Conan x WLP644 hybrid

[TravelingLight]

From Kristoffer re-posting my Milk the Funk post back on page 2:

I stepped them up from the small vials he sent going 50ml > 100ml > 250ml >1L. From there I harvested 2 - 500ml jars of each of the F1 and F1C4 variants.

...

As far as fermentation goes, I noticed the same thing when fermenting the beers as I did when stepping up the samples and making my starters for this batch - the F1C4 variant seemed to lag about 12-16 hours or so behind the F1 variant in terms of showing signs of fermentation, but then it caught up pretty quickly, produced a larger krausen, and finished quickly and slightly lower than the F1 variant. For this split batch the F1 finished at 1.012 and the F1C4 finished at 1.010.

------

From those first 2 - 500ml jars I wound up with I gave 1 to a friend and then used the other to make a 2L starter. I used 1L for a 3 gallon batch and then again harvested 2 - 500ml jars for future use.

I noticed signs of fermentation pretty quickly even at the smaller stages, and that was after my wife stuck the original package in the freezer for a good 12-18 hours :smack:

Right now I'm propping up samples of Kristoffer's Lachancea Fermentati strain which is a yeast that produces lactic acid as well as ethanol and CO2

I've got a sour blonde with apricots dry-hopped with Citra and Amarillo going with the F1 varaint of this, this weekend I'm brewing a NEPA using the F1 variant, and then I'm going to do a pale ale with the F1C4 shortly.

Excellent! I plan on stepping up to 1500 then harvesting three 500ml jars to keep one, and give the other two to brewing buddies for their reviews.

 

[jessup]

I want to play your reindeer games! Been following this thread & looking forward to some reviews. This is pretty awesome

 

[TheHairyHop]

Interesting that my F1 appears to flocc more readily than the F1C4 (ignore the erroneous label haha).

the behavior repeated for the next step up

 

[TravelingLight]

Got mine going. Interestingly enough, one of them was right about a 12 hour lag time behind the other one. I *think* that was the F1 lagging behind the F1/C4 (can't remember exactly and forgot to note it). Noticed the same lag when I stepped up to 500ml last night. These ladies smell amazing though.

 

[TheHairyHop]

mine smell primarily of belgian esters. I seem to be unable to coax peach out of yeast that supposedly can make it

 

[Jwin]

mine smell primarily of belgian esters. I seem to be unable to coax peach out of yeast that supposedly can make it

I think the peach from Conan is more pronounced when under pitched.

 

[chrilr]

I just tried mine that was a split between F1 and us05. The 05 was more bitter and clean. The F1 was less bitter and fruitier, maybe peachy but it had a large flame out addition of mosaic, Nelson and amarillo.

 

[TheHairyHop]

Interesting that my F1 appears to flocc more readily than the F1C4 (ignore the erroneous label haha).

the behavior repeated for the next step up

well that was a turn of events. my F1 is fluffy, full and tastes of peach and the F1C4 is slightly tart and huge on the pineapple. so much so, I worry that it's infected, but we'll see. there are no other signs of infection. looks like I'm going with F1 on brew day as it more closely aligns with NEIPA characteristics

 

[drgonzo2k2]

well that was a turn of events. my F1 is fluffy, full and tastes of peach and the F1C4 is slightly tart and huge on the pineapple. so much so, I worry that it's infected, but we'll see. there are no other signs of infection. looks like I'm going with F1 on brew day as it more closely aligns with NEIPA characteristics

That's pretty much what I continue to experience. F1C4 seems to lag about 12 hours behind the F1, but then it takes off, finishes quicker, and finishes dryer. F1 is like super Conan in terms of being a peachbomb while F1C4 is pineapple.

 

[BaylessBrewer]

I got F1 ready to go for tomorrow. Going to brew a pale ale with 5lbs 2-row, 5lbs Vienna and 8oz rolled oats.
For hops I will be bittering with Warrior and then I will finish and dry hop with homegrown Cascade and Centennial.
Hopefully it turns out a good beer.
It's not what the original plan was but I really want to brew with my homegrown hops so........

 

[TheHairyHop]

I got F1 ready to go for tomorrow. Going to brew a pale ale with 5lbs 2-row, 5lbs Vienna and 8oz rolled oats.
For hops I will be bittering with Warrior and then I will finish and dry hop with homegrown Cascade and Centennial.
Hopefully it turns out a good beer.
It's not what the original plan was but I really want to brew with my homegrown hops so........

I dunno, sounds like a recipe for an awful beer... no way that could be good... you should send it my way to safely dispose of it

 

[tagz]

I'd love to get my hands on some of the F1C4 eventually. I could send out an empty white labs vial and a return mailer, if anyone would be willing to fill it up. I'm in no hurry, but the quick, dry, pineapple descriptor sounds enticing. I tried Kristoffer but he ran out.

 

[BaylessBrewer]

I'd love to get my hands on some of the F1C4 eventually. I could send out an empty white labs vial and a return mailer, if anyone would be willing to fill it up. I'm in no hurry, but the quick, dry, pineapple descriptor sounds enticing. I tried Kristoffer but he ran out.

PM me your address. I have a 2ml vial of it in the refrigerator I will send your way if you want it. You will have to step it up.

 

[BaylessBrewer]

I dunno, sounds like a recipe for an awful beer... no way that could be good... you should send it my way to safely dispose of it

I'll get right on that! [emoji57][emoji482][emoji482]

 

[tagz]

PM me your address. I have a 2ml vial of it in the refrigerator I will send your way if you want it. You will have to step it up.

Awesome. Thanks! PM sent.

 

[BaylessBrewer]

Awesome. Thanks! PM sent.

Dropped it off this morning and it should arrive Tuesday.

 

[BaylessBrewer]

So I had what I call a weird fermentation with the F1 on the pale ale I brewed Friday.
I pitched at 1pm on Friday and have a good fermentation going Saturday morning. By Saturday afternoon it was going gang busters at 68* F but no real krausen. Just boiling white and looked similar to a wine ferment.
Fast forward to this morning and all major activity is over and the top of the beer is smooth as glass.
OG was 1.055. Anyone else notice a difference in Fermentation with this strain? It does smell wonder!

 

[BaylessBrewer]

Just took a hydrometer sample and all is well as far as I can tell. Gravity is at 1.012 right now and the sample tasted good.

 

[SanPancho]

if anyone else has some fairly clean F1C4 i could beg off of them that'd be huge. i can send off a clean vial and mailing kit that should make it pretty hassle free.

 

[tagz]

if anyone else has some fairly clean F1C4 i could beg off of them that'd be huge. i can send off a clean vial and mailing kit that should make it pretty hassle free.

I have some en route from Bayless and I'd be happy to pay it forward. It'll take me a bit
step up but I should be able to get it back to you fairly quickly. Shoot me a PM!

 

[suregork]

So I had what I call a weird fermentation with the F1 on the pale ale I brewed Friday.
I pitched at 1pm on Friday and have a good fermentation going Saturday morning. By Saturday afternoon it was going gang busters at 68* F but no real krausen. Just boiling white and looked similar to a wine ferment.
Fast forward to this morning and all major activity is over and the top of the beer is smooth as glass.
OG was 1.055. Anyone else notice a difference in Fermentation with this strain? It does smell wonder!

Just took a hydrometer sample and all is well as far as I can tell. Gravity is at 1.012 right now and the sample tasted good.

Good to hear that fermentation went well and the beer is tasting good I've noticed that the F1 hybrid ferments very fast (finishes in 2-3 days for ~1.050-1.060 wort), but contrary to your experience I seem to get huge krausen most of the time. The fermentation is usually really vigorous around 36 hours after pitching.

Edit: I apologize to everyone that has contacted me recently about getting a sample of these hybrids. I still haven't had time to cultivate up more, as I'm now really busy at work with lots of other yeast-related research I hope to start a new batch at some point during the fall!

 

[BaylessBrewer]

Good to hear that fermentation went well and the beer is tasting good I've noticed that the F1 hybrid ferments very fast (finishes in 2-3 days for ~1.050-1.060 wort), but contrary to your experience I seem to get huge krausen most of the time. The fermentation is usually really vigorous around 36 hours after pitching.

Edit: I apologize to everyone that has contacted me recently about getting a sample of these hybrids. I still haven't had time to cultivate up more, as I'm now really busy at work with lots of other yeast-related research I hope to start a new batch at some point during the fall!

Yeah I'm not sure what the cause was. The krausen layer was maybe 3/4in and fermentation went very fast. I may have over pitched too so that may have something to do with it.
Step up went like this: 200ml, 500ml, 750ml, 1000ml and 1500ml with 500ml poured off of that for saving and the rest was pitched. With no way of knowing my cell count I can only assume I over pitched.
Here is the yeast from the 500ml I saved. Almost 50ml of yeast.
View attachment ImageUploadedByHome Brew1473112064.262023.jpg
So going off that I potentially pitched approximately 100+ml of fresh yeast into 5.25gal of 1.055 wort. If the fresh yeast was 5 billion/ml then I pitched close to 500 billion cells or almost twice the cells needed.

 

[TravelingLight]

I pitched F1 this morning in an NEIPA. I stepped it up to about 2500ml and harvested two 500ml jars and pitched the rest (after crashing/decanting). I usually give all my beers two weeks but it seems like this guy works pretty quickly...

 

[BaylessBrewer]

I pitched F1 this morning in an NEIPA. I stepped it up to about 2500ml and harvested two 500ml jars and pitched the rest (after crashing/decanting). I usually give all my beers two weeks but it seems like this guy works pretty quickly...

How's the krausen looking on your batch?
Since activity stopped in my batch 3 days in I went ahead and tossed a ounce of homegrown cascade in last night (day 4) and will leave it in for 7-10 days then crash and keg.

 

[TravelingLight]

How's the krausen looking on your batch?
Since activity stopped in my batch 3 days in I went ahead and tossed a ounce of homegrown cascade in last night (day 4) and will leave it in for 7-10 days then crash and keg.

Well...my carboy is tied up so this is in a bucket. Krausen was pretty vigorous on the stir plate. I had way too much in the flask and overflowed some. I'm likely doing a two stage dry hop on this. So I'll probably do stage one after seven days in primary.

 

[TheHairyHop]

been sampling my F1 NEIPA. what a difference over 644. it's got the orange juice look I was trying to achieve with 644, but instead got something a lot more clear. there truly must be something in the genes of Conan that does something with hops. anyway, I didn't get any peach out of it, but seeing as I didn't do any temp control, it's not terribly surprising.

 

[TravelingLight]

been sampling my F1 NEIPA. what a difference over 644. it's got the orange juice look I was trying to achieve with 644, but instead got something a lot more clear. there truly must be something in the genes of Conan that does something with hops. anyway, I didn't get any peach out of it, but seeing as I didn't do any temp control, it's not terribly surprising.

Did you crash and/or gelatin fin that NEIPA? I ask because this is my first NEIPA and I've seen varying opinions (as with most HB stuff).

 

[TheHairyHop]

no, I don't purposefully try to clear my beer anymore. I guess every beer gets cold crashed because of serving temp. unless I'm misunderstanding that

 

[BaylessBrewer]

I have some en route from Bayless and I'd be happy to pay it forward. It'll take me a bit
step up but I should be able to get it back to you fairly quickly. Shoot me a PM!

Did your yeast arrive yet?

 

[tagz]

Yep! I'll be pitching the first step today. Thanks again!

 

[BaylessBrewer]

Yep! I'll be pitching the first step today. Thanks again!

Awesome! Cheers!! [emoji482]

 

[Ruckusz28]

I'm looking forward to seeing these beers finished.

 

[TravelingLight]

I've got the F1 going in an NEIPA. (Editor's note: I'm in a bucket with this one, so I'm going off of blow off activity, not visual) Started ramping up in about 24 hours. By 48 hours it was really rolling, I assume I was at high krausen or damn close to it by then. Calmed down some now. Probably toss in my first dry hops this weekend.

 

[tagz]

On the second step starter for F1C4 and it smells great. I can see where people get the pineapple descriptor from; it's not pineapple exactly for me, more mango, but it's definitely distinct from 644 or Conan at this point.

 

[drgonzo2k2]

Right now I've got "Hop Paws" on tap, a NEPA which is my version of Ed Coffy's Hop Hands clone (Hopwards from his site), substituting Mosaic for Simcoe in the recipe. I used F1 for that, and it is amazeballs level of good. Probably one of my favorite beers I've ever had.

When I get home tonight I will also be tapping "Pedio & The Apricots" which is a dry-hopped no-boil golden sour with Apricots. 6 gallon batch, and I used Pediococcus Pentosaceus to sour from a pH of 5.5 > 3.4 in 36 hours, then pitched the F1 variant. Let that go for 7 days then racked on to 18 pounds of apricots for 14 days. From there racked onto 100g each of Citra and Amarillo. I can't get home fast enough to try the final product.

Next week I'm doing "Fools Gold" with the F1C4 variant which is essentially a Modern Times Neverwhere clone, following the recipe that Michael posted on his site as opposed to the one that Modern Times published on Beersmith.

For both variants my primary fermentation schedule has been as follows:

Day 1 - 66
Day 2 - 68
Day 3 - 70
Day 4 - 72
Day 5 - 72
Day 6 - 75
Day 7 - 75

I do 2 day dry-hops for "clean" beers and go with 5 day dry-hops for sours due to the lower pH.

So I turned that Hop Paws beer from grain to glass in 12 days (7 days fermentation + 2 days dry hop + 2 days cold crash + 1 day carb).

These yeasts do really well with the fast turn around.

 

[TheHairyHop]

Pretty sure my F1C4 got infected because the pH of the starter was 3.4. Oddly, the FG is exactly the same as my F1. Perhaps there just isn't enough sugar complexity in dme to allow for a lower gravity? I found a small crack in my erlenmeyer that I used for the F1C4. I bet that's the source of the infection. It was my first use of the flask as well. So I'm pretty bummed. It should have been able to handle heating on a ceramic stove top

 

[andrewmaixner]

It should have been able to handle heating on a ceramic stove top

I've read that you must use a some kind of heat diffusion with pyrex on a ceramic cooktop. I was annoyed, as that is what I have. Use a metal disc, or a double-boiler (water in another pan), or something like that.

 

[TravelingLight]

I've read that you must use a some kind of heat diffusion with pyrex on a ceramic cooktop. I was annoyed, as that is what I have. Use a metal disc, or a double-boiler (water in another pan), or something like that.

I'm glad you mentioned this. I would really like to be able to boil my starters in my flask but I've heard so many horror stories of using them on a glass/ceramic electric stove. I'd like to explore options so I don't have to boil in a pot, cool the pot, then get it into the flask (and I can never find a damn funnel around here!).

 

[TheHairyHop]

I've read that you must use a some kind of heat diffusion with pyrex on a ceramic cooktop. I was annoyed, as that is what I have. Use a metal disc, or a double-boiler (water in another pan), or something like that.

Considering a ceramic cook top is basically a heat plate, that isn't an intuitive requirement

 

[m00ps]

I'm glad you mentioned this. I would really like to be able to boil my starters in my flask but I've heard so many horror stories of using them on a glass/ceramic electric stove. I'd like to explore options so I don't have to boil in a pot, cool the pot, then get it into the flask (and I can never find a damn funnel around here!).

Ive never head a flask break from heating on my ceramic stove in my current place, or my gas stove in my old place when I first started 3 years ago (though i've broken my fair share of flasks by several other means)

As long as its borosilicate grade glass, I wouldnt give it a second thought boiling it on the stove. Just dont temp shock it in a cold water bath or something.


sidenote: I'll post my experience with these yeasts soon. I've used both the f1 and f1/c4 in 6 or 7 beers now in varying capacities, a couple were mixed with other yeasts. I need to go over all my brew logs and notes to make sense of it all, but ive been pretty busy. Its good to read a lot of others are getting the more pineapple geared flavors from the f1/c4 because I definitely picked that out