jeffreybandel
Well-Known Member
For that have asked, I have received no word from brewha.
I'm at the point to have proof that these claims are correct. Both sides. Any way to get a micrometer on the walls to determine how thick they are? Just doesn't seem that 16 gauge would be that easy to bang back into shape. Maybe 16mil but not 16g.
Anyway there is a lot of he said she said, but the she said is from a loyal customer and not the company. So on that fact, I'm swinging towards the OP for now.
FYI 16 gauge is .059" or about 1.5mm 16 mil would be over ten times that thick.
?? By my calculations 16 mil would equal 0.4064mm. How is that 10x thicker than 1.5mm? Are you confusing mil with mm? A mil is .001". Also, SS 16ga is usually a nominal .065" thick.
... I don't know of any homebrew equipment that uses thicker material (though it may be out there) and I am aware of many companies that use 0.8mm and 1.2mm..
I am going to revise my opinion a bit. I did not read the entire thread. If the vendor offered to replace the damaged unit for $1000 (roughtly 20% of the total system) that is not as outrageous as reflected in my first reaction.
On the other hand, producing a unit that can be damaged by using it as directed, but will fail or be get damaged by a small but predictable error, is a poor design. They know people are going to hook it up to muni water that has a pressure that exceeds the safe opertion level of their product.
They should count on some customers going to make mistakes. Forgett to open a valve or something plugs up a hole. Stuff happems during a brew day. If they can avoid problems with a simple pressure selease valve, it is (IMO) irresponsible to leave it out of the design.
For me, it is like Ford making a car out of paper mache' and saying it is a perfectly safe car, it is your fault because you ran into a tree. If you did not hit the tree, everythign would be fine.
Just my 2 cents.
for record I believe that Brewers Hardware uses 3mm stainless on their inner jacket walls(15 gallon) . But their non jacketed are 1.5mm
According to Brewer's Hardware website their 15 gal conical uses 1.5 mm thick walls.
https://www.brewershardware.com/15-Gallon-Stainless-Steel-Conical-Fermentor.html
According to Brewer's Hardware website their 15 gal conical uses 1.5 mm thick walls.
https://www.brewershardware.com/15-Gallon-Stainless-Steel-Conical-Fermentor.html
Well according to the manufacturer this was not a suspected vacuum. It was a clogged jacket or clogged jacket port which caused the pressure in the jacket to increase beyond the allowed amount. I don't think everyone here agrees that was the cause, but that's what the manufacturers response was.
I unfortunately agree either way(vacuum or over pressurizing the jacket) it was user error. Even if it was a clogged jacket line I wouldn't apply a pressure (city water line) that the system is not rated for. Even BH only rates the jacket for 29psi. City water pressure can damage that one too.
Nathan, is the jacket a coiled line around or is it more an open area between the inner and outer wall?
I'll be honest, I haven't even thought of jacket pressure as a problem until i read this post. I swapped out my plans for a small garden pump that physically cannot generate enough pressure to damage mine.
When I had the unit "hammered" out, we cleaned the jacket out. We found handfuls of the black junk which I sent pictures of to Nathan at Brewha. It would seem obvious that the jacket clogged during cooling (although a vacuum is possible as well). You can call that user error if you want. I don't. Brewha has a tutorial video on their website site (which I watched to learn how to use the unit) and the owner of the company shows and tells you to hook it up to your kitchen faucet and start cooling. I guess that means we both are user errors?
The debris was found AFTER the unit was hammered back out? That debris could have been caused by the hammering out process.
I can vouch for the OP regarding black stuff inside the jacket. Mine also had some of the black stuff and it was clearly visible in the top port of the jacket. I connected my water hose and ran it full force as directed by Nathan and it flushed it out. Lucky? Maybe. I hope the OP is able to use his system now and make good beer. I honestly don't run mine with any kind of pressure regulator and have had no problems. However, I am extremely careful when it comes to vacuums.
The three photos below show the stuff I spotted in the port and what I collected in a paint strainer. BTW, the piece of wire is what I used to clean the area around the inside of the port.
If you had been following the whole post you would know that debris was found before hammering. In fact, the first picture and email I sent Nathan showed the black stuff and he said it was due to excess water pressure.
Your last post was worded strangely and it sounded like the black stuff was found after the hammering. I have been following this thread. You placed a cap over the opening before dropping temps... You pulled a vacuum which would cause the lid to seal down.
I've worked with vacuum systems before in the semiconductor manufacturing industry. You don't need connections to be tight in order for them to seal once you start pulling a vacuum.
I've also seen large SS containers collapse where I work now, in a food production and packaging plant. They get large 2000# SS totes of pureed fruit that they typically store cold. Well, an operator pulled one of the totes and incorrectly steamed the fittings. They use steam to sanitize all the fittings and lines, but this guy accidentally opened the tote while it was steaming. Since that's not consistent with our quality practices they didn't use the tote, so the operator put it back in cold storage... Collapsed tote with very thick stainless steal walls.
Is it sandy? I wonder if they use a "green sand" to form the jacket? If not is it welding residue? Slag?
Gotta wonder if they back purged the weld? And if not, do they repasivate it?
If there was that much, then I don't care how you put engineering controls on it, it's going to fail no matter what, if blockage is an issue.
It’s not fit for merchantability. It’s reasonable to assume that a consumer is going to hook their hose up to the unit. If the unit is going to fail because either the inlet pressure is too high or the outlet pressure is constricted and a simple blow off pressure regulator would prevent this from happening then the manufacturer has failed.
kh54s10.... your reply popped this up in my view and i read this entire thread. (Had time to kill for sure).I wonder what changes have been made in the 3 years since the last reply?
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