Brown Sugar in Doppelbock?

[vincanis]

I was thinking of skipping the middleground of high-priced kit beers (I made a True Brew Porter as my first brew) and I'm thinking of going for a mini-mash. At least I believe it is considered one because of the amount of grains. The recipe is simply the Doppelbock that can be found in the iBrewMaster app, but I want to add some brown sugar to it for the primary and throw in some extra spices in the secondary.

The recipe is as follows:

6lb Dark DME
1.5lb Crystal Malt
1lb Chocolate Malt
2lb Munich Malt
4lb Pilsner Malt
3oz Hallertau Hops
?lb Brown Sugar

And in the secondary I want to add:
5tsp Allspice
3-5 Cinnamon Sticks and
4tsp Vanilla (or maybe some vanilla beans)

I've been reading "How to Brew" and I read up on adding brown sugar, however there isn't really any suggestion as to how much to add to get the flavor it imparts. Specifically I want a bit of the molasses/rum taste and to also keep some of the sweetness. As of right now, I picked the Trappist High Gravity yeast and have 2lbs of Brown Sugar in the recipe (though that most likely will change) and it has an estimated ABV of about 11.66%, which is pretty damn high.

Basically the main questions are:
1. Will the spices in the secondary work?
2. How can I easily add some brown sugar without ramping up the ABV too much, or rather how much do I need to impart some good flavors?
3. Does adding the brown sugar change the fact that it is a doppelbock?

 

[lumpher]

not quite sure what to call that. a christmas holiday spice bock? seriously, i'm thinking this might be pretty sweet. adding the brown sugar replaces adding molasses in many recipes, and makes it sweeter

 

[vincanis]

I had the Sam Adams Chocolate Bock and really enjoyed it, as well as their Christmas Porter (or whatever it's called) and the Old Fezzywig Ale, and reading all of their ingredients made me want to make a sort of Christmas-ey spiced dark beer. I'm just not sure on how much brown sugar to add. The two pounds might make it perfect in terms of flavor but it will have a bite to it at 12%, which might be good to counteract the sweetness. Hmm.

The main reason I arrived at the decision of brown sugar was originally just the thought of "that might taste damn good" but then after reading How to Brew, it is kind of the sweet spot between molasses and plain sugar. It adds sweetness, as well as the caramel, molasses and rum flavors that molasses adds but just toned down.

 

[KraphtBier]

Two pounds of brown sugar is a lot. I would knock it down to a half pound, you'll notice it. With all the spices it may be harder to pick out but I've used a quarter pound in a barleywine (1.094 OG) and I could tell it was there. Also, trappist yeast is going to throw a lot of esters and phenolics, that in conjunction with the spices is going to make for a very complicated flavor profile. Not that I think that is a bad thing, just want you to know its going to be difficult to pick out any one flavor in your proposed recipe.

 

[KraphtBier]

Two more things before I call it a night.

1. Spices in the secondary will work, ratios are someone else's territory as I don't typically brew spiced beers (though I do enjoy them from time to time).

2. This will not technically be a doppelbock, you are using an ale yeast and I am assuming you do not plan on lagering. The brown sugar doesn't dis-allow the doppelbock classification. The fact that you aren't using a lager yeast or a lager fermentation profile does.

 

[Maweni]

Hi Vincanis,

I have brewed a number of batches with brown sugar, raw sugar and even white sugar. Every one of those batches I had noticed that something was wrong with the beer, until I realised it was the sugar. I took out the sugar and my beers got better. I will never use sugar again in my beers, I have even purchased a kegging system so that I can force carb so that I will not need to use sugar to bottle carb. IMHO I would not use sugar.

 

[vincanis]

What are some other decent high gravity yeasts? I just picked the Trappist yeast because I saw it was for high OGs. I figured that two pounds would be a bit much and I would need to cut back on it a lot, which is why I always ask before doing.

On the lagering part, thanks for the advice on the actual classification. I wish I could actually make a lager beer, but I just don't have the room for the equipment as I live in an apartment ATM for college.

EDIT:
I figured it might be important to put time values in this. I was thinking 14 days or so primary, 7 days secondary and at least 4 weeks in the bottle.