. I would note that this would basically be a "new world" IPA with hops that happen to be all german grown though

 

[Indian_villager]

See if this helps.
http://www.stonebrewing.com/blog/beer/2013/stone-17th-anniversary-götterdämmerung-ipa

 

[jmcquesten]

See if this helps.
http://www.stonebrewing.com/blog/beer/2013/stone-17th-anniversary-götterdämmerung-ipa

Yes, Stone pulled it off very well. Too bad it was just an anniversary release.