Nottingham or any other ale yeast will ferment just as dry as Montrachet if not more dry. I have a batch on tap right now that was fermented with S-04, it finished a few points lower than the Montrachet.
Man, I love Apfelwein
- Thread starter EdWort
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Supposedly Windsor Ale Yeast leaves higher gravities in ales...but even though I bought several packs, I haven't actually used it for anything.
http://www.danstaryeast.com/products/windsor-ale-yeast
http://www.danstaryeast.com/products/windsor-ale-yeast
Ales and wine/cider/mead are totally different. Ales have a large percentage of non-fermentable complex sugars. Wines, ciders, and most meads have 100% fermentable sugars and will ferment to dryness unless you choose a strain such as a riesling strain which stops fermenting before 100% of the fermentable sugars are consumed.
1990dtgl98
Well-Known Member
Well guys, I think I will do the Montrachet and use table sugar to get a tiny bit more sweetness. Maybe after the first time I'll start experimenting, but for the first Apfelwein I might as well stick to tried and true methods!
:rockin:
:rockin:
If you are bottle conditioning you don't have any options to backsweeten. You can use lactose, I recommend against Splenda or other artificial sweetners because, well, they taste quite artificial. If you want it sweet, do what I do and add a little bit of simple syrup (1:1 by weight water and sugar, boiled and cooled) to the glass.
user 40839
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This stuff is just getting better and better. After a five week fermentation, I kegged it... carbed a sample, SWMBO didn't like it AT ALL.
2 weeks in the keg, carbed. SWMBO still not a fan.
3 weeks in the keg, carbed nicely. SWMBO suddenly says "hang on a second..."
4 weeks in the keg, carbed perfectly. SWMBO suddenly decides that it's REALLY good.
5 weeks in the keg, SWMBO is asking for pints of it and putting it down like soda.
2 weeks in the keg, carbed. SWMBO still not a fan.
3 weeks in the keg, carbed nicely. SWMBO suddenly says "hang on a second..."
4 weeks in the keg, carbed perfectly. SWMBO suddenly decides that it's REALLY good.
5 weeks in the keg, SWMBO is asking for pints of it and putting it down like soda.
My swmbo was the exact same way ubermick, She didn't like it when it was flat. But now that it's aged a month and gotten some carbonation she likes it much better. I'm going to hang onto these bottles as long as I can to let it age. I also have 5 gallons sitting in the carboy now (going on 2 months). So I should have a nice stockpile in the months to come.
Olddog
Well-Known Member
I swear the first batch of this stuff must be the worst in terms of anticipation. Mine has been fermenting for 10 days so far and every day I look at it and wish it was done already. What's worse is I want to wait until after three months to bottle it! 
MetallHed
Well-Known Member
holy balls... 6648 posts...
i didn't read 'em all. i want to make this for x-mas, but have a couple of questions
1)Table sugar or brown sugar instead of corn sugar?
1a) will it be sweeter? what's better, regular table or brown? will this raise the ABV too?
1b) if I were to use table/brown sugar, do I use the same amount as the original recipe called for?
2) do I have to worry about skunking due to light exposure?
3) does it smell pretty good while fermenting, or should I lock it up like the red-headed step-child? It'd be pretty cool to have a room smellin like apple while it's doing it thing
Thanks for the help!
i didn't read 'em all. i want to make this for x-mas, but have a couple of questions
1)Table sugar or brown sugar instead of corn sugar?
1a) will it be sweeter? what's better, regular table or brown? will this raise the ABV too?
1b) if I were to use table/brown sugar, do I use the same amount as the original recipe called for?
2) do I have to worry about skunking due to light exposure?
3) does it smell pretty good while fermenting, or should I lock it up like the red-headed step-child? It'd be pretty cool to have a room smellin like apple while it's doing it thing
Thanks for the help!
Olddog
Well-Known Member
1) Both will certainly work. The difference is corn sugar ferments cleaner IIRC.
1a) I'm not sure on this since I haven't done it yet. Hopefully someone who has can chime in. I think it'll be pretty close to the corn sugar. I would use brown sugar personally, it might add some interesting complexity to it but I don't think either will effect the ABV much.
1b) I think you can keep the amounts the same with corn sugar/table sugar. If anything add a little more table sugar than you would corn sugar.
2) No skunking. Skunking is from the hops and this has no hops.
3) People have said this smells like rhino farts while fermenting and some people have said it smells like dirty diapers. I never noticed smells like that yet (my first and only batch so far has been fermenting 10 days) but it's been in my garage which is a big space that gets opened to outside air often. I recently moved mine into my closet so that may change.
MetallHed
Well-Known Member
thanks for the replies.
i was thinking of using brown sugar for it... think i'm gonna.
my GF probably wont like the house smelling like farts (she'll argue that I already make it smell like that).. so I guess it'll get locked up. lol
i was thinking of using brown sugar for it... think i'm gonna.
my GF probably wont like the house smelling like farts (she'll argue that I already make it smell like that).. so I guess it'll get locked up. lol
mlyday
Well-Known Member
OldDog,
It smells pretty sulphury from about two days after pitching the yeast, that lasts for a couple of days. Its normal, but stinky. I have it down in the basement and bought a glade plugin type thing, that hides the smell pretty well.
It smells pretty sulphury from about two days after pitching the yeast, that lasts for a couple of days. Its normal, but stinky. I have it down in the basement and bought a glade plugin type thing, that hides the smell pretty well.
lnmnmarty
Member
How interesting...were on page 666 and talking about the smell of sulfur ! I first read this thread when Ed originally posted it. Today I just made 20 more gallons. I have always stuck with the original recipe until today. I made two batches like normal. I then made one with Premier Cuvee yeast, and one with the montrachet, but added one gallon of cranberry juice in place of a gallon of apple juice. In lieu of reading thousands of posts, does anyone know if this has been tried? Too late now, I know, just curious. Cheers fellas!
! I first read this thread when Ed originally posted it. Today I just made 20 more gallons. I have always stuck with the original recipe until today. I made two batches like normal. I then made one with Premier Cuvee yeast, and one with the montrachet, but added one gallon of cranberry juice in place of a gallon of apple juice. In lieu of reading thousands of posts, does anyone know if this has been tried? Too late now, I know, just curious. Cheers fellas!
MetallHed
Well-Known Member
Here we go!
:rockin:
I used 2 lbs of brown sugar and the recommended yeast.. i think i'll make up another batch with table sugar and champagne yeast to see the difference.. but first I'll have to buy another carboy.. probably going to get two better bottles because I have to rack a lemon weiss onto some zest in a few weeks, so i'll need the space...
see you in december! more rockin smilies!!
:rockin::rockin:
:rockin:
I used 2 lbs of brown sugar and the recommended yeast.. i think i'll make up another batch with table sugar and champagne yeast to see the difference.. but first I'll have to buy another carboy.. probably going to get two better bottles because I have to rack a lemon weiss onto some zest in a few weeks, so i'll need the space...
see you in december! more rockin smilies!!
:rockin::rockin:
BeantownR6
Well-Known Member
Finally - carbed Apfelwein. I cracked a bottle after 5 weeks primry 2 weeks bottled and was nicely carbed with a good hiss when taking the cap off. this stuff is great!!!!!!!
How interesting...were on page 666 and talking about the smell of sulfur
Many variations, e.g. the one you mentioned, have been tried. Some for better final taste after aging and some to make the product tasty in a smaller amount of time.
Wanting a tasty product sooner eventually led me to create this recipe https://www.homebrewtalk.com/f81/graff-malty-slightly-hopped-cider-117117/. I tried lots of variations before arriving there. I still make apfelwein with the original recipe and age it a year before drinking.
dogboysdad
Well-Known Member
I will keg mine tonight. I am adding two cans of concentrate, some potassium sorbate and will gas just like my beer. I'll give you a full report next weekend.
BTW, this was made with fresh-pressed cider from 2009.
BTW, this was made with fresh-pressed cider from 2009.
This is my first 5 gallons of Apfelwein. Before reading very far I started a batch all wrong. I used 2 lbs table sugar and 71b-1122 yeast. It bubbled like crazy for a few days then stopped. I checked the SG at 12 days and it was down at .995. I did a quick taste and no vinegar but very bad. Do you think it will taste ok? One post said it was watery with little taste. Has anyone had OK results with this yeast? How long should I wait to bottle? The normal, anything greater than 4 weeks?
After reading about 500 pages, today I started a second 1 gallon batch per Ed's recipe. Thanks Ed.
After reading about 500 pages, today I started a second 1 gallon batch per Ed's recipe. Thanks Ed.
Hegh
Well-Known Member
Did you sanitize everything? It shouldn't taste offensive at any point, so it sounds like something went wrong.
I find that cane sugar ferments out really rough, hot and almost medicinal tasting.
I would give your first batch longer than two more weeks, my eight batches have all taken between 5 and 7 weeks to really clear up. This should give the yeast time to clean up any unwanted by products and the taste a chance to smooth out some if the off taste is from the table sugar.
This would also give enough time that you could compare the taste to Ed's recipe.
Did you use the same brand of juice for both batches?
What did you use to sanitize?
I would give your first batch longer than two more weeks, my eight batches have all taken between 5 and 7 weeks to really clear up. This should give the yeast time to clean up any unwanted by products and the taste a chance to smooth out some if the off taste is from the table sugar.
This would also give enough time that you could compare the taste to Ed's recipe.
Did you use the same brand of juice for both batches?
What did you use to sanitize?
I bought the same apple juice from Costco (tree top). I used sodium metabisulfite 4 oz per gallon.
It is starting to clear, I tasted again yesterday and it is tasting more like wine. Should I spend the money for a ph meter or check the acidity (t.a.) and maybe add acid blend?
It is starting to clear, I tasted again yesterday and it is tasting more like wine. Should I spend the money for a ph meter or check the acidity (t.a.) and maybe add acid blend?
mtheis
New Member
After reading the first 200 pages (and counting) of this thread, the temptation to make this stuff was overwhelming. I made a 5 gallon batch today and followed the recipe to a T. Right before pitching the yeast, I took a gravity reading and found that it was only 1.054. From what I've read, it should be around 1.064 after adding 2 pounds of sugar. Looks like mine will end up around 7% instead of 8.5%. Any ideas as to why my gravity reading is so low?
I used 5 gallons Tree Top apple juice, 2 pounds corn sugar, and 1 packet of Montrachet.
I can't wait to try this stuff. Thanks Ed!
I used 5 gallons Tree Top apple juice, 2 pounds corn sugar, and 1 packet of Montrachet.
I can't wait to try this stuff. Thanks Ed!
Mine started at 1.058 and ended at .994; 8.5% ABV. I would not worry about it; as it is of course where it ends up that counts, and this thing seems to dry out very nicely!
mtheis
New Member
Thanks for your quick response. It put my mind at ease.
I think I'll have to add my 5 gallons to the running total. Ignore the porcelain fermenter on the left!
I think I'll have to add my 5 gallons to the running total. Ignore the porcelain fermenter on the left!
Glad to hear that the taste is improving.
I was curious about the sanitizer because of your strange taste comment. I have tried both Idophor and potassium metabisulphate as sanitizers, both left an after taste in my Apfelwein, still discernible to me after 9+ months. Starsan does not leave any after taste.
Not a clue about ph meters or t.a. Just getting started myself.
I was curious about the sanitizer because of your strange taste comment. I have tried both Idophor and potassium metabisulphate as sanitizers, both left an after taste in my Apfelwein, still discernible to me after 9+ months. Starsan does not leave any after taste.
Not a clue about ph meters or t.a. Just getting started myself.
MetallHed
Well-Known Member
Thanks for your quick response. It put my mind at ease.
I think I'll have to add my 5 gallons to the running total. Ignore the porcelain fermenter on the left!
Not that it matters to you now but for anyone else you dont need a blow-off for this.. it has no krausen, just a tiny layer of bubbles. A simple airlock will work..
...oh and it does smell like rhino farts from eating apples that have been sitting in the hot african sun all day. :cross:
mtheis
New Member
I added the blowoff because the carboy will be sitting in another room on white carpet until the tile is installed in the bathroom. It's better to be safe than sorry. I went ahead and added yeast nutrient as well. I'm no stranger to rhino farts, but I'd rather eliminate them if at all possible.
can we get an update at page 667??? I'm not reading all of it.. is the original recipe still the best? any upgrades? How does the different sugars and yeast come out? I read 20... I can't read 667!!! Any new COOL findings? Was the apple juice with vitamin C delicious, that's the one I got, I couldn't find the one recommended....
Nerdie, there are so many variables, and many opinions, but you can't go wrong with the original recipe on page one. My only suggestion is that once it ferments out, you may want to split the batch and carb half. I did this, not only carbing half but adding lactose to sweeten it up a bit. I just opened one of the carbed bottles last night, it poured like beer with a great light bubbly head and tasted much like a Hornsby. Delicious!
Ok, one more thing.... I just smoked some salmon on the Big Green Egg using mesquite wood chips soaked in ... (drum roll) ... EdWort's Apfelwein! The salmon was soaked for hours in a brown sugar/lemon/terriaki/garlic marinade, brushed with maple syrup and cajun rub before hitting the heat and smoke. The apple smoke flavor brought it to a new level!
brpruett
Active Member
It's been almost three months since I made two batches of Aepfelwein. Batches were identical with the exception of using Montrachet yeast in one and Ec-1118 (Pris de'Mousse) in the other. My conclusion is that the EC-1118 is the preferable yeast for those looking for the original German flavor. This conclusion is certainly true (to my mind) if you don't intend to age the aepfelwein for any significant length of time. Differences MAY arise as the products bottle-age and I will report on my findings as i sample bottles which have seen 6 months of aging.
The Montrachet batch took 2 months to ferment and clear. The Ec-1118 batch was fermented and clear at the end of three weeks. The Montrachet batch had a 'thinner' taste than the EC-1118 and was also less tangy. The EC-1118 had more apple character than the Montrachet.
I have plenty of aepfelwein experience, having lived in the heart of aepfelwein country for a decade and having helped friends make it from apples harvested from their private aepfelwein-designated orchards.
Bottom-line: When my wife (a native of Frankfurt where aepfelwein is preferred over beer) and I tasted the two batches, the EC-1118 batch prompted us to both say "this tastes just like Ebblewoi!" The Montrachet batch tasted "close" but not quite right.
Since i am fluent in German I am digging deep into the recommended practices of aepfelwein-producers. I may summarize my findings of what the pros do in a future posting.
I am also making additional batches for comparison purposes.
The Montrachet batch took 2 months to ferment and clear. The Ec-1118 batch was fermented and clear at the end of three weeks. The Montrachet batch had a 'thinner' taste than the EC-1118 and was also less tangy. The EC-1118 had more apple character than the Montrachet.
I have plenty of aepfelwein experience, having lived in the heart of aepfelwein country for a decade and having helped friends make it from apples harvested from their private aepfelwein-designated orchards.
Bottom-line: When my wife (a native of Frankfurt where aepfelwein is preferred over beer) and I tasted the two batches, the EC-1118 batch prompted us to both say "this tastes just like Ebblewoi!" The Montrachet batch tasted "close" but not quite right.
Since i am fluent in German I am digging deep into the recommended practices of aepfelwein-producers. I may summarize my findings of what the pros do in a future posting.
I am also making additional batches for comparison purposes.
david_the_greek
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hhhmmmmm I appear to have used to "wrong" yeast. My LHBS NEVER has montrachet and instead suggested Lalvin Bourgovin RC 212. Any opinions/concerns/comments?
How much honey and lactose did you use? I wonder how much that would change things...
I just had an apfelwein last night from a batch that has been aging for 8 months. Man was it good. I am glad I forgot about this batch!
I just had an apfelwein last night from a batch that has been aging for 8 months. Man was it good. I am glad I forgot about this batch!
chemman14
Well-Known Member
did you take a final gravity with the EC-1118? How was the taste? Did it still have that dry characteristic?
Ahhh, 650 pages to go through to learn how to make bembelsaft so I dont have to pay Possmann's to ship it here, this is great news, but before I start digging into this 4 year old posting, can anyone with any Sachsenhausen experience tell me how to make a wine that is similar to that sold by Adolf Wagner, it is cloudy and somewhat softer than the clear bottled versions, sightly less crisp,( the clear tastes soapy to my palate) and IMO, far more drinkable!
I am SOOOO jonesing for the stuff
thanks
a total homebrew newbie who is happy to have found this resource!
I am SOOOO jonesing for the stuff
thanks
a total homebrew newbie who is happy to have found this resource!
I am SOOO impressed, just 18 hours into the process, and my nouveau stoffche is bubbling away like crazy, emitting heavenly ebbelwoi odors all over the basement, how long do I have to wait?
Can it be drunk before the yeast clears?
Can it be drunk before the yeast clears?
