Fast sparging with herms systems ??

[Wheelspin]

I've got a HERMS system and, as you know, it recirculates the wort through the mash during the entire duration of the mash ± 90 mins.

When I'm sparging, do I have to go slow (40 to 60 mins) or (seeing it's been circulating all the time) crank it up and dump it into my boiler quickly ?

I would be interested to hear your thoughts.

 

[Falcon3]

You're talking about fly sparging vs batch sparging. There's lots of info here if you look up those terms. I batch sparge with my herms. I drain my initial mash after ramping it to 170. By then my sparge water is also at 170, so I just dump it in the tun, stir like crazy to suspend the sugars, then recirc with the pump for 5 mins and drain. I get 80+% efficiency this way.

 

[Bobby_M]

I think of a HERMS system as tailored to fly sparging but you can do it either way.

 

[Wheelspin]

Yes I am fly sparging. But my question is do I have to sparge slowly, i.e. 50 - 60 mins.

Or, because it's a HERMS and has been circulating for 60 mins already, can I just open it up and get it done ASAP ?

 

[Falcon3]

Nope if you open it up fast without manually stirring, the grainbed will channel and you'll just be running out water. Going slowly gives time for the sugars to diffuse into the water.

 

[Gameface]

Yes I am fly sparging. But my question is do I have to sparge slowly, i.e. 50 - 60 mins.

Or, because it's a HERMS and has been circulating for 60 mins already, can I just open it up and get it done ASAP ?

My concern would be channelling or a stuck sparge. I don't think you'd ever want to just let it rip full open, but I think you can go pretty fast (maybe a little below 40min) with minimal effect on your efficiency.

 

[Wheelspin]

Great, thanks guys. Makes sense.

 

[Jaybird]

the sparging process is the process of rinsing the grain. Not just draining the MLT of the wort. So IF you are fly sparging then you will need to do it nice and slow. I fly sparge myself and I shoot for 60 min. The great thing about that is you can be heating your BK up at the mid way point of that process so by the time you get the sparge done you can be very close the the boiling point so you are not waiting for that.

Cheers
Jay

 

[cjgenever]

Fast fly sparging may cause channeling (as mentioned). It also may cause the sugars to mix with the sparge water. Fly sparging takes advantage of the difference in densities of the wort and water. The more the two mix (fast sparge) the lower your efficiency. A slow sparge allows the less dense water to rest on top of the sugar saturated wort with minimal mixing.

 

[Yooper]

Yes I am fly sparging. But my question is do I have to sparge slowly, i.e. 50 - 60 mins.

Or, because it's a HERMS and has been circulating for 60 mins already, can I just open it up and get it done ASAP ?

As others mentioned, you don't recirculate during the sparge.

The idea of the sparge is to rinse the sugars out of the grain. This happens by the process of diffusion. Water is slowly added to replace the wort that is being drained out, and because of the principle of diffusion where sugars will move to a lower concentration from a higher concentration. If the wort was being recirculated, diffusion would not be able to occur.

So, when you fly sparge, you stop recirculating after you vorlauf, and the wort is slowly drained out as water is gently replacing it. At least an inch of liquid over the grainbed is required to prevent channelling.

You only need to go as slow as you need to, if that makes sense. It doesn't matter if it takes 30 minutes or 3 hours, if the boil volume is met and the OG is met. It takes me about 45 minutes.

 

[Wheelspin]

Thank you all, have a much better understanding of the sparge process now.