Beer keep on turning sour

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TheBrewers

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I was brewing beer 3 batch already. I follow exactly the same as other brewers do but it end up still sour. 1st batch - sour + bitter, 2nd batch - bitter start and sour end, 3rd batch - little sour body. I boil about 2 gallon of water and drop in the coopers lager kits + 1kg dextrose. Let it boil a while then put it there to let it cool a little bit then pour into fermenter. Immediately I fill up the water to 23L / 5 Gallon and adjust the temperature to around 28 - 30 degree C. Then I spread the Standard Coopers Brewer Yeast in and stir a little bit then seal it. All this batch I do using the same way. The temperature is not constant, it sometime goes to 28 and sometime 32. I am from a hot weather country. I prime it immediately after the airlock stop. I do this at dining room. I think that's the only place that doesn't have direct sun light. Please help. I am out of idea.
 
it's hard to say for sure what's causing it, but it does seem like your fermentation temps are a bit on the high side, you're talking high seventies to low 80's. temps that high can cause a tart, sour apple taste in your beer. do you have a way to control temps, even just a bit, like get them into the high 60's? i use a large bucket (15-18 gal) and place my fermented in a cool water bath in the bucket. you can then adjust the temps using frozen water bottles to keep cool.

BTW, welcome to HBT and this wonderful hobby!
 
Well i have read more then once on forums that people say coopers tatse funny now i dunno if true or not b/c i havent tried it yet and wont b/c of what i read and im going all grain anyway so. I will say this though why prime and bottle as soon as airlock stops? Just b/c airlock doesnt show activity doesnt mean it has stopped fermenting. I guess people on here would call that "bottling green beer" ??? Give it some time. My airlock stopped after 12 days and mine still fermenting i think with all the small bubbles but they are going away so im riding it out.
 
I never try that before because most recommendation is using thermostat and suction fan and seal the whole thing inside an extruded polystyrene. I only can get a fan for it :p the other two, can't do. But i see your recommendation is good and simple, I would like to try that. :D What is the best temperature for lager actually? I really wish to brew a nice lager. I fail all the way down :confused: Thanks again ;)

Doreen :mug:
 
mtk6006: Let it sit in the fermenter even after the airlock stop??? Will that cause infection? I am just worried about the outside air draw back into the fermenter and gonna spoil all the batch :confused: It really tears me when I pour the beer down the sink :(
 
Yes its paintence. Airlock means nothing anybody on here will tell ya this. Thats not a guage to go by but hydrometer is. Someone gave me advice on here USE hydrometer and getting infection is not that easy to get. Dont worry and give it time. Hey im new im still learning as i go and getting more paranoid as the days go by but one thing i have learned here is DO NOT FREAK OUT! :)

Edit: I have a blonde ale grainless going now and im pushing 3 weeks and i aint bottling until maybe 4-6 weeks maybe longer when i do taste test it taste better every time! Give it some time :)
 
MotorcycleMatt: Ale? What kind of yeast should I use for Ale? I am stock with Standard Coopers Brewers Yeast. It didn't state what kind of yeast is inside. Thanks for your suggestion :)

Doreen:mug:
 
TheBrewers said:
mtk6006: Let it sit in the fermenter even after the airlock stop??? Will that cause infection? I am just worried about the outside air draw back into the fermenter and gonna spoil all the batch :confused: It really tears me when I pour the beer down the sink :(
Click to expand...

no, letting a beer sit after fermentation subsides doesn't pose an infection risk. it can actually help clean up some of the off flavors produced from warm ferments, under pitching, etc. just always remember to practice good sanitation and your risk from infection at all times will be minimal. i've found leaving a beer in primary for a week or two after FG is reached actually makes a better beer.
as for lagers, they need to be fermented cool, around 50. then warmed 5-10 degrees for the last 15-20% of fermentation for a diacetyl rest, then slowly cooled to lagering temps (mid 30's) and held there for weeks or months. it's a much more in depth process than brewing ales, and requires fairly spot on temp control. i agree with the other poster that a new brewer should get the ale brewing down first, then delve into lagers.
sorry all my temps are in Fahrenheit, but i'm horrible at converting. :mug:
 
You know, you went into great detail about your brewing and fermentation process, but you're mentioning that your beer is turning sour, and you never mentioned the most important question (an no one's asked it yet) what about your sanitization process?
 
mtk6006: Yes.. you are right. I usually use hydrometer only before I pitch the yeast and once the fermentation finish :) This is because I scare of infection. Really worried about it. Sanitized the hydrometer and didn't use it for 1 weeks, will is bring the bacteria together? :( Then if I sanitized it before I do the test, will the chlorine spoil my batch or giving wrong reading? :( I am trying not to freak out but I really gonna be sad if I have to waste all the batch :( but I found your suggestion is pretty good. :) Thanks ya..

Doreen :mug:
 
Revvy: I just have a pail with all hose and equipment inside and there is a pump flushing it for 30 minutes. I am using Clorex(Sodium Hypochlorite) for sanitize my equipment. The fermenter and tap by filling the water+clorex up to the head and sit for 30 minutes. After that, I will rinse them all with water and I will use a soft handkerchief to clean it. Will there be anything wrong there?? Thanks so much :)

Doreen :mug:
 
Doreen, i think the coopers kits have ale yeast with them. There's many different kinds of ale yeasts. I think the coopers lager even uses an ale yeast so its technically not a lager. I would let your beer primary for 3-4 weeks, that let's the yeast clean up any off tastes and helps clear the beer. How long are you bottle conditioning the beer?
 
NordeastBrewer77: Thanks... I will get some and try Ale first. I just don't know the yeast is for Ale :confused: it's not stated there :mad: The person just send me this yeast and tell me it should work for Lager :( but thanks anyway, I should have some idea and try your method as soon as possible :) Cheers :mug:

Doreen:mug:
 
Im betting handkerchief. Use a solution that you dont have to rinse with or wipe out. Let me guess the handerchief in a basket or drawer right? Something like that? I bet it picked up all kinds of goodies! I use that Ld carlson stuff its easy enough and no rinse and well its just easy! :) Dont use a rag dont even dry hands with a rag they pick up so many things its crazy! Just air dry them. If the rag was in bathroom and toilet is flushed EVERYTHING in bathroom is COVERED with a mist of all sorts of stuff! Lets say its in a drawer you touch handle with dirty hands 50 times but the one time you get to wipe out fermenter the handle aint clean those "germs" go right into the rag and right into fermenter AND cut water off with elbow TOUCH NOTHING :)
 
MotorcycleMatt: Once the airlock stop it's around 2 weeks. Then I use the carbonation drop 2 for each bottle of 660ml and fill it up. Then I just shake it a little. I leave it there for 1 week as recommended by the seller and put it all into the fridge :confused: I have no manual on it. I failed 3 batch and I now figure out to seek help over here :) Thanks a lot.
iodaphor or star san? I will try to ask the storekeeper about it. Let it dry? It won't left any chlorine on it? Thanks again :)

Doreen :mug:
 
Clorox definitely kills germs, but requires a very thorough rinsing. Leaving any behind will give you some very off-flavors, unpleasant, often like the smell of a fresh box of bandaids.

You might think about changing to a different sanitizer - a wet-contact sanitizer like iodophor or StarSan - read directions for dilution, and put in a spray bottle. After cleaning thoroughly, spritz with the sanitizer just prior to use, and use while wet. Properly mixed, it won't impart any flavors into your beer.

Yeasts - Coopers kits use ale yeasts. These are meant to ferment at 62-70 (F). Lager yeasts ferment in the low 50's (F), then rest for 3-4 weeks much lower than that. If you do not have a good temperature control system, you cannot do lagers successfully. Ales can be placed in a tub of cool water, and keep the water cool with frozen water bottles - for a simple method.

Temperature control is important to prevent off-flavors, which may be what you're experiencing. Yeast undergoes metabolic activity, and the first few days of fermentation may easily exceed 10(F) higher than the temps in your room. A water bath at the proper temps helps draw the heat away, and your beer will be much better.
 
You're rinsing your sanitzer???? That's your issue probably. Do your beer a favor and switch to a no-rinse sanitizer like Iodophor or Starsan. For one thing they are no rinse/wetcontact sanitizers that are both more effective than anything else, especially starsan.

Secondly if you've got a house bug now, it's adapted to your sanitization regime, you need to throw it a curve ball or else you won't get rid of it. I actually use both sanitizers, mostly starsan, but every now and then I'll use switch it up and use some iodophor, that way nothing adapts to well to my brewery.

But your biggest issue I think is rinsing your sanitizer.....
 
Doreen, I would skip the clorox and handkerchief, and find iodophor or starsan, both are a no rinse sanitizer. I would also bottle condition them for 3 weeks, the kit instructions are never very good
 
mtk6006: handkerchief :confused: It's from my drawer. But I do rinse it with the clorex :confused: but you sound right too... but if just let it dry, it has the chlorine smell. Hum... Guess I should get other sanitation, right? :) Thanks

Doreen:mug:
 
It seems like the problem has been boiled down to sanitization in this case. But I'd like to make a comment in another vein...

When you add your extract to your boil, be sure to take your pot off the heat first. Then pour in your liquid extract, stir it up well, so that it dissolves into the water, then return it to heat.

When you add your liquid extract to your water while it is on the heat, you may find that it sinks to the bottom and scorches. That could leave to bitter (if not sour) tastes.

But yes, watch that sanitizing process and get rid of the towel. :) Cheers!
 
I have had this exact same experience with the Coopers OG Lager that came with the DIY kit. It took close to a month of bottle conditioning for it to fix itself. It was a like a dry, sour/bitter taste. I made a post here after testing one after 7 days and was not impressed. I would have rather had a sip of turpentine.. :(

It was fermented at 16C.

I did a mash with it so I thought I just effed' up my mash. But after sampling another batch I did the same day (split the mash) that was fine, I just guessed it had something to do with the kit. Time was the only thing that helped, and at the end I could drink it fine, it was decent beer. Just a weird tasting beer at first. I hopped mine with Saaz which helped.

This was my first experience with homebrew and my first real lesson in bottle conditioning. Makes a huge diff.
 
Well listen to nord and revvy and unionrdr to name a few they know WAAAAAAAY more than me. But thats what i would start with is ferment longer and sanitize I didnt think about sanitize but thats a big deal :)
 
Hang Glider: I will remember that. Thanks a lot there :) Looks like I have a lot mis-step :( Really gonna change the style and be patient about it :) Thanks, really appreciate it.

Revvy: Thanks for your suggestion. I really need to change the sanitizer :) As I see a no-rinse sanitizer really safe me from the job. I was wonder if I contact with those equipment but I just didn't notice that it's so sensitive :( So everytime I rinse those equipment, I will have to wash my hand before I do all those rinsing and cleaning. Hehe :)

Really thanks all of you here for the great suggestion and idea about making a beer. I will try my next batch with Ale :) Hopefully it works :)

Doreen Cheerss..:mug:
 
BrewGardenCA: The extract and dextrose dissolve totally and when I pour it is clean. Does that scorches the extract? Thanks

HopHeadGrady: There is a issue that the store here doesn't have any hops :( not even 1:mad: They just have the kits, sugar, sanitizer and equipment. I was thinking of all grain sometime ago but no grain available here :( but really thanks for your suggestion :)

mtk6006: thank you very much too :)

Doreen :mug:
 
I got to sleep now and I gonna try my batch tomorrow :) Hopefully everything goes fine and will update with you guys :) Cheers All :mug:

Thanks to all of you here... really appreciate your suggestion and opinion and guide... thanks a lot :)

From,
Doreen :mug: ;)
 
"Immediately I fill up the water to 23L / 5 Gallon and adjust the temperature to around 28 - 30 degree C. Then I spread the Standard Coopers Brewer Yeast in and stir a little bit then seal it. All this batch I do using the same way. The temperature is not constant, it sometime goes to 28 and sometime 32."

I think your temperatures are WAY too high...28 degrees celsius is wayyy too hot. Like others suggested, put the fermenter in a bucket of cold water with a t-shirt over the fermenter. If you can, try to keep the temperature of the water closer to 17-18 degrees celsius.

Also, stir a lot, vigorously, not just a little.
 

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