Ever have a credit card number stolen???

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Hammy71 said:
Wow, I thought this thread died a long time ago. CC info is stolen everyday. From your bank, stores, hell even the gas station. Debit cards are a part of our lives just like cel phones. There is no realistic way to avoid using them anymore IMHO. Has stated in one of the earlier post....My card info got out and I haven't bought anything from AHS in months. It was tracked back to a college in another state that my wife is taking on line classes from. Not one of those technical schools you see advertised on line...but a friggin state university. Last time my cc info was stolen was about 2 years ago from Paypal. So, all saying go with Paypal because it's safer, I laugh in your general direction. I know it sucks when someone steals your money, chit....some a-holes broke into my house last year and stole alot more from me than mere tangible things. Your best defense is to check your account weekly on line for fraudulent charges and make sure you have a bank that will reimburse you for fraudulent charges. Both times that my card numbers were used without my permission, the money was back in my account within the week. Once again, it sucks. But weeks of bitching and making accusations aren't helping you get your money or a business keeps it's reputation.
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I didn't have my information stolen because I didn't buy anything from AHS recently, however, I think it is lame for you to come on and tell people who have to "get over it".

You have no idea how a this may have affected their lives and even if it is no big deal to you it may be a huge deal to someone else.

If you don't like this thread then lump it and read something else but don't tell other people how to react to having been robbed using a site they trusted.
 
sudsmcgee said:
Nope, didn't happen to me because I used a cc before the dates affected. Just saying that it happened to others and its not a minor thing.
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Actually, I was responding to a post where you said it happened to you... At least that's the way you implied it..
 
Beerrific said:
Email the CEO, email COO, email the CFO, email the VP, email the public relations person, email any (AND EVERY) corporate type you that you can find the email. Someone will respond.

Don't threaten the or any thing but calmly tell them that if it is not resolved you are going to tell all the government regulatory agencies and go to the TV stations. Use the anti-big bank sentiment out there to your advantage. I have done this once with a big bank and it worked well. Sometimes they need a wake-up call.
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'NO ONE' of importance will ever see it.. Going through the mortgage mess that is epidemic in this country over the last couple years, and watching others try just what you suggest, has taught me that people who do this stuff either get ignored, or things get worse for their effort..

Bvetter to just ditch the big banks altogether and go with a solid community bank.. With them your communication 'will' get heard..
 
jkarp said:
no. No they won't. Do you have any idea how much hate mail they get daily and where it goes? Hint: Trashbin. These are the same a-hats that are foreclosing on active duty servicemen!

You really want to hurt these big banks? Don't give them your business. There's plenty of local credit unions who can give the same services with better customer service.
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+1000
 
Beerrific said:
I have done it and got a phone call from a person in consumer relations within the day. Similar big asshat bank. I sent it to about 12 emails, about half bounced back, but I guess one made it through to someone.
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Consumer relations is a fancy sounding title for a person that was hired to take abuse from the customer, and insulate those with authority from ever having to deal with it...
 
At the very least, this thread serves some important services

therapy for those who are angry about the situation, where they can vent and have sympathetic ears hear their story..

lets the vendor affected know with certainty that there 'really is' a problem involving them..

alerts others to check their cards to see if they have also been affected..

allows the community a venue to discuss and suggest and learn ways to protect themselves here going forward

Educates how the system works and this sort of thing happens..

Allows the vendor a venue to communicate directly with those affected as a group so that he does not have to continually deal with people one on one, instead spending that time getting to the bottom of things... which is in addition to the daily duties of running a business (that still demands attention)

lets everyone involved compare notes, so that as a group we can weed out falsehoods and uncover truth..

And finally, it bothers some people who like to be bothered by such threads..:D

Naw, this thread is far from being done with it's needed purpose.. No dying yet..
:mug:
 
In the end, that's a decision everyone has to make for themselves.. and no one else can tell them how to make it or judge them for what they choose to do...

I'll buy from them again 'at some point'.. once I feel that I've sufficiently protected myself.. I'm feeling that I need to adopt this attitude internet wide though as a result of this.. not just towards AHS...
 
Airborneguy said:
Gotcha. I still don't see the FBI getting involved, but he should notify Austin PD if Texas has laws that cover his end of this type of situation.
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I could only imagine the feds getting involved if the locals trip across something that is a much larger situation. You never know what you will find until someone starts looking though.

The ironic thing is some British kid stole my credit card info last year when I was booking trip to Whistler and this year just before heading there again I'm again out my card...argh. At least I have a backup.
 
Airborneguy said:
I don't see the FBI investigating this. Local law enforcement handles credit card frauds. This is at worst a few hundred transactions. The FBI wouldn't step in at that level.
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The FBI does in fact investigate wire fraud cases, especially ones involving interstate commerce.
 
kingmatt said:
I didn't have my information stolen because I didn't buy anything from AHS recently, however, I think it is lame for you to come on and tell people who have to "get over it".

You have no idea how a this may have affected their lives and even if it is no big deal to you it may be a huge deal to someone else.

If you don't like this thread then lump it and read something else but don't tell other people how to react to having been robbed using a site they trusted.
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My point was I too have been a victim of crime in the past and yep, life goes on. The world doesn't stop for me. I repeat...it sucks. But some parts of life suck. If stating the obvious makes me lame, so be it. I feel for all those effected. I've been there. Even though it was a year ago, if I catch the MFer's that broke into my house and stole from my family....I'll kill them. But, I realize that the police can't/won't do chit. I realize that I can't do chit to get my stuff back. I share the OP's and other's anger. I just try to make sure mine is directed at the right people and not at some random poster on the iterweb.
 
TxBrew said:
I know this is hard topic to talk about without getting angry, missing money is not an easy thing to be OK with.

I'm asking that everyone refrain from personal attacks, bypassing the censor, and generally being disrespectful.

I appreciate you all, and do not want comments left in off topic to cause issues.
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...
 
personally i not sure it was on forrests system just seems that way since he is a hbs and we are all brewers here. as i said earlier i haven't bought anything from him in almost 2 yrs but i have used a paypal account recently to purchase some other hobby items. methinks it might be a cc authorizing agent that was comprimised because of this. that and the fact that my fraudulent purchases were both from chinese retailers.
 
weirdboy said:
Get a credit card. That costs NOTHING. If a credit card is "not an option" then use paypal or cash.
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I have heard at least two posters in this thread say they have been ripped off using paypal.. so it's obviously not as safe as I assumed..

BTW.. how do you shove cash into the computer/internet?:D

I betcha that after a few decades of life, I have a much better view of my own situation and what works best than 'you' do... eh?:p

OTOH, I'm not gonna argue with you about how you've chosen to deal with this situation, as that is 'your' choice, and only you can make it, based on 'your' situation..:mug:
 
r8rphan said:
Consumer relations is a fancy sounding title for a person that was hired to take abuse from the customer, and insulate those with authority from ever having to deal with it...
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...shrug....whoever they were, whatever title, they took care of my problem that no one i talked to through the 800 number said was possible. And I know no one of importance saw it, I was not expecting them to.
 
I got a call this morning from my bank, two overseas fraud charges posted on my card...great. Never been hit with one of these in 6 yrs of having this card :/ so i've been tracking my last purchases. I just purchased from AHS 1/31 so add me to the list. The bank's fixing it, new card, claim filed...just sucks.
 
There is one piece of this thread that sticks with me.

It has been said multiple times that credit card transactions fro AHS are manually processed. This means that the complete credit card information gets sent someplace to be entered into a credit card terminal by hand. this is not possible without that information being processed through a computer someplace at AHS, whether it is to print the transaction, or the information is read off of the screen and entered that way, it is on a computer within their business. As a computer system engineer I would really like to know what they are doing to ensure that the information is destroyed after the transaction is entered. Simply pressing delete does not erase the file, regardless of the computer system you are using the information is still there and easily recovered.

What I would also like to know that has been asked already and not answered is who is actually entering those transactions. AHS has been on this thread several times stating that the breech is not within their business, in light of the above facts I am not too inclined to believe that they are 100% sure of that.

As far as law enforcement goes, I am willing to bet that the Austin PD would be happy to arrest a citizen of Austin who had been stealing credit card information from their employer.

Until AHS comes clean with how they process the transactions, and what they are doing to safeguard that data I am not comfortable doing business with them. There is simply too much anecdotal evidence here indicating a problem.
 
From what I understand from talking to my FIL who's a deputy Chief of Police he said that most fraud detectives will pretty much not take the time of day for something even going up into the tens of thousands of dollars and more, they have hundred thousand to multimillion dollar fraud cases that would take priority. These little charges are small change, the FBI and local law probably won't touch it.

Card replacement was free for me, the same day I went to the local branch and got a temp debit card, and I'll be getting my $2.90 charge credited back to me.

Just curious what the "final verdict" is going to be since it seems the jury is still out of how the CC#s are handled. With all the overseas charges I'm inclined to think it wasn't an inside job. If it were an inside job why would they rip off so many at once and draw attention to themselves? Just one or two and nobody would be able to trace it back to AHS.
 
It's because of how this fraud is done.. It's a huge black market industry.. And it's handled the same way as stolen merchandise or drugs..

One person gets hold of a list of CC/personal info.. and he sells it to someone he knows that buys such information.. They go on the internet and sell it there.. usually breaking the original bulk sale into smaller groups....

So say someone gets a list of personal info from AHS for 750 clients, they sell that for x amount of dollars to some shady dude they know, who then sells the info in lots of 50 or 100 to someone else on the internet skimming a profit in the transaction, who then starts 'testing' the numbers to see which are ripe for fraud, and then sells these numbers at a profit in lots of 3 or 5 or 10...

Just like drug dealers...

The govt is so interested in regulating every aspect of our lives, how about they regulate 'that?

I'd like to see a law that allows the complete history of every exchange of information on a transaction to be completely documented and available upon request' to the consumer who owns the card....

At least then in cases like this, we could all get together, compare notes and easily see exactly where the breach was for ourselves...
 
Yes, this is the sticking point that they won't seem to publically address. They store our/your CC numbers in a PC for up to 1.5 weeks before processing and destroying, per an email I have from AHS. There has been NO public comment about this even though I have asked that it be addressed several times. It would also seem to me that a store PC would be pretty easy to hack, esp if employees are using it to peruse the internet and picked up a bug somewhere. My anger and frustration have nothing to do with the money, it's mainly the above.

Navy_Chief said:
There is one piece of this thread that sticks with me.

It has been said multiple times that credit card transactions fro AHS are manually processed. This means that the complete credit card information gets sent someplace to be entered into a credit card terminal by hand. this is not possible without that information being processed through a computer someplace at AHS, whether it is to print the transaction, or the information is read off of the screen and entered that way, it is on a computer within their business. As a computer system engineer I would really like to know what they are doing to ensure that the information is destroyed after the transaction is entered. Simply pressing delete does not erase the file, regardless of the computer system you are using the information is still there and easily recovered.

What I would also like to know that has been asked already and not answered is who is actually entering those transactions. AHS has been on this thread several times stating that the breech is not within their business, in light of the above facts I am not too inclined to believe that they are 100% sure of that.

As far as law enforcement goes, I am willing to bet that the Austin PD would be happy to arrest a citizen of Austin who had been stealing credit card information from their employer.

Until AHS comes clean with how they process the transactions, and what they are doing to safeguard that data I am not comfortable doing business with them. There is simply too much anecdotal evidence here indicating a problem.
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riverfrontbrewer said:
Yes, this is the sticking point that they won't seem to publically address. They store our/your CC numbers in a PC for up to 1.5 weeks before processing and destroying, per an email I have from AHS.
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It still seems to be an ongoing problem since I just got whacked yesterday morning.


_
 
I really don't care how they handle the info. I imagine it is similar to a lot of other people I buy from on a daily basis without knowledge of how they process cards. Unless they are doing something that is illegal or against the regs of their processors, I don't think it is my business.

I do know the fact that my credit card info. was taken as a result of ordering from them is my business and deserves my attention. If it was a random incident, I would be inclined to forget about it. However, this problem is very wide spread and the worst I have seen in my years of using the card. If the problem is not found and addressed, I won't be ordering from them again. Simply moving on or throwing solutions like switching processors and moving on isn't enough to know that this won't happen all over again in the future for me.

Hopefully they are a victim like me. It's times like this where good companies stand up and show their customers why they are the best at what they do. If they handle this admirably and with concern for their customers, I would be more inclined to order from them in the future than I would have had this never happened. This can either be a lot of good press or bad. The choice is theirs.
 
I made a purchase from AHS on Jan. 24th, and was clear till now. I just checked this morning and i have 2 charges from this weekend (for $1.06 on 2/12 and $5.62 on 2/13). Luckily they were small charges so i think i caught it while they were still testing the card.
 
I had a few Pokerstars.net charges on my CC that were caught by my Mastercard security. They notified me and I have a new card on its way right now.
 
I was downloading data into quicken Saturday evening and had a fraudulent charge. I was not aware of the AHS connection until I read a thread on another forum. I had made my first purchase from them on Sunday, February 6 and had a fraudulent charge on Feb 11 for over $800. I was not a member of this board until yesterday so there is no connection there. Chase has taken care of the fraudulent charge so I'm not out any money, but I do have to deal with informing companies that make automatic charges to my CC of the new CC account. PITA.

I will say that, except for them being the source of my credit card number being stolen, I was pleased with the service I received from them.
 
riverfrontbrewer said:
Yes, this is the sticking point that they won't seem to publically address. They store our/your CC numbers in a PC for up to 1.5 weeks before processing and destroying, per an email I have from AHS. There has been NO public comment about this even though I have asked that it be addressed several times. It would also seem to me that a store PC would be pretty easy to hack, esp if employees are using it to peruse the internet and picked up a bug somewhere. My anger and frustration have nothing to do with the money, it's mainly the above.
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Yep, AHS just ensured I NEVER order from them. CC info should be sent direct to the clearing house and never stored on a local system (other than last 4 and approval code)
 
Actually, Forrest has repeatedly stated that it's not their practice to store the numbers. It's always possible that whoever emailed riverfrontbrewer that information was uninformed.

It might be in riverfrontbrewer's best interest to contact Forrest directly for clarification, as I doubt Forrest has the time to follow this thread as closely as many of us are doing right now. Just a suggestion, and I'd certainly be interested to hear what Forrest had to say.
 
I suppose whats tripping people up is that if the cards are processed by hand then they have to be displayed on the screen of the computer at some point which implies they are stored somewhere on some computer OR it could imply they are printed out and then shredded but never "stored".
 
If they are being processed by hand it doesn't matter if it's on a computer or not. Someone could just keep a list of everyone's CC info as they process it.
 
stratslinger said:
Actually, Forrest has repeatedly stated that it's not their practice to store the numbers. It's always possible that whoever emailed riverfrontbrewer that information was uninformed.

It might be in riverfrontbrewer's best interest to contact Forrest directly for clarification, as I doubt Forrest has the time to follow this thread as closely as many of us are doing right now. Just a suggestion, and I'd certainly be interested to hear what Forrest had to say.
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I have no doubt he is following this thread just fine. It was stated once (post 522) that they don't store numbers....then when read post 536, that statement now reads....we don't store numbers, on our site.....Big difference in those 2 statements if you ask me.
 
stratslinger said:
I doubt Forrest has the time to follow this thread as closely as many of us are doing right now.
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I'd say it is in his best interest to follow this thread closely. According to his posts, he has zero idea how this happened. Any data would seem useful, and this thread may be the only data he has.

Well, almost. I posted a thread on the brewing network's board last week to try to determine if this is an HBT thing or a AHS thing. There were only a couple of CC fraud comments, so it's hard to learn anything from that. None would have been telling, and a spate of them would have also.
 
stratslinger said:
Actually, Forrest has repeatedly stated that it's not their practice to store the numbers. It's always possible that whoever emailed riverfrontbrewer that information was uninformed.

It might be in riverfrontbrewer's best interest to contact Forrest directly for clarification, as I doubt Forrest has the time to follow this thread as closely as many of us are doing right now. Just a suggestion, and I'd certainly be interested to hear what Forrest had to say.
Click to expand...

Come on, wake up! Manually entering credit card numbers implies that the credit card numbers are stored for some period of time between when they're entered by the customer into the web app and when the employee manually keys them into the point of sale device.
 
DaBiggin said:
Come on, wake up! Manually entering credit card numbers implies that the credit card numbers are stored for some period of time between when they're entered by the customer into the web app and when the employee manually keys them into the point of sale device.
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I completely agree with this, the numbers have to be stored someone in order for them to be manually entered later. Also since Forrest seems to be storing customer credit card information I hoped he's aware that he's probably in violation of PCI standards. Here are some sites he might want to check out:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Payment_Card_Industry_Data_Security_Standard
https://www.pcisecuritystandards.org/merchants/index.php

He has an obligation to protect sensitive customer information and needs to follow all PCI standards to ensure that he is doing so. Until he can prove that he is doing so I don't think I will feel comfortable ordering from him again. An easy solution would be to setup his website to pass all credit card transactions directly to his processor.
 
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