DIY Counterpressure filler

[Antonio Martinez]

I wanted to see if you guys can check my sanity here. I came up with the idea yesterday to try to make a cheap counter pressure bottle filler out of Duotight (push-in) fittings. See attached picture if you need a better idea of what I had in mind. All said this would run you about $40 if you ordered from MoreBeer.
The full parts list is :
(2) Duotight Push-In Fitting-8mm(5/16in) Ball Valve (one for beer in/one for gas in)
(2) Duotight Push-In Fitting-8mm(5/16in) Tee (connects ball valves)
(1) BlowTie Diaphragm Spunding Valve (Control pressure/flow)
(1) Duotight Push-In Fitting - 8mm (5/16 in.) x 9.5mm (3/8in.) Reducer (to join 9.5mm tubing to stopper)
(1) #2.5 Stopper with 3/8 hole (into the bottle)
(1) 5.5ft length of 4mm ID x 8mm OD EvaBarrier tubing (between all other connections)
(1) 5.5ft length of 6mm ID x 9.5mm OD EvaBarrier tubing (into the stopper)

 

[Jayjay1976]

Looks like it would work though for $40 I wouldn't exactly call it cheap. I use duotight fittings in my keezer and I think they are a bit overpriced.

Not knocking your idea, but it's too bad they dont make a push-button valve since those ball valves are kinda hard to turn and it looks like you'll need three hands to operate it. If you mounted it to a board it might be easier to use. Looking forward to your results!

 

[Antonio Martinez]

@Jayjay1976 I suppose cheap is relative and I was more or less comparing it to the counterpressure fillers offered on MoreBeers site. You make a good point about it not being a one hand operation. If anyone were copying it they'd also need to have a few other parts of they weren't already using the Duotight setup. I'll report back though once I'm able to get the parts and test it. On a side note, how do you like the fittings in your keezer?

 

[K_tile]

Have you seen the Tapcooler counterfiller sold by Great Fermentation?

 

[Jayjay1976]

@Jayjay1976 I suppose cheap is relative and I was more or less comparing it to the counterpressure fillers offered on MoreBeers site. You make a good point about it not being a one hand operation. If anyone were copying it they'd also need to have a few other parts of they weren't already using the Duotight setup. I'll report back though once I'm able to get the parts and test it. On a side note, how do you like the fittings in your keezer?

I love my duotight fittings and EVAbarrier tubing. I think you are onto a good path, and I would love to see you bring it to fruition, please don't let anything I've said discourage you.

 

[Jayjay1976]

Have you seen the Tapcooler counterfiller sold by Great Fermentation?

That unit is super nice but kinda expensive. I really want one but at that price it drops way down on my list of brewing priorities. I would love to see a duotight solution that works well. @Antonio Martinez is going to lead us to the promised land.

 

[Nate R]

Didn't some super genius here create and post a "diy staw" filler? It was like $5 or something....
I loke where the OP is going, and $40 beats the heck outta $70, $100, or upwards of $170 for a handheld model.
Also- one could repuprose the duotight fittings as needed down the line.

However.... isn't the "buy once, cry once" rule come into play here? It looks like $100 is a fair overall all-in cost for a blichmann beer gun v2 or a tapcooler.
Price stinks, but if the goal is to get a truly simply, one person operated model, i assume to bottle keg beer that lasts for months not days... why not save up and splurge here. (Or look up the $5 version... people did seem to rave about that!)

I will say this- i have a beer gun v2 and i hate cleaning it. Two long tubes (5' and 10') and a few other pieces that must be sanitized before use, then pbw cleaned afterward. I wish tapcooler had come out sooner!!
Moral of the rant: no matter what, bottling sucks compared to kegging!! Lol. But it is a nessecary evil i suppose.

Final note- with the apparent arrival of home canning machines on the rise... if that is something you may want down the line, factor that into your deciscion?

 

[Jocky]

I would be worried about the give/flex in the joints between the various pieces.

When you are using a CP filler you need to hold it on the bottle with a little force as the pressure is created in the bottle and at that point I think your design will flex and you'll have to hold the stopper in place with one hand while operating it with the other.

If you're using beer line there will be a lot of flex. More rigid pipe would work better, but even then there's chance of flex and something leaking.

If you're still keen on doing it then maybe thing about putting a Y piece at the top rather than a T, just so the controls are together by the same hand.

Maybe I'm biased though - I've got a Tapcooler and it's brilliant.

 

[Jocky]

And FYI here's the really cheap option:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/we-no-need-no-stinking-beer-gun.24678/

 

[Nate R]

And FYI here's the really cheap option:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/we-no-need-no-stinking-beer-gun.24678/

Yuo! That's the one. I would do this OR spend the ridickulous amount of money on an already made version. Does noy make sense to me to spend in the middle. Ymmv

 

[Antonio Martinez]

I love my duotight fittings and EVAbarrier tubing. I think you are onto a good path, and I would love to see you bring it to fruition, please don't let anything I've said discourage you.

That's pretty much the consensus I've seen/read from anyone using them. I think Lowe's has a product called Shark-Bite that are push-in fittings but I couldn't find them in the sizes that would be used in kegging systems and they weren't cheaper either if memory serves. No discouragement taken lol.

 

[Antonio Martinez]

And FYI here's the really cheap option:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/we-no-need-no-stinking-beer-gun.24678/

I saw that one a while back when I was researching these and wondered how well they worked and how sturdy the picnic taps are. I've seen several places that the picnic tap tends to break fairly often but at that price point you could afford to pick up a few extras. I'd be using EvaBarrier line and from what I've seen in Kegland videos they only use 1.5" pieces to join them together so it seems like they should be short enough to avoid too much flex. The only exception would be the length that goes from the bottom into the bottle. I do like the suggestion @Jayjay1976 made about attaching it to a board so long as it doesn't interfere with opening/closing the ball valves for gas/beer in connections.

 

[Antonio Martinez]

Yuo! That's the one. I would do this OR spend the ridickulous amount of money on an already made version. Does noy make sense to me to spend in the middle. Ymmv

I would much rather spend on the low end or the middle vs high end but I understand the point you're making. To me being able to break it all down and use the pieces elsewhere gives it more value than being a single function piece of equipment and since I'm already planning to use the Duotight setup it made even more sense to me. I always appreciate the feedback though and the "straw filler" looks extremely simple so I may do both and compare the two.

 

[smithsh]

And FYI here's the really cheap option:

https://www.homebrewtalk.com/threads/we-no-need-no-stinking-beer-gun.24678/

+1 for this option. I'm very new to the kegging world and wanted to try bottling without spending much money on expensive gadgets or the time to build something. Only thing I had to buy was the #2 size bung to fit the neck of the bottles. I eventually had to buy a $2 racking cane from the LHBS, because I thought the tube from my bottling wand would be a snug enough fit in the picnic tap, but I was wrong. If it is not a very tight fit it WILL leak when under pressure during filling. Voice of experience. But the racking cane was cheap and I just cut the gooseneck off and gave it a whirl and it is so easy to bottle that I see no reason to build or buy anything else at the moment.
He covers all of the watchouts or tips that I can think of, but I will pile on one of his points that I missed at first and wasted some beer doing it. Go ahead and fill all or at least several of your bottles at once, THEN take them one at a time and give them a short burst of liquid into the top of the bottle to agitate it slightly and make the foam slowly rise to the top, where you can cap on the foam. Then do this for the next bottle and so on. If you try to fill, splash, and cap all on one bottle and then move to the next you will see why I don't recommend it. You have to put your bottle filler somewhere while you cap (I have a sanitized glass jar) and in the 5-10 seconds you are capping, the bottle filler tube will foam and some of it will drain into the jar. When you go to fill your next bottle the initial burst will produce a little extra foam in your bottle. Not a huge deal, but I've found that if you keep moving from one bottle to the next on the pressurized filling part this doesn't happen and each fill is nice and clean. Hope that makes sense.

All that said, if I ever decide to spend money on parts or a setup the Tapcooler is the way to go in my opinion. Very small, handheld operation that seems easy to clean and has really neat features like the telescoping fill tube. I don't have much use for the beer guns personally. They seem like more trouble and no better fill technique than the cheap option.

 

[Dr_Jeff]

Beerguns allow one to purge the bottle with CO2 prior to filling.

 

[smithsh]

Beerguns allow one to purge the bottle with CO2 prior to filling.

Yes, they do. And so does the cheap option if you give the bottles a short burst of co2 from a SodaStream And if you are capping on foam there shouldn't be any oxygen in the bottled product, whether there was any to begin with or not.

 

[Jayjay1976]

Yes, they do. And so does the cheap option if you give the bottles a short burst of co2 from a SodaStream And if you are capping on foam there shouldn't be any oxygen in the bottled product, whether there was any to begin with or not.

Using a short burst from a soda stream is perhaps the least economical way imaginable to purge a beer bottle with CO2.

 

[smithsh]

Using a short burst from a soda stream is perhaps the least economical way imaginable to purge a beer bottle with CO2.

If you are buying the cartridges from target I would agree. But if you are kegging you have access to really cheap co2, so whether it comes out of a soda stream nozzle or a beer gun makes no difference. I just use what I have and am trying to offer suggestions to others who may be in the same boat.

 

[Nate R]

I have a blichmann beer gun version 2.
I have not done any other bottling, but i will say this:
-once set up, the beer gun is VERY easy to use one handed. Purge with C02, fill about any size bottle or growler, and i've had bottles last months with no oxygen issues (now, the beer i made, oth... lol).
-if you have a second set of hands to cap, you can keg 5 gallons very quickly. I did an entire 5 gallons into 750ml swing cap bottles in December for gifts in like 15 minutes (with help capping). Obviously 12 ounce bottles will take at least 2x as long.

Now....
The cons:
-Price. Still beats a stand mount professional model, but $100 is a hundred bucks.
-cleaning. This this is a beeyatch to clean. Two lengths of small tubing, ball lock, two seperate stainless tubes, and the little tip with clamp is wonky. It takes me as long to clean (or longer) than it does to bottle. (Yes that's homebrewing, but what makes this gun so easy to use also makes it so complicated to disasemble).
(Note, i am sure one could skip a few steps in cleaning, especially if you use it more frequently, but why risk it?)
-also, you pretty much do the reverse when assembling to use- just gotta soak it all in statsan

Finally, a few tips for any bottling under pressure are:
-get your bottles cold. Like, freeze overnight if you can. Helps a ton with foam.
-have your serving keg at 2 to 4 psi.
-have your co2 purge at 10 to 12 psi.

So, to do it right, you need to able control the psi on your serving keg, and the psi on your gas.
So you pretty much will want to regulators, or a secondary at least.

Of course, you do not have to do any of that, but it helps.

When it's all said and done, it IS a wonderful tool have. I would only bottle bombers or bigger.
If i had to do it over, i would strongly consider the tapcooler.
My only worry about that is that the mess made when bottling (and it is Always a mess, no matter what!) Is easier to contain with a gun. It would be difficult down the front of my upright keezer with the tapcooler.
With a gun, i bottle and work inside of a tub, or drip tray, that is an easy clean up later.

Just my ramblings...

 

[Jocky]

My only worry about that is that the mess made when bottling (and it is Always a mess, no matter what!) Is easier to contain with a gun. It would be difficult down the front of my upright keezer with the tapcooler.
With a gun, i bottle and work inside of a tub, or drip tray, that is an easy clean up later.

If you want to do lots of bottles then there is an accessory for the tapcooler to connect it direct to the keg. It has a ball valve which screws onto the top of the filler, and replaces the bit that normally sticks in to a tap.

It's also a bit of a rip off and I'm pretty certain I could have built the accessory for half what it actually cost, but I didn't know that until I bought it.