Brown IPA Recipe Draft

[NoIguanaForZ]

So, with the recent experiences of having encountered a few IPAs I actually didn't hate, and the realization that if I ever want to open a brewery I'm realistically going to have to have something among my regular offerings to placate the hopheads, it seems like I should try to figure out an IPA-type recipe I can live with. Reading through the BJCP style guide, the Brown IPA or style seems like the best starting point.

Hoppy, bitter, and moderately strong like an American IPA, but with some caramel, chocolate, toffee, and/or dark fruit malt character as in an American Brown Ale. Retaining the dryish finish and lean body that makes IPAs so drinkable, a Brown IPA is a little more flavorful and malty than an American IPA without being sweet or heavy.

Most extant Brown IPA recipes seem to be at or below 80% base malt. The typical SRM range is apparently 11-19 according to BJCP, which seems a little low for something labeled "brown" and makes me wonder if it wasn't accidentally copy-pasted from the "Red IPA" section. (Apparently this was brought up on the BJCP forums in March and forgotten about... >.>) I'm going to assume it's a typo and figure an SRM range of 18-30 is probably appropriate for the style, given that the Appearance section of the guidelines for the style states:

Color ranges from reddish-brown to dark brown but not black. Frequently opaque, but should be clear if visible. Unfiltered

With that in mind, I'm now trying to develop a recipe for a beer with a powerful hop character, a strong and complex malt presence hitting all of the "chocolate, caramel, toasted, malty, dark fruit" notes, strength and IBUs that fit into the IPA range but without excessive bitterness, and with a color/SRM in the "actually brown" range. I'm looking at between 6 and 7% ABV, fairly dry finish, and 40-45 IBUs with primarily or exclusively late hopping. I think "herbal," "spicy," and "earthy" hop flavor descriptors would work well, and I'm thinking about using Nugget between 0-20min for IBUs and flavor, and possibly for a flameout addition, boosted with an aroma-type hop. I might experiment with dry-hopping in future batches; for the most part I've found I don't like beers that are advertised as dry-hopped (they have a "crunchy" flavor quality).

The grain bill I've worked out for a 5.5 gallon batch is as follows:
-10 lb (80%) Pale 2-row
-12 oz (6%) Simpson's Double Roasted Crystal/C120
- 8 oz (4%) Brown Malt
- 8 oz (4%) Melanoidin Malt
- 8 oz (4$) Chocolate Malt (350L)
- 4 oz (2%) Special B

I'm planning to mash around 148-150 F, which should give good fermentability and keep it from being too sweet or full-bodied. Beersmith predicts an OG of 1.065 and an FG of 1.012 assuming mashing at 148. I have experience with all of these malts, and feel like they'll work well together in these proportions, but will entertain specific suggestions.

I'm thinking BRY-97 as a yeast, because I want a relatively clean, well-attenuated fermentation and an "American" character, perhaps with some mild fruitiness, but I. Need. It. To. Clear. And US-05 has been failing me in that regard. Other dry yeast suggestions, however, are welcome.

I'm most interested in suggestions about the hopping rate and schedule. My draft recipe is:

-1oz Nugget at 20min (27.6 IBU at Beersmith default of 13% AA)
-1oz Nugget at 10min (16.5 IBU " " " ")
-1oz Nugget at somewhere between flameout and 180 F
-4oz Mt. Hood at somewhere between flameout and 180 F

Is the Nugget likely to do what I've described here? I haven't actually used it, but the descriptors sound promising. Is there a better choice than Mt. Hood out of these to go with the Nugget? How do the proportions look

 

[bferullo]

have you looked at clones of Dogfish Indian Brown Ale for inspiration? It's flavor profile (grain bill wise) seems to go along with what you are looking for. I am not saying "clone" it, but rather look at the ingredients and see what each brings and tweak it to what you are looking to do.

 

[Weezy]

The grain bill looks a lot like a brown porter recipe. This is essentially a hoppy brown porter. You might find that those rich of crystals, brown malt, will really wreak havoc on the pallet competing with those IBUs. It's not going to be that dry either.

Nugget is a nice hop in American brown ales.

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

The grain bill looks a lot like a brown porter recipe. This is essentially a hoppy brown porter. You might find that those rich of crystals, brown malt, will really wreak havoc on the pallet competing with those IBUs. It's not going to be that dry either.

Even mashed that low?

Nugget is a nice hop in American brown ales.

That's good to hear.

[EDIT]

have you looked at clones of Dogfish Indian Brown Ale for inspiration? It's flavor profile (grain bill wise) seems to go along with what you are looking for. I am not saying "clone" it, but rather look at the ingredients and see what each brings and tweak it to what you are looking to do.

Good idea (though I'll have to pick one up to try, too...) Anyway, found a thread with a few[/quote]:

Dogfish Head Indian Brown Ale Clone
Recipe by Amahl Turczyn Scheppach

5.5 US Gallons
Boil Time: 90 min
IBU's 21
SRM: 22
OG: 1.072

12lb Pale Two Row
10oz Amber Malt
10oz Crystal 60L
2oz Roasted Barley
8oz Caramelized or Brown Sugar in boil
0.5oz Warrior Pellet Hops (16%AA) at 60 min
1.0oz Vanguard Pellet Hops (4.5%AA) at 0 min
Ringwood Ale yeast

Mash at 152 degrees for 60 minutes. Mash out at 168 degrees for 10 minutes. Ferment at 70 degrees, then condition in secondary at 60 degrees for at least one week.

**Due to the Ringwood Ale yeast, you will need a diacetyl rest - though the secondary for at least a week should take care of that.

Aside from the brown malt vs I don't think it's really that radically different from mine, which is reassuring. I think I'm gonna wanna do a 1gal test batch, though.. o.o

I also note there seem to be a lot less late hops than my recipe.

 

[Weezy]

Mash temp isn't going to cut 16% crystal and melanoidin. The later recipe is quite different then yours. Look more closely. C60 is very different than your crystal malts and there's a lot less. Amber is lighter than brown. Brown sugar will add flavor with out adding body/maltiness. What are you looking for out of the melanoidin?
There's nothing wrong with your recipe. You have an idea of the flavors that you want and expect. You might just be missing the dryness and how it all blends, finished body, bitterness, and rich malt flavors. I'm not sure if i like it. My mental taste buds is getting bitter dark fruit.

 

[SanPancho]

Even mashed that low?


Aside from the brown malt vs I don't think it's really that radically different from mine, which is reassuring.

+1 on "too much crystal"

the c120 and special b (140ish) are too much, they get too sweet, doesnt matter how low you mash, its just what the grain tastes like. anything above 80 is going to give you very sweet notes that dont belong in a brown. (unless maybe you're really imagining a brown porter like noted above)

not to crap on your recipe here, but i'd say you're better off going for a large amount of 20-60 srm malts as opposed to loading up so much on the dark crystal. then use something like pale chocolate (or any dark roast) to get your final SRM and color where you want it.

munich II, dark munich, victory, aromatic, toasted, special roast, biscuit, aromatic, etc., and some crystal in the 40-60 range, just dont go crazy with it.

most of the english hops will be good (and their american cousins), as long as you dont go for the overly fruity ones. you do also want bit of bitter bite to cleanse palate, but not as much as you might think you'd need given the color. its pretty hard to strike the right balance of hops and malts on something like this. not easy to do. could take half a dozen batches to even be in the ballpark of what you have in your head.

at least, that's my experience.

dont have any in the pipeline, but its near top of my list to brew again. when you get yours done, lemme know and i'll swing out to sac and drink one with you. i'm working on a brown ipl for our new brewery in SF. other than our "new school" pils, its the hardest recipe ive had to come up with so far. surprisingly difficult to find the right balance.

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

I've brewed with C120 quite a bit and I really like the flavors that it brings to the table. Given those, I think the Special B is probably redundant. Might back off to 8oz on the C120. Melanoidin is similar to aromatic doesn't seem to be especially sweet; it has a higher extract potential than Pale 2-row and is cited as preferred by some users because it adds maltiness without adding a lot of sweetness (as here). I see it as a sort of super-Munich. 8oz might be a bit much, though, from what I'm rereading of usage notes. Start with 4, maybe...

Wonder if some rye malt would go well in this?

 

[Weezy]

I'd recommend starting simple and adding if you think the beer is missing something.

88% Pale
8% C60 (C120 if you really must)
4% Chocolate

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

What about the hop quantities, and especially the Mount Hood/other Aroma-type finishing hop suggestions?

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

Anyone?

 

[bferullo]

What about the hop quantities, and especially the Mount Hood/other Aroma-type finishing hop suggestions?

IMO: get most of your bittering from the initial hop addition. Just plug into beersmith and keep adding until you get desired IBU;

then choose the flavor you are looking for based on hop description for the other additions. I like to do either whirlpool or flameout for my flavor/aroma additions. I haven't done the "30 or 15 minutes" addition in ages. It's all preference though, no right or wrong way.

You won't get that much bitterness from either method, so you can go with whatever amount you want. I usually flameout/whirlpool .5 oz of different varities based on my desired profile. For example in my session IPA (mind you its a 4 gallon batch) : .75 oz amarillo, .5 oz simcoe , .30 oz citra. )

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

I wound up starting over on this concept and brewed the following:

8lb Pale 2-Row (66.7%)
3lb Brown Malt (25%)
12oz Honey Malt (6.3%)
4oz Melanoidin Malt (2.1%)

1oz Nugget (14.6%) at 45min - 46.8 IBU
1oz Nugget (14.6%) at 5 min - 10.2 IBU
1oz Nugget at flameout
2oz Mt. Hood at flamout
2oz Mt. Hood dry hop ~7 days, once the krausen had mostly subsided

Mashed at I think 150, Nottingham yeast. Fermented down to 1.008.

Based on the green beer the hops need a couple weeks to mellow but I'm pretty happy with it for a first draft. Areas for improvement are 1) Not getting a whole lot of hop aroma (Mt. Hood is pretty "noble-ish" as I understand it, might be too delicate to stand out?) and 2) it feels like the flavor's actively missing a little bit of caramel/dark fruit notes that would round it out.

Next time I'm gonna try swapping the Melanoidin (which I expect is kind of overwhelmed here) for either DRC or Special B (kind of leaning the latter for variety, DRC being kind of my go-to) and adding 1oz of Nugget to the dry hop. Anyone have any suggestions for hops to substitute the Mt. Hood with (not necessarily on a weight basis) that would complement the Nugget and that grain bill?

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

I've seen Willamette as a recommendation; I like that one but I use it a lot, and I'd like to branch out but it might be a good standby. Some of what I've seen about Styrian Goldings is encouraging. A stronger hop like Galena might not be bad either; a little fruitiness to go with the added crystal...

Thoughts?

 

[NoIguanaForZ]

Actually, some of the things I've read about Cluster are encouraging as well...

 

[jerbrew]

I've done something similar. Approximate recipe:

70% MO
20% Brown
10% Amber

I used a ton of EKG and wlp007. One of my favorite beers. The EKG is really nice and earthy. I've done that same recipe with willamette with equally great results.

Something nobleish and with good aroma is sterling. It's a saaz baby. I make a great APA with it and cascade. Tons of great aroma. Might go well with that nugget or willamette.