First BIAB day...in the garage.

[CajunChuck]

So I drove down to Great Fermentations in Indianapolis, IN and had one of the guys there set me up with a BIAB recipe. He was pretty great about going over all the hops in the fridge, which were delicious, and we chatted about BIAB efficiency, temps and a couple other things. He set me up with a pretty simple first BIAB Easy Wheat All-Grain Kit with the wyeast 3068 Weihenstephan Weizen™. Those yeasts are beasts!

Anyways, brew day went off pretty well. Lifting and squeezing the bag out was a *****! I have no idea how you guys are able to squeeze everything out with one hand holding the bag up with the other. I hit a 1.057 OG and pitched yeast at 68F. The floor is a sticky mess from me dropping the bag one time after trying to squeeze it the first time.

Without further ado....here are some pics!

 

[Johow]

Lookin good, should be beer soon!!!

Since you already have a basket, find a grill rack or something to support the basket on top of the brewkettle then use a bowl or lid or some such that fits inside the basket and push down squeezing the grains.

 

[casualbrewer]

Using the Wilserbrewer bag with the ratchet. Easy peasy.

 

[GearDaddys]

Looking good! I set up a double pulley rope system above my brew kettle.. Retracts when I'm not brewing but it's GREAT for hoisting out a heavy grain bill.. Simply hoist it up over the kettle.. Let it drain for about 20 minutes while bringing up the kettle to boil temps, no need to squeeze.. no mess.. no brainer!

 

[arnobg]

I am not sure I would be running the propane grill in the garage without the garage door open....Looks like an easy way to get poisoned

 

[brew703]

Get you a good bag. I bought one of those cheap bags from the LHBS and it lasted two brews. Wilserbrewer has some great bags and is one I use. Also use the pulley that came with the set.
I've also used the yeast you are using. Make certain you keep the temps within the range specified by the manufacturer. I kept the temps around 67 or so as I brewed before I got my fermentation chamber and I still got some funky flavors. Maybe I just don't care much for wheat type beers.

 

[wilserbrewer]

. Lifting and squeezing the bag out was a *****! I have no idea how you guys are able to squeeze everything out with one hand holding the bag up with the other. The floor is a sticky mess from me dropping the bag one time after trying to squeeze it the first ]

If your burning your hands and spilling wort all over the floor, your doing it all wrong. I BIAB in a finished basement, and spilling one drop is too many.

A proper bag and pulley is the key in my experience, lift or hoist the bag out of the kettle and let it hang and neatly drain right back in the kettle. The only time you need to touch the bag is to dispose of it, which can be done by swinging it right into a waiting large Rubbermaid storage tote placed next to the kettle.

 

[Elkobrewer]

That looks good congrats on your first

 

[RM-MN]

So I drove down to Great Fermentations in Indianapolis, IN and had one of the guys there set me up with a BIAB recipe. He was pretty great about going over all the hops in the fridge, which were delicious, and we chatted about BIAB efficiency, temps and a couple other things. He set me up with a pretty simple first BIAB Easy Wheat All-Grain Kit with the wyeast 3068 Weihenstephan Weizen™. Those yeasts are beasts!

Anyways, brew day went off pretty well. Lifting and squeezing the bag out was a *****! I have no idea how you guys are able to squeeze everything out with one hand holding the bag up with the other. I hit a 1.057 OG and pitched yeast at 68F. The floor is a sticky mess from me dropping the bag one time after trying to squeeze it the first time.

I don't recall any of us mentioning using one hand to hold the bag while squeezing everything out with the other. I certainly don't. I lift the bag with one hand and let it drain for a few seconds, then grab my bowl with the colander already in it and slip that under the bag to catch the wort and set it down somewhere handy. As more wort drains I grab a smaller pot lid to set on top of the bag of grains and use my thumbs to hold that and the grains in place as I lift the bowl and dump the wort into the pot. That lid gives me a handle to push the lid down, squeezing out more wort.

 

[Bobby_M]

I use the ratchet pulley to hold the bag above the pot and I do squeeze the hell out of if with some gloves on.

 

[CajunChuck]

I don't recall any of us mentioning using one hand to hold the bag while squeezing everything out with the other. I certainly don't. I lift the bag with one hand and let it drain for a few seconds, then grab my bowl with the colander already in it and slip that under the bag to catch the wort and set it down somewhere handy. As more wort drains I grab a smaller pot lid to set on top of the bag of grains and use my thumbs to hold that and the grains in place as I lift the bowl and dump the wort into the pot. That lid gives me a handle to push the lid down, squeezing out more wort.

AH...Looks like I need to invest in a large colander as this makes tons of sense! Thanks!

 

[RM-MN]

AH...Looks like I need to invest in a large colander as this makes tons of sense! Thanks!

Some use a grate from a grill that fits over the top of the pot and just lift the bag enough to slip it under and let the bag sit there and drain. I can't do that because I make my batches on the kitchen stove and don't have enough room under the range hood.

If you use the grate, you can easily do a pour-over sparge too.

 

[brewprint]

I didn't see a ladder in that garage but maybe you have one?

As others have stated I too use the wilser bag and pulley and it works great. I just have the ladder above my kettle to lift the bag.

Surely if you can afford that burner you have...you can get the wilser system and a ladder

 

[CajunChuck]

I didn't see a ladder in that garage but maybe you have one?

As others have stated I too use the wilser bag and pulley and it works great. I just have the ladder above my kettle to lift the bag.

Surely if you can afford that burner you have...you can get the wilser system and a ladder

Yes, I have the heavy-duty Gorilla Ladder. You read tons of stuff about improving efficiency and how fine to crush the grains but you overlook the simple stuff as you pointed out. I will have this set up for next go! Thanks again for pointing out the obvious to this noob! =)

 

[brewprint]

Yes, I have the heavy-duty Gorilla Ladder. You read tons of stuff about improving efficiency and how fine to crush the grains but you overlook the simple stuff as you pointed out. I will have this set up for next go! Thanks again for pointing out the obvious to this noob! =)

That's what this site is for I forget where I stumbled upon the ladder idea but it works perfect for me. Now just tell Mr. Wilser what size your kettle is and he'll set you up with an awesome bag. I use his hop bag attached to the pulley as well to keep down on trub.

 

[slym2none]

A proper bag and pulley is the key in my experience, lift or hoist the bag out of the kettle and let it hang and neatly drain right back in the kettle. The only time you need to touch the bag is to dispose of it, which can be done by swinging it right into a waiting large Rubbermaid storage tote placed next to the kettle.

Bold-face #1- In your experience. Others have different experiences.
Bold-face #2 - I know you know what you are talking about, but this is a case of "in your experience". Others do it other ways, and they aren't wrong for doing them that way.

That said, I'll wait for the inevitable wrath to come.

 

[slym2none]

That's what this site is for I forget where I stumbled upon the ladder idea but it works perfect for me. Now just tell Mr. Wilser what size your kettle is and he'll set you up with an awesome bag. I use his hop bag attached to the pulley as well to keep down on trub.

The first time I saw the ladder technique was Alton Brown using it for lowering & lifting a whole turkey in & out of a fryer.

 

[Bobby_M]

Bold-face #1- In your experience. Others have different experiences.
Bold-face #2 - I know you know what you are talking about, but this is a case of "in your experience". Others do it other ways, and they aren't wrong for doing them that way.

That said, I'll wait for the inevitable wrath to come.

Oddly confrontational with little added value.

 

[wilserbrewer]

That said, I'll wait for the inevitable wrath to come.

Sorry if I said something inappropriate, was just trying to help someone who admitted struggling.

Was just an opinion as are most posts....

 

[brewprint]

The first time I saw the ladder technique was Alton Brown using it for lowering & lifting a whole turkey in & out of a fryer.

That sounds like it would work well for a turkey. I haven't ever thought about that. I smoke turkeys though

 

[pricelessbrewing]

Others do it other ways, and they aren't wrong for doing them that way.

That said, I'll wait for the inevitable wrath to come.

I agree with this, but disagree that it should've been directed at wilser. OP was talking about having a difficult time, read: asking for how to make it easier, and he offered his opinion based on a lot of biab brews.

A simple pulley setup with draining instead of squeezing is very functional and low effort. If you don't sparge, it's a great way to go, if you do sparge, it might be a little too slow to drain in before you can sparge and drain again, at least in my experience. I wait till the drainage slows significantly, then squeeze using two baking sheets (or a pot and a colander depending on how I'm feeling that day, and what's clean and available) then proceed to my sparge.

 

[dad23ds]

I use a ladder and a rubber tarp strap to hold the bag. Still have to lift so maybe a ratchet/pulley is in my future.
View attachment 334525

 

[slym2none]

I really have to just keep my mouth shut...

 

[JohnnyBrewGood]

I brew directly under my garage door opener. From the mental bracketing the motor hangs from, I attached a metal ring. I run a strap (its a long dog leash) thru that ring. The loop part of the leash hangs straight down, the rest I run thru the handle of my propane tank. I secure the strap with a simple bulldog clip. I fold it over running back upwards and pinch the strap with the clip.

After mash I simply gather the top of the bag and run it thru the loop, fold it over and clamp it with a pinching clamp. With one hand I lift the bag and the other hand I pull the other side of the strap down, not all the way up but until it gets heavy, pause and let it drain. At this point I start the burner and repeat the lift/pull down until bag is above the wort. I do a pour sparge the get the kettle to boil volume and then squeeze bag but not a lot. Usually about a gallon pour, a, this gets me to volume and b, make squeezing not so important.

To remove bag I put a 5 gallon bucket under my arm and give the bag a little "swing" catching it in the bucket. Undo clamp and that's it.

 

[william_shakes_beer]

Everybody has their preferred method, here's mine. https://www.homebrewtalk.com/showthread.php?t=492158 I tried the pulley in a stepladder, and finally determined that for ME the perforated bucket was the simplest. See post 4 for a picture. There's always a spare fermenter floating around. Perforated bucket moves back and forth between 2 fermenters as I pour wort from the fermenter to the kettle, and the weight of the grain presses itself. No burned hands need apply. I can't claim there are "no drips" on the ground, which is why now brew outside.

 

[CajunChuck]

The pictures with the door closed were because the actual sun was sitting next to my truck and I couldn't get a decent picture without my camera lens melting from the glare.

So I closed the door and snapped the shots. I am sure you can see in a few other pics the white blinding light on the ground. Thanks for the safety input. Always safety first boys and girls!!

 

[CajunChuck]

Final OG 1.010 this morning. OMG this beer smells and tastes ****ing weird and not in a good way. I've never experienced any beer that's supposed to taste like it. It is barely palatable. I decided to keg some to my 3 gallon and bottle 12 bombers and see what happens. Followed the directions but stirred once every 10 minutes while in the kettle. I am thinking this is the tannins taste that people are talking about but not sure. My last couple batches kind of hand a slight an off taste to them. Should my fermentation temps be above 62-64 degrees? My cleaning technique is pretty tight. Use star sans to sanitize also. Suggestions?

 

[RM-MN]

Final OG 1.010 this morning. OMG this beer smells and tastes ****ing weird and not in a good way. I've never experienced any beer that's supposed to taste like it. It is barely palatable. I decided to keg some to my 3 gallon and bottle 12 bombers and see what happens. Followed the directions but stirred once every 10 minutes while in the kettle. I am thinking this is the tannins taste that people are talking about but not sure. My last couple batches kind of hand a slight an off taste to them. Should my fermentation temps be above 62-64 degrees? My cleaning technique is pretty tight. Use star sans to sanitize also. Suggestions?

Make yourself a cup of black tea. Take out the tea bag after about 5 minutes and stir in a teaspoon of sugar. Grab the tea bag, stick it in your mouth and suck on it. That is what tannins taste like.

For most ale yeast, the first few days of fermentation should be cool. I prefer about 62 to 64 but anything in the low to mid 60's is fine as that will keep the yeast activity low enough that they don't produce the off flavors. Once the ferment slows you can let the beer come to room temp.

Some yeasts will make beer that does taste bad....for a while. I haven't used that yeast but if I had a beer that tasted bad at bottling time, I'd let it sit at room temp for at least 3 weeks, perhaps longer, to let it get good. I did that with a saison that at first tasted like a beer I should dump out but a month later it was very good. Patience is a good idea when making beer.

 

[JohnnyBrewGood]

I taste all my beers along the way. Every hydro test tube get a taste. I often think, oh boy this one sucks, but after conditioning in the bottle (normal times) they have all tasted fine. Some I like better than others, but that's the way it should be I think. As stated above time is your friend. I once dumped 5 gallon that I though was infected, looking back I should have let it sit a while. I will never know what time would have done for that beer.

 

[CajunChuck]

So it's sitting in a 3 gallon keg under pressure and bottled. Should I pull it out, relieve pressure and let it sit at room temp for a couple weeks? Or better yet, what is my best Avenue for the keg at this point? It's been under pressure for 16 hours now

 

[wilserbrewer]

It doesn't really matter...

Let it carb up and taste it. Let it cold condition and taste it. Taste one of the bottles in a week or two. Taste it once a week for 8 weeks, if you still hate it toss it or let is sit for a few months.
Rdwhahb

 

[BrunDog]

Let it age a bit. Wheat beers can be funky at first as those yeasts do not flocculate out quickly. Give it two weeks under pressure at cold temp, then give it a proper taste.

 

[The_Bishop]

In the one pic you showed, the burner was on while mashing. Were you stirring while you were adding heat? If not it's very possible that the bottom of the mash became hot enough to extract tannins, especially if your mash PH was a bit too high.

 

[CajunChuck]

I was keeping at 153 while stirring every 10 minutes and then cut the heat off once it hit again. I had a basket in so it was never sitting on the bottom.

 

[The_Bishop]

The issue isn't the grain on the bottom of the kettle, the problem is adding heat without stirring, you end up with very stratified temps. The top of the kettle, where you had the thermometer may have been 153, but the temperature of the wort under that basket may well have been 180+ along with the bottom of your mash. You need to stir continuously while adding heat.

The other issue is the basket adds a barrier to your stirring, so there's no easy way to incorporate the heat trapped in the wort at the bottom of the kettle. You don't really need the basket, honestly. If you stir continuously while adding heat gently, there's no need for it and the bag will not scorch. Also, if you put the lid back on the kettle it'll hold temps much better.

 

[CajunChuck]

The issue isn't the grain on the bottom of the kettle, the problem is adding heat without stirring, you end up with very stratified temps. The top of the kettle, where you had the thermometer may have been 153, but the temperature of the wort under that basket may well have been 180+ along with the bottom of your mash. You need to stir continuously while adding heat.

The other issue is the basket adds a barrier to your stirring, so there's no easy way to incorporate the heat trapped in the wort at the bottom of the kettle. You don't really need the basket, honestly. If you stir continuously while adding heat gently, there's no need for it and the bag will not scorch. Also, if you put the lid back on the kettle it'll hold temps much better.

Yes, I stirred the entire time I had heat on from bottom upwards. It was a first time BIAB and "all grain" at that so figured I would not lose any sleep if I botched it up. It was only $20 for the grain in total. I thought if I had the basket in there it would make it easier for me to lift the grain out and drain. This was not the case. The latter/pulley system discussed earlier in this thread is the ticket.

My next attempt at all grain will be using my 10Ga Igloo cooler system I have set up. I am currently in the process of reviewing tons of stuff posted on here, specifically Yooper's Oatmeal Stout as I am a huge fan of stouts and brown ales.

 

[RM-MN]

Yes, I stirred the entire time I had heat on from bottom upwards. It was a first time BIAB and "all grain" at that so figured I would not lose any sleep if I botched it up. It was only $20 for the grain in total. I thought if I had the basket in there it would make it easier for me to lift the grain out and drain. This was not the case. The latter/pulley system discussed earlier in this thread is the ticket.

My next attempt at all grain will be using my 10Ga Igloo cooler system I have set up. I am currently in the process of reviewing tons of stuff posted on here, specifically Yooper's Oatmeal Stout as I am a huge fan of stouts and brown ales.

Before you go to the Igloo cooler system, try one more with the bag of grains in the pot but this time don't use the basket and don't add any heat. Bring the water to strike temp, stir in the grains really well to get rid of any temperature stratification, put the lid on and igonore it for the mash period. If you have iodine you can test for any starch remaining and decide from that if you need a longer mash but I only mash for 30 minutes. At that time I can no longer detect any starch remaining in the grist so I know that conversion is complete and can pull the grains out and start heating the wort.

 

[The_Bishop]

RM-MN, you're a pretty sharp guy, but do everyone a favor and stop telling every new brewer that they should do an abbreviated mash. You may have good results from it being as you mill your own grain into a near flour state, but most new brewers are using pre-milled grain that isn't that finely ground.

On your whole iodine test being negative at 30 minutes... You know you can get a false negative on that test, right? If you're using conventionally milled grain, you can have a negative result at 30 minutes, too. But stir your grain bed and check again... You'll show starch. That's because it takes time for the saccharified sugars to slough off and expose new starch if you're not stirring or recirculating the mash. Most BIAB brewers aren't. A longer mash gives the time needed for that to happen. Also, most new BIAB brewers aren't working with their water chemistry and mash PH. That can lead to a further slowdown of conversion which again, will cause issues with a short mash.

I know you mean well and all, but it seems that every other post from you is, "HEY GUYS! YOU ONLY NEED TO MASH FOR LIKE 45 SECONDS!"

 

[RM-MN]

RM-MN, you're a pretty sharp guy, but do everyone a favor and stop telling every new brewer that they should do an abbreviated mash. You may have good results from it being as you mill your own grain into a near flour state, but most new brewers are using pre-milled grain that isn't that finely ground.

On your whole iodine test being negative at 30 minutes... You know you can get a false negative on that test, right? If you're using conventionally milled grain, you can have a negative result at 30 minutes, too. But stir your grain bed and check again... You'll show starch. That's because it takes time for the saccharified sugars to slough off and expose new starch if you're not stirring or recirculating the mash. Most BIAB brewers aren't. A longer mash gives the time needed for that to happen. Also, most new BIAB brewers aren't working with their water chemistry and mash PH. That can lead to a further slowdown of conversion which again, will cause issues with a short mash.

I know you mean well and all, but it seems that every other post from you is, "HEY GUYS! YOU ONLY NEED TO MASH FOR LIKE 45 SECONDS!"

How about you go tell the LHBS to mill their grain properly. Lots of the people using conventional mash tuns are getting poor efficiency due to poor milling. People should not have to put up with that. Most of the time I tell people to use the iodine test I tell them to test the grist, not just the wort. The wort should always test negative at 30 minutes. If not, go back to point one, the grains are not properly milled. Or maybe I should just tell everyone that they need to do a 90 to 120 minute mash just to make sure that the ones with poorly milled grains get as much conversion as possible.

 

[The_Bishop]

How about you go tell the LHBS to mill their grain properly. Lots of the people using conventional mash tuns are getting poor efficiency due to poor milling. People should not have to put up with that. Most of the time I tell people to use the iodine test I tell them to test the grist, not just the wort. The wort should always test negative at 30 minutes. If not, go back to point one, the grains are not properly milled. Or maybe I should just tell everyone that they need to do a 90 to 120 minute mash just to make sure that the ones with poorly milled grains get as much conversion as possible.

How about you define 'properly'? In your setup, for your process, ultra-fine milling works. FOR YOU and YOUR SETUP. BIAB, right?

However, the same grind in a conventional mash/lauter tun at comventional mash thicknesses would result in a horribly stuck mash with the consistency of porridge. A crush with the consistency of grits, however, works in both setups. You just can't mash for 3.8 minutes and call it a day.

I work part-time in a LHBS. It gets busy. You know what we can't do? Adjust the mill for every different customer. It takes too long and causes more wear and tear on the mill. Also, if you leave the gap too small and start milling, you just ruined somebody's grain bill and the shop eats the cost of the grains and/or maybe loses a customer because we screwed their bre day up with a stuck mash. The mill gets set for a middle-of-the-road setting, that works decently across the board for all our customers.

That's reality.

There's another reason to mash longer, and that's flavor extraction from the specialty grains. Too short of a time results in lesser extraction and flavor from specialty grains. This is something we've directly experimented with and experienced at the shop.

Maybe it's not your place to tell *anyone* how they should mash? I'm not a big one for 'dogma' and advocating things just because 'that's the way we've always done it' but there are good reasons for some brewing practices, and what makes you happy with your beer may not work for everyone else.