1st ever batch is aweful :(

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saeroner

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1st beer ever.

Hop Head x2 IPA (from MidWest)

I thought my brewing process went well. I should have taken notes.

I thought I sanitized everything (i'm OCD with this type of stuff). used all spring water from the store.

Beer doesn't even taste hoppy and has a very strong taste and really bad after taste right away. Alcohol taste strong as well - final reading was 1.020. Doesn't taste cidery or sour... just weird after taste and nothing like a x2 IPA really. swishing around in mouth isn't bad, just swallowing is (quick after taste) I wish i could explain better.

4 things I can think of.

*The LME was sitting out for a couple days by the sunlit window - also this was purchased through Amazon -- maybe it was old.

*When I boiled for 60 mins, the sticker/label on the LME container came off (unnoticed) when adding the LME to the kettle before the boil. It might have been in the wort for more than 5 mins at 180+ degrees... Small amount of ink/glue maybe? idk

*I tried to keep the temp around 63 degrees in the party tub recycling blue ice coolers but it might have gotten above 70 a few time while i was at work.

*All the bottles I used a ran through the dish washer over 4 times using the sanitized feature (no soap) maybe something to do with the water?

I followed the instructions other than the part where it says to age in the carboy for 10 weeks. I made a thread about that and got answers that i don't really need to age for 10 weeks in a secondary.

I did 2 weeks primary and 1.5 secondary dry hopped.

9.3lbs Gold (light) LME
4oz Aromatic (for steeping 30min 155-F)
12oz Caramel 60L (for steeping 30min 155-F)
8oz Victory (for steeping 30min 155-F)
1oz chinook (60min)
0.5oz cascade (45min)
0.5oz centennial (30min)
0.5oz cascade (20min)
0.5oz centennial (10min)
1oz crystal (5min)
dryhop 2oz whole leaf (probably cascade)

Not sure what the yeast was but it was dried. It started fermenting in 12 hours and was very active for 3 days.

Any thoughts? It's been bottled for 4 weeks now and still not good.
 
A strong funky alcoholic taste might be a sign of fusel alcohol, which is usually caused by too warm of a fermentation.
 
My first beer was really bad too :).

My first guess would be old extract. My second guess would be water chemistry. Do you remember how the boil went? Did you get a hot break (where it foamed up a whole lot)?

The alcohol taste is something I expect to be there if you have not aged the bottles. The higher the ABV the longer it takes to mellow the boozy taste out.

I doubt it's bottles nor the possible fermentation cooling fluctuation.

How long did you let them set to carbonate up in the bottles?
 
My first attempt at an IPA was undrinkable. Very discouraging. The second shot at it was much better. First was an extract, the second all grain, for what it is worth. But I also put together a fermentation chamber in between those brews which probably made a bigger difference than did the switch to all grain.
 
sorry to hear your first batch didn't turn out well.

D - maybe a bit of All of the Above (ferment temps are CRITICAL to success and once thru the dishwasher should suffice)

the instructions from MidWest are OK. but most of us, I think, would recommend only adding part of the LME at the beginning of the boil, the rest towards the end.

don't get discouraged. try another kit, maybe a less expensive one to get some experience and work on technique. you got spring water, so you have empty bottles. fill those with water and freeze. swap them out as often as you can in your tub

good luck with your future brews!
 
Double IPA's or any higher gravity brew can be tough on new brewers. The higher the gravity the less forgiving the yeast are. Aeration, pitch rate, fermentation temperature and yeast nutrition become more important to control and the flavor effects of less than ideal conditions become more pronounced. I'd jump back on the horse after doing some reading with a lower gravity brew. Anything in the 1.040-1.055 range should give you a little more room for error. Reading a decent home brewing book with a recent copywrite can really help you dial in the basics. Above all, don't let it get you down. Brew on!!
 
I made just about every mistake possile on my first batch. The only redeeming quality of the beer was no infection and decent carbination. Here is the list of my mistakes:
Scorched LME
Pitched yeast at 100F
Fermented too high
Bottled after 13 days
Used crappy yeast.

Don't feel bad.
 
I had the opposite problem. My first batch was great, but I couldn't repeat it for about a year. It was pretty frustrating.

I'd let this batch age for a while and jump right into another batch. You might have to dump it eventually, but give it some time to improve.

Don't let it get you down too much, though. Practice, and continuous improvements in technique, eventually make perfect. You'll have your share of bad batches along the way. Learning to do this is more of a marathon than a sprint.
 
saeroner said:
1st beer ever.

Hop Head x2 IPA (from MidWest)

I thought my brewing process went well. I should have taken notes.

I thought I sanitized everything (i'm OCD with this type of stuff). used all spring water from the store.

Beer doesn't even taste hoppy and has a very strong taste and really bad after taste right away. Alcohol taste strong as well - final reading was 1.020. Doesn't taste cidery or sour... just weird after taste and nothing like a x2 IPA really. swishing around in mouth isn't bad, just swallowing is (quick after taste) I wish i could explain better.

4 things I can think of.

*The LME was sitting out for a couple days by the sunlit window - also this was purchased through Amazon -- maybe it was old.

*When I boiled for 60 mins, the sticker/label on the LME container came off (unnoticed) when adding the LME to the kettle before the boil. It might have been in the wort for more than 5 mins at 180+ degrees... Small amount of ink/glue maybe? idk

*I tried to keep the temp around 63 degrees in the party tub recycling blue ice coolers but it might have gotten above 70 a few time while i was at work.

*All the bottles I used a ran through the dish washer over 4 times using the sanitized feature (no soap) maybe something to do with the water?

I followed the instructions other than the part where it says to age in the carboy for 10 weeks. I made a thread about that and got answers that i don't really need to age for 10 weeks in a secondary.

I did 2 weeks primary and 1.5 secondary dry hopped.

9.3lbs Gold (light) LME
4oz Aromatic (for steeping 30min 155-F)
12oz Caramel 60L (for steeping 30min 155-F)
8oz Victory (for steeping 30min 155-F)
1oz chinook (60min)
0.5oz cascade (45min)
0.5oz centennial (30min)
0.5oz cascade (20min)
0.5oz centennial (10min)
1oz crystal (5min)
dryhop 2oz whole leaf (probably cascade)

Not sure what the yeast was but it was dried. It started fermenting in 12 hours and was very active for 3 days.

Any thoughts? It's been bottled for 4 weeks now and still not good.
Click to expand...

Here goes try #3...damn thing won't post??
Keeping the LME by a sunlit window could've skunked it. Keep LME & yeasts in the fridge.
Using the partial extract technique of using only a couple pounds of extract in the partial boil would've lessend mailard reactions that give darker color & that extract twang. Add remaining extract at flame out,since the wort is still boiling hot & pasteurization happens about 160F in seconds. Lighter color & cleaner flavor result.
Depending on th e yeast,70F is a little high. I've still gotten clean flavors from US-05 at that temp. Read the manufacturers recommendations on the PDF's usually supplied to the seller.
Clean the bottles with a bottle brush & PBW & rinse well to get them cleaner inside than a dishwasher is likely capable of. Sanitize with a no-rinse like Starsan right before filling.
A hop schedule more like 20,15,10 & 3-5 minutes left in the boil would've been better for flavor & aroma.
 
could it be a bottle infection? would putting the bottles in the dishwasher fully sanitize them would the fluid be able to get at the inside of the bottles properly? iv heard the guy who runs star san say that this can be a problem but then again he probably would say that
 
The opening in the bottles is too small for the water jets to get into adequately. That's where a jet bottle washer comes in handy or a sink tap & a bottle brush. Rinse & drain to dry. Then use Starsan inside them right before filling. This is where the bottle tree & vinator come in really handy & quick.
 
Demus said:
Double IPA's or any higher gravity brew can be tough on new brewers. The higher the gravity the less forgiving the yeast are. Aeration, pitch rate, fermentation temperature and yeast nutrition become more important to control and the flavor effects of less than ideal conditions become more pronounced. I'd jump back on the horse after doing some reading with a lower gravity brew. Anything in the 1.040-1.055 range should give you a little more room for error. Reading a decent home brewing book with a recent copywrite can really help you dial in the basics. Above all, don't let it get you down. Brew on!!
Click to expand...

I agree with this 100% Definitely try again and master those basics. Get an AHS kit with free shipping (fresher malt extract), scour this website for anything you came across that you had a question about. How To Brew by Palmer is online or just buy his book, ive been using it for 1 1/2 years now and i just used it yesterday!

But seriously try again
 
Keep going dude. My first batch, an Irish red, was awful too. Don't get discouraged.

I don't know if anyone said it yet, but 1.5 weeks for dry hopping might be a bit on the long end. Careful going out that far.
 
Changing fermentation temps is likely the culprit. Buy an old fridge and a thermostat!
 
I was just about to post exactly the same problem as OP. Buddy and I recently brewed a SNPA clone (extract w/ steeped grains we got from LHBS) that has now been in the bottle 5 weeks. We washed and sanitized like fools. Used bottled drinking /spring water and boil went off perfect. Hot and cold breaks seemed to go well and fermented at 65 with Nottingham.

There is this flavor... I'll say its the bandaid description, but that might not be it. Haven't eaten bandaids lately :)

Second brew, a Pumpkin ale... Partial mash this time - so half the extract has a similar taste but not as strong. 2 weeks in bottle now.

Third seasonal ale - partial mash - half the LME as the first again and half as much off flavor. Ready to be bottled this week.

Just not sure what it could be. I feel like cleaning and rinsing are solid. Wondering is mixing sanstar with our tap water is creating an off flavor due to residual chlorine. Seems like such a small possible amount.

Any thoughts and could this be the same issue as OP is having? very discouraged ATM, but will try one more batch. Going back to a SMaSH only for next recipe...
 
Why are you mixing sanstar with your tap water? Do you mean Starsan? Starsan is a no-rinse sanitizer that breaks down into yeast nutrient. but a high enough concentration of chlorine or chloromine could do it. Chlorine can be boiled off,chloromine needs cambden tablets to nutralize.
 
Yes Starsan...sorry :) I guess we'll have to make sure to use a boiled off or tablet in our sanitizer water to see if it makes the difference.
 
what I meant to convey is that Starsan is for sanitizing your equipment,not for sanitizing the water. Using spring water (which comes from pockets in bedrock) & not well or ground water works fine for me. Tap water should be boiled or treated with cambden if it smells or tastes like chemicals.
I go to White House Artisian Springs & get spring water at the source for 25c per gallon.
 
First, IIPAs can be tricky. They really require good control and a good understanding of the process. That said, don't give up!

Good choice to use bottled water.
LME doesn't skunk. Skunking happens when the hops are isomerized by the boil THEN struck by certain wavelengths of light.
I'd clean and sanitize the bottles differently. Get a bottle brush and some PBW and give the bottles a soak and a brush. Then rinse and just before using spritz some starsan in there and let the excess drip out.

Depending on the yeast, temp during fermentation is critical. Most ale yeast would be ok if the temps go a bit above 70, but Nottingham is known to give fruity flavors in the high 60s to low 70s. This is fine for some styles, but in an American IPA it's usually unwanted. Also know that a IIPA could very well ferment like mad, which will raise the temps 5+ degrees easily! You may want to keep the temp of the water in the swamp cooler down to 58 or so in this case, at least during the hard ferment.

There isn't a good reason to secondary a beer for 10 weeks. Maybe 3, including the dry hop.

A IIPA is going to be harsh unless all kinds of things happen right. My advice on this batch is to let them sit in a cool dark place for a couple of weeks and see how they taste after that. In the meantime, why not try another batch of something? Pick up a kit from the store and try a different style.
 
Ooops on the skunking bit...Idk where my mind was with a chest cold going into my head. But I do think LME is better kept in the fridge at any rate...
 
Lme cant get skunked without being hme. Its the hops that skunk a beer. My guess is that it fermented too warm and you're getting esters and fusels
 
Probably inadequate aeration as well. Yeast need a good bit of oxygen to get started, especially in higher gravity brews. The standard shake the carboy for a few minutes just doesn't get it done. Unhealthy yeast don't make tasty beer...
 
OP Did you do a full or partial boil? How many gallons is your kettle? Did you add all the LME before the boil? You could have scorched it. I usually add 1-2 pounds lme before the boil and the rest at flameout.

Demus said:
Probably inadequate aeration as well. Yeast need a good bit of oxygen to get started, especially in higher gravity brews. The standard shake the carboy for a few minutes just doesn't get it done. Unhealthy yeast don't make tasty beer...
Click to expand...

Dry yeast won't make bad beer if it's not aerated. Liquid could.
 
GrogNerd said:
dry yeast don't need starters like liquid does

both need aeration
Click to expand...

Not true at all. Aeration is ok but not necessary for dry yeast. Everything is in the dry yeast sachet that they need to reproduce.

 
Last edited by a moderator:
I believe it's a good thing to aerate for the reproductive phase when using dry yeast. I rehydrate mine every time now. That might change the game a little?...
 
Believe what you want. Not aerating with a fresh sachet of dry yeast won't cause beer to be "bad" or "awful". I know this for a fact. I also rehydrate 90+% of the time.
 
m3n00b, what gravity are the beers that you make without aerating? I'm a newb and just asking for a better understanding of opposing opinions. From all the reading I've done, it seems that plenty of people agree that a lower gravity beer might be fine without, but a double or imperial IPA like the original poster is working with should be aerated for best results. Just wondering if you've found differently in the same style.
 
I didn't realize this was a double IPA. I wouldn't feel the need to aerate anything below 1.060. When I do doubles with us05 I try to aerate as much as I can by stirring my bucket. I'm sure this doesn't work as well as shaking up a carboy but my IIPAs come out great. Just had one go from 1.082 down to 1.010 in less than a week using 1 sachet and a little stirring.
 
Yeah,I know what they say in those PDF's,but I still like to be on the safe side & aerate with my strainer & paddle. I have to strain the chilled wort,top off,& mix the wort & water anyway. So that also aerates it some. But other than that,I don't go out of my way,unless it's liquid yeast in a starter.
 
m3n00b said:
I didn't realize this was a double IPA. I wouldn't feel the need to aerate anything below 1.060. When I do doubles with us05 I try to aerate as much as I can by stirring my bucket. I'm sure this doesn't work as well as shaking up a carboy but my IIPAs come out great. Just had one go from 1.082 down to 1.010 in less than a week using 1 sachet and a little stirring.
Click to expand...

I would say that all gravities could benefit from a little aeration, but they don't all need oxygenation.

anything to make the magical little beasties happy... but not TOO happy
 
Thank you everyone. Lots of info on here to learn from.

I did keep brewing -- actually did 4 kits in 6 weeks, so this is just the 1st I've tried out of the 4. I got another IPA, Pumpkin and amber ale going now -- hopefully I get better results.

Question though:

Why do all the directions for kits say to pour all of the LME into the boil at 60 mins? It seems from most of you that is not the best way to go about it.
 
I'm feeling pretty confident my mistake was mixing Starsan with chlorinated tapwater for sanitizing fermenter and then bottling bucket/bottles later. It seems like the taste I am experiencing fits all the description of phenols or Chlorophenols in the beer. I remember my brew buddy mentioning that he thought the Starsan rinse we prepared smelled like chlorine...I had no idea it was my water at the time (didn't know better). We followed the "foam won't hurt" method and let residual sanitizer remain in buckets and bottles as we filled.

Although such a small amount, I wonder if it was enough?

We used Nottingham, rehydrated and aerated well. Fermented around 63. Strong fermentation. Everything seemed perfect. Five weeks in the bottle now, I can't make through an entire bottle (yuck).

Fingers crossed we didn't screw the next two batches to bad :) Kinda brewed several batches in quick succession.

Our second beer (Pumpkin Ale) is coming up on thre weeks in bottle. It does taste better...but still some of that off flavor.

Live and Learn...
 
I mix my star san with chlorinated tap water and I don't get any off flavors from it.

I use filtered water from my fridge for brewing though. Did you use plain, unfiltered tap water for brewing too?

The instructions say to pour all LME in at 60 minutes to keep it easy. This leads to darkening, caramel flavors and lower hop utilization.
 
Mandlbrot said:
Just not sure what it could be. I feel like cleaning and rinsing are solid. Wondering is mixing sanstar with our tap water is creating an off flavor due to residual chlorine. Seems like such a small possible amount.
Click to expand...

Racking beer onto even a 1/3 carboy of starsan (mixed solution, NOT foam - the foam is harmless!) will ruin a beer. If you starsan'd your brewing water the beer is f@*#ed.

If you only used it as normal - sanitizing bottles and fermenters but not rinsing after - that's fine, it's not your problem. Try cutting your tapwater 50/50 with distilled.
 

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